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Did you have an option to require account management on the website like Netflix, Hulu, etc. do to avoid the IAP fee? It’s not clear to me if small companies ar

Did you have an option to require account management on the website like Netflix, Hulu, etc. do to avoid the IAP fee? It’s not clear to me if small companies are allowed to do that.

scarface74 7y ago
Yes any company is allowed to do that. You can buy Udemy courses outside of the App Store. You have to buy access to ACloudGuru outside of the App Store.
- saurik 7y ago
  No. So, first off, even when this is allowed, the UI experience sucks, as you aren't allowed to help the user make the purchase from the app: the user has to go hunting on Google for the idea they can make an external purchase. > Apps and their metadata may not include buttons, external links, or other calls to action that direct customers to purchasing mechanisms other than in-app purchase. But like, while you might think it is allowed--due to the existence of some apps like Netflix and Udemy--those apps are in explicitly exempted content-catalog oriented product categories, such as movies and online education. > Apps may allow a user to access previously purchased content or content subscriptions (specifically: magazines, newspapers, books, audio, music, video, access to professional databases, VoIP, cloud storage, and approved services such as classroom management apps), provided that you agree not to directly or indirectly target iOS users to use a purchasing method other than in-app purchase, and your general communications about other purchasing methods are not designed to discourage use of in-app purchase.
  - scarface74 7y ago
    It’s not just those. I worked for a B2B company before where we had contracts with major hospitals. You could download our app “for free” but you had to have an existing deal with our company. There are also apps like Office, GSuite, and those from Adobe where you buy your license out of band.
    - saurik 7y ago
      Sometimes Apple doesn't notice and sometimes Apple makes explicit exceptions; however, such "treatment of Developers is neither fair nor consistent" (and is something you aren't really going to find out about until after you plunk down the development costs on your app, at which point Apple pretty much has you hostage). I have, to be very clear about this, been in a call with Apple App Store reviewers explicitly running my nose in this clause and then, when I am all "but but but what about XYZ???" they simply tell me they will add XYZ back to their review queue to see if it is in compliance and whether or not it should be removed from the Store.
      - scarface74 7y ago
        How could Apple not “notice” that an app won’t let you get pass the login screen without a paid subscription.
        saagarjha 7y ago
        Only Apple can answer that, but it’s probably because App Store review is extremely inconsistent.
        scarface74 7y ago
        After 7 years and multiple updates no one “noticed”?
        saagarjha 7y ago
        That's what App Store review wants you to think…
      - saurik 7y ago
        (I just reread this comment and it is driving me crazy that I didn't catch the typo of "rubbing my nose in" as "running" and feel the need to leave a correction ;P.)
    - 7y ago
  - pentae 7y ago
    This is the kind of answer from someone who speaks with actual experience. Most users are trained to just head straight to the App Store to download your product even when they discover your app on web so if theres no in app onboarding your funnel completely falls apart
    - scarface74 7y ago
      In that case, how do you explain the dozens of apps that I can list personally that do require out of band subscriptions? This isn’t just major brands. One that comes to mind is ACloudGuru.
      - pentae 7y ago
        It's because Apple have either intentionally turned a blind eye to these companies or they have managed to sneak it past the app store review team. https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ Section 3.1.1 In-App Purchase: If you want to unlock features or functionality within your app, (by way of example: subscriptions, in-game currencies, game levels, access to premium content, or unlocking a full version), you must use in-app purchase. Apps may not use their own mechanisms to unlock content or functionality, such as license keys, augmented reality markers, QR codes, etc. Apps and their metadata may not include buttons, external links, or other calls to action that direct customers to purchasing mechanisms other than in-app purchase. So you're actually proving the point that their review system is neither fair nor consistent with your crusade in here. Also don't forget about survivorship bias. For every app you see that does this thousands of others got forced to use IAP during the review process.
        scarface74 7y ago
        So you’re saying that the app reviewers “overlooked” - Sling, DirecTVNow, Microsoft Office, Hulu Live TV (not regular Hulu), Youtube TV, Spotify, ACloudGuru, the Kindle App, ComicXology, Netflix, Plex, etc. What’s more likely, your interpretation is wrong or reality?

