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Isn’t one of the central selling point of UBI that it would replace the existing welfare state with one single payment? What’s the likelihood that countries tha

Isn’t one of the central selling point of UBI that it would replace the existing welfare state with one single payment? What’s the likelihood that countries that implement this just tack it on the existing welfare state as yet another payment? I’m putting that is almost a certainty.

ginko 7y ago
> I’m putting that is almost a certainty. Why? States aren't made of infinite money.
- kaffeemitsahne 7y ago
  Actually...
- lordnacho 7y ago
  We're about to test whether they are. If we somehow manage to print all this money and nothing bad happens, then why not? I have some doubts about whether it can work, but if it does, we should think about the new economic reality. At the moment though, I get the image of Wily E Coyote running over the cliff edge, but he hasn't looked down yet.
  - HideousKojima 7y ago
    >We're about to test whether they are. If we somehow manage to print all this money and nothing bad happens, then why not? Fortunately, other states already have tried this, and shown that it causes immense economic harm. Specifically, we have the examples of Venezuela (53,798,500% inflation since 2016), Zimbabwe (peaked at 79,600,000,000% per month), and Weimar Germany (merely 29,500% per month at its peak). So you should be asking, what if we manage to print all this money and something truly terrible, horrible, and damaging to the lives of everyone in the country happens? And what if it's something easily predicted by almost any economist and with massive historical precedents? And what if it sets the stage for genocidal dictators and the most violent war in history, as it did in the case of Weimar Germany?
    - _nalply 7y ago
      Counterpoint: Quantitative easing. Instead of giving money to banks give them to the people.
      - HideousKojima 7y ago
        Quantitative Easing is the fed buying bonds, bonds that must be repaid. It's not free money, it's loans.
        _nalply 7y ago
        Right. I am somewhat clueless but this feels like the FED helping banks not people?

ginko 7y ago

> I’m putting that is almost a certainty. Why? States aren't made of infinite money.

kaffeemitsahne 7y ago
Actually...
lordnacho 7y ago
We're about to test whether they are. If we somehow manage to print all this money and nothing bad happens, then why not? I have some doubts about whether it can work, but if it does, we should think about the new economic reality. At the moment though, I get the image of Wily E Coyote running over the cliff edge, but he hasn't looked down yet.
- HideousKojima 7y ago
  >We're about to test whether they are. If we somehow manage to print all this money and nothing bad happens, then why not? Fortunately, other states already have tried this, and shown that it causes immense economic harm. Specifically, we have the examples of Venezuela (53,798,500% inflation since 2016), Zimbabwe (peaked at 79,600,000,000% per month), and Weimar Germany (merely 29,500% per month at its peak). So you should be asking, what if we manage to print all this money and something truly terrible, horrible, and damaging to the lives of everyone in the country happens? And what if it's something easily predicted by almost any economist and with massive historical precedents? And what if it sets the stage for genocidal dictators and the most violent war in history, as it did in the case of Weimar Germany?
  - _nalply 7y ago
    Counterpoint: Quantitative easing. Instead of giving money to banks give them to the people.
    - HideousKojima 7y ago
      Quantitative Easing is the fed buying bonds, bonds that must be repaid. It's not free money, it's loans.
      - _nalply 7y ago
        Right. I am somewhat clueless but this feels like the FED helping banks not people?