6 ms·

It's OK that your 'belief' contradicts official WHO guidance but that 'MASKS-NO MASKS' graph went a bit too far as a misstatement (i.e. "presenting facts in an

It's OK that your 'belief' contradicts official WHO guidance but that 'MASKS-NO MASKS' graph went a bit too far as a misstatement (i.e. "presenting facts in an alternative way"). Let me paste the official advice here for educating readers: https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/advice-for-public/when-and-how-to-use-masks https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2... > If you are healthy, you only need to wear a mask if you are taking care of a person with suspected 2019-nCoV infection. > Wear a mask if you are coughing or sneezing. > Masks are effective only when used in combination with frequent hand-cleaning with alcohol-based hand rub or soap and water. > If you wear a mask, then you must know how to use it and dispose of it properly. The kind of misinforming you are doing is dangerous in these times, especially that the official WHO standpoint is that wearing masks in a wrong way (using it multiple times, touching or taking off in a wrong way) is worse than not wearing them at all during already decreased social encounters (i.e. already staying at home, and going out at most for groceries). Or are you stating that the WHO is lying? Those Asian cultures have a different epidemic curve not due to mask wearing, but because a totally different social structure, prior experience concerning epidemics, preparedness, attitude towards authority & emergency measures and other factors. So it's a fallacy of cherry picking to say that it's 'because they wear masks and all our authorities are wrong'.