Did you have an option to require account management on the website like Netflix, Hulu, etc. do to avoid the IAP fee? It’s not clear to me if small companies are allowed to do that.

scarface74 7y ago

Yes any company is allowed to do that. You can buy Udemy courses outside of the App Store. You have to buy access to ACloudGuru outside of the App Store.

saurik 7y ago
No. So, first off, even when this is allowed, the UI experience sucks, as you aren't allowed to help the user make the purchase from the app: the user has to go hunting on Google for the idea they can make an external purchase. > Apps and their metadata may not include buttons, external links, or other calls to action that direct customers to purchasing mechanisms other than in-app purchase. But like, while you might think it is allowed--due to the existence of some apps like Netflix and Udemy--those apps are in explicitly exempted content-catalog oriented product categories, such as movies and online education. > Apps may allow a user to access previously purchased content or content subscriptions (specifically: magazines, newspapers, books, audio, music, video, access to professional databases, VoIP, cloud storage, and approved services such as classroom management apps), provided that you agree not to directly or indirectly target iOS users to use a purchasing method other than in-app purchase, and your general communications about other purchasing methods are not designed to discourage use of in-app purchase.
- scarface74 7y ago
  It’s not just those. I worked for a B2B company before where we had contracts with major hospitals. You could download our app “for free” but you had to have an existing deal with our company. There are also apps like Office, GSuite, and those from Adobe where you buy your license out of band.
  - saurik 7y ago
    Sometimes Apple doesn't notice and sometimes Apple makes explicit exceptions; however, such "treatment of Developers is neither fair nor consistent" (and is something you aren't really going to find out about until after you plunk down the development costs on your app, at which point Apple pretty much has you hostage). I have, to be very clear about this, been in a call with Apple App Store reviewers explicitly running my nose in this clause and then, when I am all "but but but what about XYZ???" they simply tell me they will add XYZ back to their review queue to see if it is in compliance and whether or not it should be removed from the Store.
    - scarface74 7y ago
      How could Apple not “notice” that an app won’t let you get pass the login screen without a paid subscription.
      - saagarjha 7y ago
        Only Apple can answer that, but it’s probably because App Store review is extremely inconsistent.
        scarface74 7y ago
        After 7 years and multiple updates no one “noticed”?
        saagarjha 7y ago
        That's what App Store review wants you to think…
    - saurik 7y ago
      (I just reread this comment and it is driving me crazy that I didn't catch the typo of "rubbing my nose in" as "running" and feel the need to leave a correction ;P.)
  - 7y ago
- pentae 7y ago
  This is the kind of answer from someone who speaks with actual experience. Most users are trained to just head straight to the App Store to download your product even when they discover your app on web so if theres no in app onboarding your funnel completely falls apart
  - scarface74 7y ago
    In that case, how do you explain the dozens of apps that I can list personally that do require out of band subscriptions? This isn’t just major brands. One that comes to mind is ACloudGuru.
    - pentae 7y ago
      It's because Apple have either intentionally turned a blind eye to these companies or they have managed to sneak it past the app store review team. https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ Section 3.1.1 In-App Purchase: If you want to unlock features or functionality within your app, (by way of example: subscriptions, in-game currencies, game levels, access to premium content, or unlocking a full version), you must use in-app purchase. Apps may not use their own mechanisms to unlock content or functionality, such as license keys, augmented reality markers, QR codes, etc. Apps and their metadata may not include buttons, external links, or other calls to action that direct customers to purchasing mechanisms other than in-app purchase. So you're actually proving the point that their review system is neither fair nor consistent with your crusade in here. Also don't forget about survivorship bias. For every app you see that does this thousands of others got forced to use IAP during the review process.
      - scarface74 7y ago
        So you’re saying that the app reviewers “overlooked” - Sling, DirecTVNow, Microsoft Office, Hulu Live TV (not regular Hulu), Youtube TV, Spotify, ACloudGuru, the Kindle App, ComicXology, Netflix, Plex, etc. What’s more likely, your interpretation is wrong or reality?