3 ms·

This is yet more propaganda. If you want to know how to wear a medical mask, you can find out on YouTube. It's not rocket science. Yes, without a professiona

This is yet more propaganda. If you want to know how to wear a medical mask, you can find out on YouTube. It's not rocket science. Yes, without a professional fit test, you may not get an absolutely perfect seal, but you can do a quick pressure check by exhaling and feeling whether the mask is holding pressure. If you do this pressure check you will be getting very substantial protection from the mask. You wearing a mask is not taking anything away from anyone. It is rational protection. Many people have (non medical, but N95 or similar) masks sitting in their garage. Those masks are not doing anyone any good sitting around. If you have masks and are going out not wearing them, you are putting healthcare workers lives at risk, because you could be spreading or contracting the virus. You or someone else will then go to the hospital and potentially infect a healthcare worker. The best way to protect that healthcare worker is not to give them a mask, it's not to expose them in the first place. If you want to donate them, that's a great thing, but the main thing is that masks should be worn, not gathering dust. If everyone had been wearing masks for the past month, we wouldn't be in this situation. Let's not perpetuate the nonsense.

timr 7y ago
"This is yet more propaganda." Exactly who am I propagandizing? Doctors? "You wearing a mask is not taking anything away from anyone." We have a mask shortage in hospitals. You are literally taking masks from people who need them more. "It is rational protection." For the medical professionals who need them, yes. For you, it's overkill. "Many people have (non medical, but N95 or similar) masks sitting in their garage." They should be donating those to hospitals, ASAP. *"The best way to protect that healthcare worker is not to give them a mask, it's not to expose them in the first place." The best way to protect health care workers who do not have masks, today, is to give them masks. The second best way is to stay home. The third best way is to wash your hands. The fourth best way is to not touch your face. Way, way down the list is "wear a mask", and like the guidelines say, not a medical one.
- redwall_hp 7y ago
  I'm going to add that retail workers should have adequate PPE as well. Not only is it an unreasonable personal risk otherwise, but it's a major means of spread.
  - cameldrv 7y ago
    Yes, retail workers are the unsung heroes of this crisis. They should all have as much protection as a physician. A cashier deals with 200+ customers per shift. With the current infection rate, they have a very real chance of being infected every single day they show up to work. They're being rewarded with, if they're lucky, an extra $16 per shift. If you have extra masks, leave one as a tip to your cashier if he/she is unmasked. You might save their life.
- cameldrv 7y ago
  No. This is more propaganda. Research studies on SARS show that wearing an N95 mask reduces your chances of contracting SARS by 91%. In March, 1 of every 1000 Americans had a confirmed case of COVID. In April, it might be 1 out of 40. For confirmed cases, given that testing is mostly restricted to people appearing at the hospital, I estimate the fatality rate is 7%. That means that in April, you may have a 0.2% chance of dying from COVID. If you wear a mask consistently, that goes down to 0.02%. If you assume you have 40 years left to live, if you're maskless, COVID will reduce your life expectancy by 1 month. If you have an N95 mask that you wear consistently, COVID will reduce your life expectancy by 3 days. Wearing an N95 mask in April increases your life expectancy by 27 days. By contrast, wearing a seatbelt over the next month, statistically increases your life expectancy by about 0.2 days. Over the next month, wearing an N95 mask is about 130x more important than wearing a seatbelt. All of this discounts the massive other benefits from not being infected: No long-term lung damage. All of the people you don't infect because you didn't get infected. No infecting healthcare workers. No contributing to the overload of the healthcare system. Plus, wearing a mask, even if you do get infected, you're much less likely to infect other people, which has a cascading effect. The point is: If you have access to a mask, it's vitally important that you start wearing it if you go out. Still, don't go out unless absolutely necessary! Minimize contact! Especially for essential workers though like grocery store employees, delivery workers, etc, wear a mask!
  - timr 7y ago
    Research studies on SARS show that wearing an N95 mask reduces your chances of contracting SARS by 91%. OK, cite it.
    - cameldrv 7y ago
      Gladly. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2190272/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2190272/ Table 6. This is a Cochrane review BTW, the gold standard in evidence based medicine.
      - timr 7y ago
DanBC 7y ago
> It's not rocket science. Tell us how to correctly don and doff a surgical mask, or a filter, and we can tell you how many steps you got wrong.
- exolymph 7y ago
  Do you sincerely believe that people are so stupid that even if you give them instructions, wearing masks will be a net negative?
  - DanBC 7y ago
    It's not about whether people are stupid or not. It's that donning and doffing PPE is difficult. We know that qualified, registered, trained, healthcare professionals struggle with it. Already in this thread we've seen someone post a link to a video about putting on and taking off a face mask and that video had incorrect, dangerous, procedure. This video shows him using bare hands to touch the front of his mask to take it off. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22776002 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22776002 Literature suggests that 80% of HCP infection is caused by incorrect doffing https://twitter.com/drbencb/status/1236635924274057216?s=20 https://twitter.com/drbencb/status/1236635924274057216?s=20 https://twitter.com/cmac_evans/status/1236689340123754496?s=20 https://twitter.com/cmac_evans/status/1236689340123754496?s=... Because it's so hard we see healthcare settings strongly encouraging "dofficers" / "spotters" -- a second person to watch you taking off your PPE to make sure you're doing it right. https://twitter.com/heatherevansmd/status/1244432369622417410?s=20 https://twitter.com/heatherevansmd/status/124443236962241741... https://twitter.com/Dolores_McKeen/status/1244327891430707202?s=20 https://twitter.com/Dolores_McKeen/status/124432789143070720...
    - wavepruner 7y ago
      People who do not work in healthcare are perfectly capable of learning how to doff properly. Qualifications and training in ancillary issues does not matter. Training in mask donning/doffing is what matters, and anyone can be trained in this. Most people have someone in their life they can ask to spot them as they practice removing their mask. Also, wouldn't washing/disinfecting your hands after improper doffing prevent self-contamination?

