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And this is precisely why we need still more posts. You know why we don't need a "benefits of being a male software engineer" post? Because every day is a "ben

And this is precisely why we need still more posts. You know why we don't need a "benefits of being a male software engineer" post? Because every day is a "benefits of being a male software engineer" day for male software engineers. You should probably have a read of http://amptoons.com/blog/the-male-privilege-checklist/ http://amptoons.com/blog/the-male-privilege-checklist/ . As a rule when it comes to this sort of material, if it makes you feel uncomfortable and defensive, please think about why this is before commenting. I'd love to see a post about "benefits of being a male social worker", or any other female-dominated field! As a feminist (3rd wave), I don't think equality is possible without addressing the problems faced by men, as well as women. Men in such jobs are routinely mocked by other men and subjected to ridicule by our masculine culture society. And that sucks.

thenomad 16y ago
Oh, no, please not Derailing For Dummies. It'll certainly reduce the number of replies you get, but not in a good way...
- FeministHacker 16y ago
  As a sign of good faith in the community here, I've removed the link for now :)
yummyfajitas 16y ago
I admit, I haven't read the entire checklist. When the first item on it is blatantly wrong, I kind of got turned off. Go read about the advantages women have in hiring in the sciences: http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=12062&page=R1 http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=12062&page=R1 Anecdotally, women are also given advantages in big corporate IT, but I'm not aware of any studies. Corporations are generally loath to give away data on stuff like this, who knows what lawsuits it might bring. I only skimmed the rest, but I found 14) particularly amusing. The politicians who stole my lunch [1], my freedom and my money all have a penis (just like me). This is a privilege how? [1] In Jersey City, where I live and work, Steven Fulops chased away the food trucks to protect subway.
- FeministHacker 16y ago
  The list is a generalisation across all fields, so discounting it based on how something might not be true in your field is a bit short-sighted. #1 is true still for many fields. Of course, the link you provided wasn't for the general tech sector - it was specific to universities, which have other aspects in play. Even within the general tech sector, there are plenty of reports of questionable hiring practices. I've found to be not uncommon for my gender (female) to be an issue during interviews, and we've seen posts here in the past about this subject. Further, women are often moved rapidly into management roles, and their technical abilities treated as suspect. And yes, I'm speaking as something big corporate IT, and it's no better. Just looking across at our large (40+) server support teams, you can count the number of women on one hand. The application support teams here are slightly better, but only just. We're a typical shared services company in the UK, and our competitors are all very similar. As for 14, you've found a truth about privilege lists - they might not always be things you like.
  - yummyfajitas 16y ago
    Which fields is #1 true for? Regardless, I'll assume you are right. Points 1-3 are irrelevant for the conversation we are having here (about women in tech), so I'll keep reading. 4) is a matter of whether you personally adopt a collectivist viewpoint or not. If women disproportionately adopt collectivist viewpoints, why is that anyone's fault besides their own? 5) is probably on point. 6) may be true in general, but (much like 1-3) it seems false in tech. Consider Leah Culver - "ooh, a girl that can program, and hot", as opposed to "meh, barely competent". 7-14) may be true, but are similarly irrelevant to a conversation about women in tech. Also, you still haven't explained how 14 is a "privilege". How does Obama's penis benefit me, relative to a woman?
    - khafra 16y ago
      On 14, the failure mode is called "not carving reality at the joints." Because .00001% of men wield large amounts of political power, whereas even fewer women (at least, visibly) do so, political power is a male privilege. There are certainly reference classes for "likely to wield political power" that change the likelihood ratio by far more than "male."
jimbokun 16y ago
"7. If I’m a teen or adult, and if I can stay out of prison, my odds of being raped are relatively low. (More). 8. On average, I am taught to fear walking alone after dark in average public spaces much less than my female counterparts are." First, those are two pretty big caveats, especially considering how the vast majority of people in prisons are men. Second, I'm pretty sure males are far more likely to be the victims of violence than females. So while these individual claims may be true, it seems to ignore the bigger picture. Maybe there are some legitimate points in this list, but for the most part I think this is an example of the "make so many accusations that none of your readers will have the time or energy to go through and refute all of them" school of writing.

thenomad 16y ago

Oh, no, please not Derailing For Dummies. It'll certainly reduce the number of replies you get, but not in a good way...

FeministHacker 16y ago
As a sign of good faith in the community here, I've removed the link for now :)

yummyfajitas 16y ago

I admit, I haven't read the entire checklist. When the first item on it is blatantly wrong, I kind of got turned off. Go read about the advantages women have in hiring in the sciences: http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=12062&page=R1 http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=12062&page=R1 Anecdotally, women are also given advantages in big corporate IT, but I'm not aware of any studies. Corporations are generally loath to give away data on stuff like this, who knows what lawsuits it might bring. I only skimmed the rest, but I found 14) particularly amusing. The politicians who stole my lunch [1], my freedom and my money all have a penis (just like me). This is a privilege how? [1] In Jersey City, where I live and work, Steven Fulops chased away the food trucks to protect subway.

FeministHacker 16y ago
The list is a generalisation across all fields, so discounting it based on how something might not be true in your field is a bit short-sighted. #1 is true still for many fields. Of course, the link you provided wasn't for the general tech sector - it was specific to universities, which have other aspects in play. Even within the general tech sector, there are plenty of reports of questionable hiring practices. I've found to be not uncommon for my gender (female) to be an issue during interviews, and we've seen posts here in the past about this subject. Further, women are often moved rapidly into management roles, and their technical abilities treated as suspect. And yes, I'm speaking as something big corporate IT, and it's no better. Just looking across at our large (40+) server support teams, you can count the number of women on one hand. The application support teams here are slightly better, but only just. We're a typical shared services company in the UK, and our competitors are all very similar. As for 14, you've found a truth about privilege lists - they might not always be things you like.
- yummyfajitas 16y ago
  Which fields is #1 true for? Regardless, I'll assume you are right. Points 1-3 are irrelevant for the conversation we are having here (about women in tech), so I'll keep reading. 4) is a matter of whether you personally adopt a collectivist viewpoint or not. If women disproportionately adopt collectivist viewpoints, why is that anyone's fault besides their own? 5) is probably on point. 6) may be true in general, but (much like 1-3) it seems false in tech. Consider Leah Culver - "ooh, a girl that can program, and hot", as opposed to "meh, barely competent". 7-14) may be true, but are similarly irrelevant to a conversation about women in tech. Also, you still haven't explained how 14 is a "privilege". How does Obama's penis benefit me, relative to a woman?
  - khafra 16y ago
    On 14, the failure mode is called "not carving reality at the joints." Because .00001% of men wield large amounts of political power, whereas even fewer women (at least, visibly) do so, political power is a male privilege. There are certainly reference classes for "likely to wield political power" that change the likelihood ratio by far more than "male."

jimbokun 16y ago

"7. If I’m a teen or adult, and if I can stay out of prison, my odds of being raped are relatively low. (More). 8. On average, I am taught to fear walking alone after dark in average public spaces much less than my female counterparts are." First, those are two pretty big caveats, especially considering how the vast majority of people in prisons are men. Second, I'm pretty sure males are far more likely to be the victims of violence than females. So while these individual claims may be true, it seems to ignore the bigger picture. Maybe there are some legitimate points in this list, but for the most part I think this is an example of the "make so many accusations that none of your readers will have the time or energy to go through and refute all of them" school of writing.