cmrx64 7y ago
> Or are you stating that the WHO is lying? yes, the page does indeed state that. what do you think of the cited research, vs nitpicking the hero image?
- gombosg 7y ago
  Out of the 7 references, most of them are journalistic articles and not actual scientific research. The question is 'does wearing masks out in the public decrease virus spread, when social distancing measures are already in effect?'. One linked (not cited...) research examines virus transmission and effects of mask use in a hospital setting - irrelevant for the question. Another examines filtration properties of homemade masks, and concludes that they have little if any effect if not used with other measures, and doesn't (!!!) recommend their use. A third one, a SCMP journalistic article refers to a Chinese scientific journal article that has been retracted. I don't find these as very compelling arguments.
  - cmrx64 7y ago
    https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/1HLrm0pqBN_5bdyysOeoOBX4pt4oFDBhsC_jpblXpNtQ/mobilebasic https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/1HLrm0pqBN_5bdyysOeoO... (linked on the page) was what I was referring to, not the list of references which I agree are not very compelling. SSC did a writeup too: https://slatestarcodex.com/2020/03/23/face-masks-much-more-than-you-wanted-to-know/ https://slatestarcodex.com/2020/03/23/face-masks-much-more-t... Thanks for sharing more detailed thoughts!
javagram 7y ago
WHO’s statement itself says that the mask is helpful when you are caring for someone with a suspected infection, therefore it admits the mask can provide some level of infection protection. It likewise says the mask should be worn by someone coughing or sneezing, showing that it protects others from your germs. The obvious answer to the “wearing masks in a wrong way” is to teach people to use and dispose of them correctly, just like we don’t dismiss hand washing because many people don’t know how to do it. I think these statements by health authorities are simply because there has been no RCT of mask wearing among the general public and for them lack of evidence is equivalent to evidence of absence.
- usrusr 7y ago
  The decision to treat absence of evidence as evidence of absence is surely driven by evidence of absence of masks, if you pardon the pun. It's very reasonable to prioritize healthcare workers who are far more exposed than anybody else and the lack of formal, peer reviewed studies is a welcome opportunity to subdue a panic buying bidding war. If truth was the only concern, I think that comparing the rough numbers between "masked countries" and "unmasked countries" should be more than enough to recommend masks. It's a planet-wide experiment and the control group is clearly seeing worse results. And it's not just SEA countries, there are also places in Europe that didn't play down masks, like the Czech Republic. And their metrics are looking quite good so far, with far more liberal measures than in neighboring Bavaria, except for the masks. With much of the intra-European spread being incubated in ski resorts one would expect them to be hit quite hard as well. And the Czech Republic doesn't have a magical stockpile either, from what I'm reading there's a lot of improvisation going on there regarding masks. Speaking of improvised masks, would vacuum cleaner bags be a good MacGuyver material that's present in almost any household? It's surely better at filtering than random t-shirt cloth, but would there be a risk of ruining lungs with fibers from the bag material? The fact that they are apparently safe to force air through them in living quarters with a two kilowatts blower suggests that they don't shed anything harmful, but I'd be glad to hear any counterarguments from the wide variety of expertise present in hn readership.
  - nullc 7y ago
wwweston 7y ago
Here's what makes sense to me: * The single most effective intervention we have right now is staying home and avoiding every unnecessary contact, as authorities recommend. * Worn carefully, several kinds of masks probably have a range of marginal positive effects. * BUT recommending them runs the risk of (a) people over-relying on them and not following isolation protocols (b) people wearing them incorrectly for a mix of less effective benefits and added risks (c) contributing to a run on masks which constrains supply for medical workers where the benefits are more critical. If this is all true, it can simultaneously be the case that official guidelines against masks are reasonable recommendations and that it's also a reasonable recommendation to wear masks (on top of other more important precautions). I'm sure that masks are not the sole factor in gentler curves in those countries. They do seem to be a common factor.
- gombosg 7y ago
  I totally agree and it's likely that the public will be much better equipped after this pandemic ends. So all of us will have a box of disposable masks at home, and will be educated about when and how to wear them properly. Right now, the average person probably only has 1 or at most a few masks, they don't dispose of them after use and probably wear (put on/off) them in a wrong way.
  - oefrha 7y ago
    You know, you could have learned how to put on a mask properly within the time period you spent arguing here. It’s not fucking rocket science.
    - JCharante 7y ago
      I was recently on a flight where a person on my row had difficulties taking her seatbelt off. After what seemed like two minutes the flight attendant assisted her. I'll even admit that it sometimes takes me a second to do it correctly when I try to only take it off with one hand. Despite this we still recommend that people use their seatbelts. In addition to this we play videos that instruct people on the usage of seatbelts. Imagine if we argued against recommending seatbelts because of the lack of education on using them despite never having attempted to explain how to use them.
Phlogistique 7y ago
Hi, Your comment fails to offer a counter-argument to the comment you are replying to; you are just repeating the position that the comment explicitly refutes. > Or are you stating that the WHO is lying? In fact, the site linked in the comment explicitly states that.
- ampersandy 7y ago
  It refutes nothing — it's some layperson's uneducated opinion based on a couple of cherry picked statistics (as gombosg already pointed out). Let the epidemiologists guiding global responses to the pandemic provide guidance and everyone else should call out anyone trying to peddle their own made up conclusions.
oefrha 7y ago
> Those Asian cultures have a different epidemic curve not due to mask wearing, but because a totally different social structure, prior experience concerning epidemics, preparedness, attitude towards authority & emergency measures and other factors. So it's a fallacy of cherry picking to say that it's 'because they wear masks and all our authorities are wrong'. And you’re not cherry-picking because what exactly?
- ampersandy 7y ago
  Pointing out that there are a huge number of other factors that influence the spread of COVID-19 in each country is not cherry-picking, it's highlighting that you can't simply look at said graph and say "it's because they wear masks."
  - oefrha 7y ago
    Saying the difference is due to other factors but “not due to mask wearing” is cherry-picking everything else other than mask wearing.
piokoch 7y ago
