8 ms·

Things I Won't Work With: Chlorine Azide

92 points by joe_bleau 16y ago

_delirium 16y ago
The whole "things I won't work with" category is a good read: http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/things_i_wont_work_with/ http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/things_i_wont_work_with... along with the related category, "how not to do it": http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/how_not_to_do_it/ http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/how_not_to_do_it/
Jabbles 16y ago
It remains, with its chemical relatives, off in a part of chemical science that's safe from human exploitation. Although Sodium Azide is used in systems which save thousands of lives every year - car airbags. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_azide http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_azide
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]
- Natsu 16y ago
  Older ones, yes. Newer ones use nitroguanidine and other less-toxic stuff according to the article you linked to. That said, we owe a lot to the brave chemists who manage to figure out how to deal with all these scary chemicals. Even if some of them are probably insane: http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2010/02/23/things_i_wont_work_with_dioxygen_difluoride.php http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2010/02/23/things_i_won... I love how the chemical can be written as FOOF, which is strangely reminiscent of the bogus F00F C7C8 instruction that could crash old Pentiums.
  - derleth 16y ago
    > I love how the chemical can be written as FOOF, which is strangely reminiscent of the bogus F00F C7C8 instruction that could crash old Pentiums. Or the sound a small explosion might make, which is the first thing most people would think of. ;-)
- icco 16y ago
  "it usually detonates violently whatever the temperature, without apparent provocation." -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorine_azide http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorine_azide Anything described like that I would stay far away from too.
js2 16y ago
Previous submissions: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1148425 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1148425 (with discussion) http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1560128 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1560128
- gjm11 16y ago
  Those aren't previous submissions of this entry, but of (in one case) an earlier "Thing I won't work with" and (in the other) the series as a whole, which didn't then include this one.
Loic 16y ago
A drawing of the molecule (ClN3): http://chemeo.com/cid/31-110-4 http://chemeo.com/cid/31-110-4 just looking at it, you think, ouch! Insane high level of bounds tension coupled with a Cl detonator.
- pmiller2 16y ago
  Yeah, those nitrogens are seriously pissed off.
  - koenigdavidmj 16y ago
    Don't anthropomorphise nitrogen. It does not like that.
- Evgeny 16y ago
  Well, bond tension by itself is not the indicator of explosiveness, isn't it? The N2 molecule has 3 bonds connecting 2 atoms and it is one of the most stable known molecules.
  - bjelkeman-again 16y ago
    Maybe Loic meant: "Insane high level of _potential_ bound tension coupled with a Cl detonator." (My emphasis.) It seems to me that the Cl atom is easily removed from the N-C bond, by something as simple as water vapor. My chemistry isn't great, but I would hazard a guess that even the slight polarity of the water molecule is enough to remove the Cl from the N-C bond, thereby the potential for explosive behavior. Info from the Wikipedia indicates as much: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorine_azide http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorine_azide
  - timr 16y ago
    A triple-bond is not inherently unstable. In chlorine azide, though, you've got a strongly electronegative halide (chlorine) bound via tenuous single-bond to a partial triple-bond in the nitrogen compound. One of those nitrogens has a partial charge at all times. Bottom line: that chlorine wants to dissociate, badly. When it does, it's going to take the azide with it. It's like a chemical hair-trigger, waiting to be pulled by the nearest partial charge.
berntb 16y ago
I love this series of blog posts, especially since I have studied a bit of organic chemistry and loved that lab work (a very one-sided love affair). As an old "fan" of rocket fuels in general and peroxides in particular, I still giggle a bit nervously at the chemical formula FOOF... Edit: http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2010/02/23/things_i_wont_work_with_dioxygen_difluoride.php http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2010/02/23/things_i_won... "If the paper weren't laid out in complete grammatical sentences and published in JACS, you'd swear it was the work of a violent lunatic."
- bjelkeman-again 16y ago
  Read the comments in the linked article. You'll enjoy it.
  - berntb 16y ago
    I did, when I read it originally a year ago, or so. They are often as good as the blog post.
tastybites 16y ago
Sometimes I forget that there's entire armies of geeks that do crazy complex things other than compyooterz.
hinathan 16y ago
Say it yourself a few times: "I love software"

