4 ms·

They're not Socialist policies, that's a confusion over what Socialism is (total state control of the means of production, as one of several requirements). Wha

They're not Socialist policies, that's a confusion over what Socialism is (total state control of the means of production, as one of several requirements). What you're referring to is called a welfare state. They're welfare state policies, not Socialist policies. The US has been a welfare state nation for many decades now, and increasingly so. For example, there are no Socialist nations in Europe at present, including Norway, Sweden, Finland, Denmark, or France. Those are overwhelmingly market based economies that have large welfare states.

advantager 7y ago
There was a Freakonomics podcast episode I recently heard that further expands on your point regarding socialist vs. welfare states: https://freakonomics.com/podcast/socialism/ https://freakonomics.com/podcast/socialism/
grecy 7y ago
I disagree with you. Not everything is so black and white that it must be one thing or another. Socialism doesn't have to be "Total state control of the means of production", it can be piecemeal and applied to some parts of a society or economy and not others. Heathcare for all is not "welfare". It's the government taking tax dollars and then paying for things for all citizens. It's how the USA currently pays for Police and Prisons and the Military and corn subsidies and elementary school teachers among a million other things that are not welfare. What I'm saying is the US is adopting more socialist ideas, and it's spreading the tax dollars around to more and more citizens in more types of ways, like the rest of the developed world has been doing for decades very successfully. As I said, I'll be fascinated to see the reaction if and when it's taken back after COVID-19.
- tathougies 7y ago
  > What I'm saying is the US is adopting more socialist ideas, and it's spreading the tax dollars around to more and more citizens in more types of ways, like the rest of the developed world has been doing for decades very successfully. Rubbish. The Defense production act invoked today is from WWII and extremely limited in scope. After the crisis is over the government will be forced to give up these powers. And thank goodness. This is no way to run a free country in normal times.
  - grecy 7y ago
    > And thank goodness. This is no way to run a free country in normal times I take it you're aware of Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Australia, Canada, New Zealand and virtually ALL the other developed countries on the planet who function this way every day of the year and do very well.
    - tathougies 7y ago
      Australia, Canada, and New Zealand don't have the same kinds of guarantees on freedom the United States does, frankly. I don't know much about the other three's laws and can't comment.
      - grecy 7y ago
        Now I'm genuinely curious, as I lived 23 years in Australia. What freedoms are you talking about?

advantager 7y ago

There was a Freakonomics podcast episode I recently heard that further expands on your point regarding socialist vs. welfare states: https://freakonomics.com/podcast/socialism/ https://freakonomics.com/podcast/socialism/

grecy 7y ago

I disagree with you. Not everything is so black and white that it must be one thing or another. Socialism doesn't have to be "Total state control of the means of production", it can be piecemeal and applied to some parts of a society or economy and not others. Heathcare for all is not "welfare". It's the government taking tax dollars and then paying for things for all citizens. It's how the USA currently pays for Police and Prisons and the Military and corn subsidies and elementary school teachers among a million other things that are not welfare. What I'm saying is the US is adopting more socialist ideas, and it's spreading the tax dollars around to more and more citizens in more types of ways, like the rest of the developed world has been doing for decades very successfully. As I said, I'll be fascinated to see the reaction if and when it's taken back after COVID-19.

tathougies 7y ago
> What I'm saying is the US is adopting more socialist ideas, and it's spreading the tax dollars around to more and more citizens in more types of ways, like the rest of the developed world has been doing for decades very successfully. Rubbish. The Defense production act invoked today is from WWII and extremely limited in scope. After the crisis is over the government will be forced to give up these powers. And thank goodness. This is no way to run a free country in normal times.
- grecy 7y ago
  > And thank goodness. This is no way to run a free country in normal times I take it you're aware of Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Australia, Canada, New Zealand and virtually ALL the other developed countries on the planet who function this way every day of the year and do very well.
  - tathougies 7y ago
    Australia, Canada, and New Zealand don't have the same kinds of guarantees on freedom the United States does, frankly. I don't know much about the other three's laws and can't comment.
    - grecy 7y ago
      Now I'm genuinely curious, as I lived 23 years in Australia. What freedoms are you talking about?