It is not that WHO is lying, it can be misinformed or just do not know something. Previous global epidemic happened over 100 years ago, so I don't blame them for lack of knowledge. We all have to learn and try new things, so if WHO says "mask are not helping" while there are evidences (maybe just correlation, but we just don't know for now!) that in some countries masks seems to help we should ask WHO if they are really sure. BTW: the fact that WHO pretends that Taiwan does not exists does not help investigating masks/no masks question. "Wear a mask if you are coughing or sneezing" - sure, the problem is that even if someone breaths normally, talks normally can spread the virus. The problem with the coronavirus is that it has long incubation time. Someone might spread virus without having any symptoms. My masks protects someone else, not me (unless I am wearing some pro stuff), as I am not spreading virus 2 meters around me, but 50 cm - maybe this is not that much, but in case of something that spreads according to power laws it might be a visible factor.
- lorenzhs 7y ago
  So the WHO doesn't know but some random techies on a forum do? That's absurd.
  - oefrha 7y ago
    Some random techies on a forum, as well as East Asian governments and medical experts. But hey, what do they know.
    - lorenzhs 7y ago
      But it's not an East Asian government or a medical expert who made the website that started this thread, is it? It's fasteddie31003, whose HN profile reads "Software engineer in San Francisco." Leave the medical advice to medical experts, just as you expect the medical experts to keep their mouths shut about the advantages of Rust over Go or whether Vue is the right choice in 2020.
      - oefrha 7y ago
factsaresacred 7y ago
> contradicts official WHO guidance A few weeks ago official WHO guidance included: - that there was "no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission" of the virus - that international air travel should not be suspended "because of the social disruption they cause and the intensive use of resources required" (nothing about the efficacy of such a move). Well look at us now. Maybe, just maybe, their guidance on this topic is also flawed. The lack of critical thinking on the issue of masks is astonishing. There are study after study[0] showing that masks mitigate the transfer of virus particles. Then there's common sense which points in the same direction. --- https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3810906/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3810906/ https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712%2808%2901008-4/fulltext https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712%2808%2901008-4... https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(03)13168-6/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6...
- fiblye 7y ago
  God, I was so annoyed reading WHO statements and people quoting them as an authority when this first started to blow up in China. The numbers quickly went from dozens to hundreds, and they still tried saying there was no chance of human-to-human transmission (pretty unlikely that they all ate the same food and that a virus with the main symptom being coughing isn't transmitted by coughing) and that it'd all be contained and there was no need to worry. In this crisis, the WHO has been bending over so far backwards that it's spinning donuts to serve as a political mouthpiece for certain governments. There was panic over people being under-supplied and under-prepared, and one of the main supplies in short supply was masks. Masks aren't perfect, but even if they're reducing transmission by 10% and keeping people from touching their mouth, that's a decent effect.
sbr464 7y ago
I think saying “misinforming”, “dangerous”, or relying solely on the generic guidance of the WHO is a bit strong. I think common sense prevails. Wearing equipment that filters airborne particulates will expose a person less than going without. Personally, I would prefer being overprotected versus becoming a statistic in a WHO researcher’s Excel spreadsheet.
- rndgermandude 7y ago
  "Common sense" leads to empty aisles that are usually stocked with toilet paper.
  - sbr464 7y ago
    I think that points more to how fragile the world economy is. You have a personal choice where you can do everything to increase your chances of survival, or go with common/generic advice that’s provided to society as a whole. I guess it depends on what your goals are.
    - rndgermandude 7y ago
      My goal is not to be an asshole, and to survive too, by listening to people who actually know their shit instead of using their "common sense" to guess. If we relied on common sense, the earth would still be flat, and we'd still prohibit women on their period from pickling food.
      - mantap 7y ago
        Mask wearing is mandatory in several countries. This is not a situation where people are making shit up, this is a situation where you have several authorities saying different things. In the absence of solid evidence, applying common sense to evaluate the arguments of those authorities is a lot better than just picking one of the authorities and proclaiming "This is the truth!"
blackrock 7y ago
A grocery store aisle is about 4 feet wide. Given the minimum 6 feet of social distancing, then there is no room for maneuvering around people here. And all it takes is for one idiot to cough in your face without covering themselves, while you are walking past them, to get sick. And now, you have a 14 day incubation window, to wait to see if you indeed got sick from this person. The point of masks is that everyone must wear it, while in public. No exceptions are allowed. This is a team effort. And all it takes is one person, to screw it up for everyone.
- DanBC 7y ago
  If someone coughs in your face then you're probably going to get infected whether you wear a mask or not, because the virus can get in via your eyes, and none of the "wear masks all the time" people are telling you to also wear eye protection all the time.
  - DanBC 7y ago
    2019-nCoV transmission through the ocular surface must not be ignored: https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30313-5/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6...
    - nokcha 7y ago
      And furthermore, even if the virus can't directly infect you via your eyes, the virus particles can move from the eye area to the nose/mouth after removing a mask, e.g., by touching one's face (even with washed hands) or when taking a shower or washing one's face.
  - spacehunt 7y ago
    > none of the "wear masks all the time" people are telling you to also wear eye protection all the time Huh? The earliest local news article I could find[0][1] that mentioned the importance of wearing glasses and goggles was back in January. But we didn't wait for the authorities to tell us -- we did our own research, and I purchased my pair of goggles in mid January. [0]: https://news.rthk.hk/rthk/ch/component/k2/1504801-20200125.htm https://news.rthk.hk/rthk/ch/component/k2/1504801-20200125.h... [1]: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-health-hongkong/hong-kong-leader-declares-virus-emergency-halts-official-visits-to-mainland-china-idUSKBN1ZO0B7 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-health-hongkong/hon...
flarg 7y ago
We need to use our own common sense here sometimes, and the WHO are not making sense here. Kind of how they don't make sense regarding Tiwan and breast feeding. The WHO is being careful to say don't wear a mask unless you are ill, but with this virus we don't know until several weeks after we are infected, they are also mixing recommendations for non medical staff with recommendations with medical staff.