timr 7y ago

"This is yet more propaganda." Exactly who am I propagandizing? Doctors? "You wearing a mask is not taking anything away from anyone." We have a mask shortage in hospitals. You are literally taking masks from people who need them more. "It is rational protection." For the medical professionals who need them, yes. For you, it's overkill. "Many people have (non medical, but N95 or similar) masks sitting in their garage." They should be donating those to hospitals, ASAP. *"The best way to protect that healthcare worker is not to give them a mask, it's not to expose them in the first place." The best way to protect health care workers who do not have masks, today, is to give them masks. The second best way is to stay home. The third best way is to wash your hands. The fourth best way is to not touch your face. Way, way down the list is "wear a mask", and like the guidelines say, not a medical one.

redwall_hp 7y ago
I'm going to add that retail workers should have adequate PPE as well. Not only is it an unreasonable personal risk otherwise, but it's a major means of spread.
- cameldrv 7y ago
  Yes, retail workers are the unsung heroes of this crisis. They should all have as much protection as a physician. A cashier deals with 200+ customers per shift. With the current infection rate, they have a very real chance of being infected every single day they show up to work. They're being rewarded with, if they're lucky, an extra $16 per shift. If you have extra masks, leave one as a tip to your cashier if he/she is unmasked. You might save their life.
cameldrv 7y ago
No. This is more propaganda. Research studies on SARS show that wearing an N95 mask reduces your chances of contracting SARS by 91%. In March, 1 of every 1000 Americans had a confirmed case of COVID. In April, it might be 1 out of 40. For confirmed cases, given that testing is mostly restricted to people appearing at the hospital, I estimate the fatality rate is 7%. That means that in April, you may have a 0.2% chance of dying from COVID. If you wear a mask consistently, that goes down to 0.02%. If you assume you have 40 years left to live, if you're maskless, COVID will reduce your life expectancy by 1 month. If you have an N95 mask that you wear consistently, COVID will reduce your life expectancy by 3 days. Wearing an N95 mask in April increases your life expectancy by 27 days. By contrast, wearing a seatbelt over the next month, statistically increases your life expectancy by about 0.2 days. Over the next month, wearing an N95 mask is about 130x more important than wearing a seatbelt. All of this discounts the massive other benefits from not being infected: No long-term lung damage. All of the people you don't infect because you didn't get infected. No infecting healthcare workers. No contributing to the overload of the healthcare system. Plus, wearing a mask, even if you do get infected, you're much less likely to infect other people, which has a cascading effect. The point is: If you have access to a mask, it's vitally important that you start wearing it if you go out. Still, don't go out unless absolutely necessary! Minimize contact! Especially for essential workers though like grocery store employees, delivery workers, etc, wear a mask!
- timr 7y ago
  Research studies on SARS show that wearing an N95 mask reduces your chances of contracting SARS by 91%. OK, cite it.
  - cameldrv 7y ago
    Gladly. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2190272/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2190272/ Table 6. This is a Cochrane review BTW, the gold standard in evidence based medicine.
    - timr 7y ago

DanBC 7y ago

> It's not rocket science. Tell us how to correctly don and doff a surgical mask, or a filter, and we can tell you how many steps you got wrong.

exolymph 7y ago
Do you sincerely believe that people are so stupid that even if you give them instructions, wearing masks will be a net negative?
- DanBC 7y ago
  It's not about whether people are stupid or not. It's that donning and doffing PPE is difficult. We know that qualified, registered, trained, healthcare professionals struggle with it. Already in this thread we've seen someone post a link to a video about putting on and taking off a face mask and that video had incorrect, dangerous, procedure. This video shows him using bare hands to touch the front of his mask to take it off. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22776002 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22776002 Literature suggests that 80% of HCP infection is caused by incorrect doffing https://twitter.com/drbencb/status/1236635924274057216?s=20 https://twitter.com/drbencb/status/1236635924274057216?s=20 https://twitter.com/cmac_evans/status/1236689340123754496?s=20 https://twitter.com/cmac_evans/status/1236689340123754496?s=... Because it's so hard we see healthcare settings strongly encouraging "dofficers" / "spotters" -- a second person to watch you taking off your PPE to make sure you're doing it right. https://twitter.com/heatherevansmd/status/1244432369622417410?s=20 https://twitter.com/heatherevansmd/status/124443236962241741... https://twitter.com/Dolores_McKeen/status/1244327891430707202?s=20 https://twitter.com/Dolores_McKeen/status/124432789143070720...
  - wavepruner 7y ago
    People who do not work in healthcare are perfectly capable of learning how to doff properly. Qualifications and training in ancillary issues does not matter. Training in mask donning/doffing is what matters, and anyone can be trained in this. Most people have someone in their life they can ask to spot them as they practice removing their mask. Also, wouldn't washing/disinfecting your hands after improper doffing prevent self-contamination?