92 points by joe_bleau 16y ago

The whole "things I won't work with" category is a good read: http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/things_i_wont_work_with/ http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/things_i_wont_work_with... along with the related category, "how not to do it": http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/how_not_to_do_it/ http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/how_not_to_do_it/

Jabbles 16y ago

It remains, with its chemical relatives, off in a part of chemical science that's safe from human exploitation. Although Sodium Azide is used in systems which save thousands of lives every year - car airbags. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_azide http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_azide

deleted 16y ago
[deleted]
Natsu 16y ago
Older ones, yes. Newer ones use nitroguanidine and other less-toxic stuff according to the article you linked to. That said, we owe a lot to the brave chemists who manage to figure out how to deal with all these scary chemicals. Even if some of them are probably insane: http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2010/02/23/things_i_wont_work_with_dioxygen_difluoride.php http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2010/02/23/things_i_won... I love how the chemical can be written as FOOF, which is strangely reminiscent of the bogus F00F C7C8 instruction that could crash old Pentiums.
- derleth 16y ago
  > I love how the chemical can be written as FOOF, which is strangely reminiscent of the bogus F00F C7C8 instruction that could crash old Pentiums. Or the sound a small explosion might make, which is the first thing most people would think of. ;-)
icco 16y ago
"it usually detonates violently whatever the temperature, without apparent provocation." -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorine_azide http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorine_azide Anything described like that I would stay far away from too.

js2 16y ago

Previous submissions: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1148425 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1148425 (with discussion) http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1560128 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1560128

gjm11 16y ago
Those aren't previous submissions of this entry, but of (in one case) an earlier "Thing I won't work with" and (in the other) the series as a whole, which didn't then include this one.

Loic 16y ago

A drawing of the molecule (ClN3): http://chemeo.com/cid/31-110-4 http://chemeo.com/cid/31-110-4 just looking at it, you think, ouch! Insane high level of bounds tension coupled with a Cl detonator.

pmiller2 16y ago
Yeah, those nitrogens are seriously pissed off.
- koenigdavidmj 16y ago
  Don't anthropomorphise nitrogen. It does not like that.
Evgeny 16y ago
Well, bond tension by itself is not the indicator of explosiveness, isn't it? The N2 molecule has 3 bonds connecting 2 atoms and it is one of the most stable known molecules.
- bjelkeman-again 16y ago
  Maybe Loic meant: "Insane high level of _potential_ bound tension coupled with a Cl detonator." (My emphasis.) It seems to me that the Cl atom is easily removed from the N-C bond, by something as simple as water vapor. My chemistry isn't great, but I would hazard a guess that even the slight polarity of the water molecule is enough to remove the Cl from the N-C bond, thereby the potential for explosive behavior. Info from the Wikipedia indicates as much: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorine_azide http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorine_azide
- timr 16y ago
  A triple-bond is not inherently unstable. In chlorine azide, though, you've got a strongly electronegative halide (chlorine) bound via tenuous single-bond to a partial triple-bond in the nitrogen compound. One of those nitrogens has a partial charge at all times. Bottom line: that chlorine wants to dissociate, badly. When it does, it's going to take the azide with it. It's like a chemical hair-trigger, waiting to be pulled by the nearest partial charge.

berntb 16y ago

I love this series of blog posts, especially since I have studied a bit of organic chemistry and loved that lab work (a very one-sided love affair). As an old "fan" of rocket fuels in general and peroxides in particular, I still giggle a bit nervously at the chemical formula FOOF... Edit: http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2010/02/23/things_i_wont_work_with_dioxygen_difluoride.php http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2010/02/23/things_i_won... "If the paper weren't laid out in complete grammatical sentences and published in JACS, you'd swear it was the work of a violent lunatic."

bjelkeman-again 16y ago
Read the comments in the linked article. You'll enjoy it.
- berntb 16y ago
  I did, when I read it originally a year ago, or so. They are often as good as the blog post.

tastybites 16y ago

Sometimes I forget that there's entire armies of geeks that do crazy complex things other than compyooterz.

hinathan 16y ago

Say it yourself a few times: "I love software"