cmrx64 7y ago

> Or are you stating that the WHO is lying? yes, the page does indeed state that. what do you think of the cited research, vs nitpicking the hero image?

gombosg 7y ago
Out of the 7 references, most of them are journalistic articles and not actual scientific research. The question is 'does wearing masks out in the public decrease virus spread, when social distancing measures are already in effect?'. One linked (not cited...) research examines virus transmission and effects of mask use in a hospital setting - irrelevant for the question. Another examines filtration properties of homemade masks, and concludes that they have little if any effect if not used with other measures, and doesn't (!!!) recommend their use. A third one, a SCMP journalistic article refers to a Chinese scientific journal article that has been retracted. I don't find these as very compelling arguments.
- cmrx64 7y ago
  https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/1HLrm0pqBN_5bdyysOeoOBX4pt4oFDBhsC_jpblXpNtQ/mobilebasic https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/1HLrm0pqBN_5bdyysOeoO... (linked on the page) was what I was referring to, not the list of references which I agree are not very compelling. SSC did a writeup too: https://slatestarcodex.com/2020/03/23/face-masks-much-more-than-you-wanted-to-know/ https://slatestarcodex.com/2020/03/23/face-masks-much-more-t... Thanks for sharing more detailed thoughts!

javagram 7y ago

WHO’s statement itself says that the mask is helpful when you are caring for someone with a suspected infection, therefore it admits the mask can provide some level of infection protection. It likewise says the mask should be worn by someone coughing or sneezing, showing that it protects others from your germs. The obvious answer to the “wearing masks in a wrong way” is to teach people to use and dispose of them correctly, just like we don’t dismiss hand washing because many people don’t know how to do it. I think these statements by health authorities are simply because there has been no RCT of mask wearing among the general public and for them lack of evidence is equivalent to evidence of absence.

usrusr 7y ago
The decision to treat absence of evidence as evidence of absence is surely driven by evidence of absence of masks, if you pardon the pun. It's very reasonable to prioritize healthcare workers who are far more exposed than anybody else and the lack of formal, peer reviewed studies is a welcome opportunity to subdue a panic buying bidding war. If truth was the only concern, I think that comparing the rough numbers between "masked countries" and "unmasked countries" should be more than enough to recommend masks. It's a planet-wide experiment and the control group is clearly seeing worse results. And it's not just SEA countries, there are also places in Europe that didn't play down masks, like the Czech Republic. And their metrics are looking quite good so far, with far more liberal measures than in neighboring Bavaria, except for the masks. With much of the intra-European spread being incubated in ski resorts one would expect them to be hit quite hard as well. And the Czech Republic doesn't have a magical stockpile either, from what I'm reading there's a lot of improvisation going on there regarding masks. Speaking of improvised masks, would vacuum cleaner bags be a good MacGuyver material that's present in almost any household? It's surely better at filtering than random t-shirt cloth, but would there be a risk of ruining lungs with fibers from the bag material? The fact that they are apparently safe to force air through them in living quarters with a two kilowatts blower suggests that they don't shed anything harmful, but I'd be glad to hear any counterarguments from the wide variety of expertise present in hn readership.
- nullc 7y ago

wwweston 7y ago

Here's what makes sense to me: * The single most effective intervention we have right now is staying home and avoiding every unnecessary contact, as authorities recommend. * Worn carefully, several kinds of masks probably have a range of marginal positive effects. * BUT recommending them runs the risk of (a) people over-relying on them and not following isolation protocols (b) people wearing them incorrectly for a mix of less effective benefits and added risks (c) contributing to a run on masks which constrains supply for medical workers where the benefits are more critical. If this is all true, it can simultaneously be the case that official guidelines against masks are reasonable recommendations and that it's also a reasonable recommendation to wear masks (on top of other more important precautions). I'm sure that masks are not the sole factor in gentler curves in those countries. They do seem to be a common factor.

gombosg 7y ago
I totally agree and it's likely that the public will be much better equipped after this pandemic ends. So all of us will have a box of disposable masks at home, and will be educated about when and how to wear them properly. Right now, the average person probably only has 1 or at most a few masks, they don't dispose of them after use and probably wear (put on/off) them in a wrong way.
- oefrha 7y ago
  You know, you could have learned how to put on a mask properly within the time period you spent arguing here. It’s not fucking rocket science.
  - JCharante 7y ago
    I was recently on a flight where a person on my row had difficulties taking her seatbelt off. After what seemed like two minutes the flight attendant assisted her. I'll even admit that it sometimes takes me a second to do it correctly when I try to only take it off with one hand. Despite this we still recommend that people use their seatbelts. In addition to this we play videos that instruct people on the usage of seatbelts. Imagine if we argued against recommending seatbelts because of the lack of education on using them despite never having attempted to explain how to use them.

Phlogistique 7y ago

Hi, Your comment fails to offer a counter-argument to the comment you are replying to; you are just repeating the position that the comment explicitly refutes. > Or are you stating that the WHO is lying? In fact, the site linked in the comment explicitly states that.

ampersandy 7y ago
It refutes nothing — it's some layperson's uneducated opinion based on a couple of cherry picked statistics (as gombosg already pointed out). Let the epidemiologists guiding global responses to the pandemic provide guidance and everyone else should call out anyone trying to peddle their own made up conclusions.

oefrha 7y ago

> Those Asian cultures have a different epidemic curve not due to mask wearing, but because a totally different social structure, prior experience concerning epidemics, preparedness, attitude towards authority & emergency measures and other factors. So it's a fallacy of cherry picking to say that it's 'because they wear masks and all our authorities are wrong'. And you’re not cherry-picking because what exactly?

ampersandy 7y ago
Pointing out that there are a huge number of other factors that influence the spread of COVID-19 in each country is not cherry-picking, it's highlighting that you can't simply look at said graph and say "it's because they wear masks."
- oefrha 7y ago
  Saying the difference is due to other factors but “not due to mask wearing” is cherry-picking everything else other than mask wearing.

piokoch 7y ago

It is not that WHO is lying, it can be misinformed or just do not know something. Previous global epidemic happened over 100 years ago, so I don't blame them for lack of knowledge. We all have to learn and try new things, so if WHO says "mask are not helping" while there are evidences (maybe just correlation, but we just don't know for now!) that in some countries masks seems to help we should ask WHO if they are really sure. BTW: the fact that WHO pretends that Taiwan does not exists does not help investigating masks/no masks question. "Wear a mask if you are coughing or sneezing" - sure, the problem is that even if someone breaths normally, talks normally can spread the virus. The problem with the coronavirus is that it has long incubation time. Someone might spread virus without having any symptoms. My masks protects someone else, not me (unless I am wearing some pro stuff), as I am not spreading virus 2 meters around me, but 50 cm - maybe this is not that much, but in case of something that spreads according to power laws it might be a visible factor.

lorenzhs 7y ago
So the WHO doesn't know but some random techies on a forum do? That's absurd.
- oefrha 7y ago
  Some random techies on a forum, as well as East Asian governments and medical experts. But hey, what do they know.
  - lorenzhs 7y ago
    But it's not an East Asian government or a medical expert who made the website that started this thread, is it? It's fasteddie31003, whose HN profile reads "Software engineer in San Francisco." Leave the medical advice to medical experts, just as you expect the medical experts to keep their mouths shut about the advantages of Rust over Go or whether Vue is the right choice in 2020.
    - oefrha 7y ago

factsaresacred 7y ago

> contradicts official WHO guidance A few weeks ago official WHO guidance included: - that there was "no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission" of the virus - that international air travel should not be suspended "because of the social disruption they cause and the intensive use of resources required" (nothing about the efficacy of such a move). Well look at us now. Maybe, just maybe, their guidance on this topic is also flawed. The lack of critical thinking on the issue of masks is astonishing. There are study after study[0] showing that masks mitigate the transfer of virus particles. Then there's common sense which points in the same direction. --- https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3810906/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3810906/ https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712%2808%2901008-4/fulltext https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712%2808%2901008-4... https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(03)13168-6/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6...

fiblye 7y ago
God, I was so annoyed reading WHO statements and people quoting them as an authority when this first started to blow up in China. The numbers quickly went from dozens to hundreds, and they still tried saying there was no chance of human-to-human transmission (pretty unlikely that they all ate the same food and that a virus with the main symptom being coughing isn't transmitted by coughing) and that it'd all be contained and there was no need to worry. In this crisis, the WHO has been bending over so far backwards that it's spinning donuts to serve as a political mouthpiece for certain governments. There was panic over people being under-supplied and under-prepared, and one of the main supplies in short supply was masks. Masks aren't perfect, but even if they're reducing transmission by 10% and keeping people from touching their mouth, that's a decent effect.

sbr464 7y ago

I think saying “misinforming”, “dangerous”, or relying solely on the generic guidance of the WHO is a bit strong. I think common sense prevails. Wearing equipment that filters airborne particulates will expose a person less than going without. Personally, I would prefer being overprotected versus becoming a statistic in a WHO researcher’s Excel spreadsheet.

rndgermandude 7y ago
"Common sense" leads to empty aisles that are usually stocked with toilet paper.
- sbr464 7y ago
  I think that points more to how fragile the world economy is. You have a personal choice where you can do everything to increase your chances of survival, or go with common/generic advice that’s provided to society as a whole. I guess it depends on what your goals are.
  - rndgermandude 7y ago
    My goal is not to be an asshole, and to survive too, by listening to people who actually know their shit instead of using their "common sense" to guess. If we relied on common sense, the earth would still be flat, and we'd still prohibit women on their period from pickling food.
    - mantap 7y ago
      Mask wearing is mandatory in several countries. This is not a situation where people are making shit up, this is a situation where you have several authorities saying different things. In the absence of solid evidence, applying common sense to evaluate the arguments of those authorities is a lot better than just picking one of the authorities and proclaiming "This is the truth!"

blackrock 7y ago

A grocery store aisle is about 4 feet wide. Given the minimum 6 feet of social distancing, then there is no room for maneuvering around people here. And all it takes is for one idiot to cough in your face without covering themselves, while you are walking past them, to get sick. And now, you have a 14 day incubation window, to wait to see if you indeed got sick from this person. The point of masks is that everyone must wear it, while in public. No exceptions are allowed. This is a team effort. And all it takes is one person, to screw it up for everyone.

DanBC 7y ago
If someone coughs in your face then you're probably going to get infected whether you wear a mask or not, because the virus can get in via your eyes, and none of the "wear masks all the time" people are telling you to also wear eye protection all the time.
- DanBC 7y ago
  2019-nCoV transmission through the ocular surface must not be ignored: https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30313-5/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6...
  - nokcha 7y ago
    And furthermore, even if the virus can't directly infect you via your eyes, the virus particles can move from the eye area to the nose/mouth after removing a mask, e.g., by touching one's face (even with washed hands) or when taking a shower or washing one's face.
- spacehunt 7y ago
  > none of the "wear masks all the time" people are telling you to also wear eye protection all the time Huh? The earliest local news article I could find[0][1] that mentioned the importance of wearing glasses and goggles was back in January. But we didn't wait for the authorities to tell us -- we did our own research, and I purchased my pair of goggles in mid January. [0]: https://news.rthk.hk/rthk/ch/component/k2/1504801-20200125.htm https://news.rthk.hk/rthk/ch/component/k2/1504801-20200125.h... [1]: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-health-hongkong/hong-kong-leader-declares-virus-emergency-halts-official-visits-to-mainland-china-idUSKBN1ZO0B7 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-health-hongkong/hon...

flarg 7y ago

We need to use our own common sense here sometimes, and the WHO are not making sense here. Kind of how they don't make sense regarding Tiwan and breast feeding. The WHO is being careful to say don't wear a mask unless you are ill, but with this virus we don't know until several weeks after we are infected, they are also mixing recommendations for non medical staff with recommendations with medical staff.