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Thank you. That's what I gotta say. Thank you. I hate all the cynics and conspiracy theories here. It's a generous move, and deeply appreciated. Jack didn't s

Thank you. That's what I gotta say. Thank you. I hate all the cynics and conspiracy theories here. It's a generous move, and deeply appreciated. Jack didn't spend that much money to be a douchebag. He spent it because this will save countless lives.

deleted 7y ago
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mehrdadn 7y ago
Yeah, honestly. Even as someone who can be cynical about things, I still think this is very much kind and appreciated. Meanwhile I know others who say it's political and means pretty much nothing... I just don't know how to reply.
- adventured 7y ago
  It's clearly no more political than the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation directing funds & other resources to assist China (and Asia broadly) the other direction, for which Xi personally thanked Bill [1]. China has an enormous amount of wealth and production capacity, anything they can help out with is a positive. As they bring their outbreak under control, they'll have dramatic spare capacity around test kits and medical supplies, that can benefit the rest of the world. [1] http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-02/22/c_138807761.htm http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-02/22/c_138807761.htm
  - alisonatwork 7y ago
    Of course it's more political than anything Bill and Melinda are doing. Jack Ma is a member of the CPC. The CPC is the sole organ of power in China. Currently they are going to great lengths to try to make everyone around the world forget that they are the ones who caused this pandemic in the first place. They've even stooped to allowing the conspiracy theory to spread that the true origin of the virus is overseas. It's shameful. When the immediate crisis is over, the world needs to hold the CPC accountable. You don't get to set a fire and show up with a bucket three months later expecting to be declared a hero. So, Jack Ma donating masks around the world can be a positive thing for the people affected by the virus right now, but it can also be a cynical political move at the same time.
robomartin 7y ago
Well. Not so fast. It isn't cynicism to point out issues with this idea. You can't accept half a million random tests kits and use them for anything. It isn't that simple. At a minimum, we know nothing about where they came from, their traceability, method of manufacture, sterility, etc. And then there's the reality that "test kits" does not mean swab-to-result technology. There's a lot more to testing someone for, well, anything, than the mere extraction or collection of a sample. Extreme example, ten million blood test vials are useless if their manufacturing and quality isn't traceable and you don't have the chemistry needed to run blood analysis with them. Same with the million face masks. China isn't necessarily known for top quality manufacturing except for where external companies (Apple) put in massive process controls and supervision. Same issue here with masks. I would not trust them as far as I could throw them. This isn't being negative. It's reality. If you've ever manufactured anything in China you understand very well how careful you have to be not to end-up with junk. Sure, there are great factories and engineers there, but, to use the phrase, you have to trust but verify. That said, nice gesture. Yet, no, I would not touch any of that stuff unless our authorities can ascertain their quality and safety 100%. Our private enterprises are spinning up manufacturing of all of these items fast. I would much rather trust them. Sorry, but we need to start to decouple from China to the extent possible. If Europe and North America can't make their own masks and medical supplies we might as well hand over the keys and call it a good run. EDIT: Personal example about Chinese manufacturing as a consumer (I have plenty more stories as a manufacturer): We bought a jacuzzi tub directly from China. Alibaba, in fact. After much research we found the factory that make these tubs for everyone. By this I mean, they make them and companies like Whirlpool in the US put their logo on it. So, we bought one. Given that I understand the issues with Chinese manufacturing due to personal experience, the first thing I did when we got it was take it apart and test absolutely everything. This thing had almost every defect in the book. It had leaks. It had loose washers inside the electronics enclosure. It had copper wire strands in there as well. The screws on the barrier strip for the 120V in and out connections were lose. And a ground connection was missing. Without spending several hours fixing it, this thing would have leaked water and soap everywhere, shorted out, burned out and maybe even electrocuted someone. So, yeah, trust but verify. Everything. And, yeah #2, the people down-voting this have no clue whatsoever about the realities of manufacturing in China without serious and extensive controls. Ignorance is bliss.
xenadu02 7y ago
It's not much different from the Gates Foundation and similar ventures. When you're so rich money doesn't matter philanthropic works are expected. It also doesn't help that the current administration has bungled the testing from day 1; in the past we would have ramped up testing when the disease was spreading in China. Whether it's lack of leadership, incompetence, or deliberate we don't know. But Dear Leader certainly won't take responsibility for it and isn't interested in solving the problem so lack of leadership is definitely a factor. My guess is at least some in the administration were dumb enough to believe it wouldn't spread in the US.

deleted 7y ago

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mehrdadn 7y ago

Yeah, honestly. Even as someone who can be cynical about things, I still think this is very much kind and appreciated. Meanwhile I know others who say it's political and means pretty much nothing... I just don't know how to reply.

adventured 7y ago
It's clearly no more political than the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation directing funds & other resources to assist China (and Asia broadly) the other direction, for which Xi personally thanked Bill [1]. China has an enormous amount of wealth and production capacity, anything they can help out with is a positive. As they bring their outbreak under control, they'll have dramatic spare capacity around test kits and medical supplies, that can benefit the rest of the world. [1] http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-02/22/c_138807761.htm http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-02/22/c_138807761.htm
- alisonatwork 7y ago
  Of course it's more political than anything Bill and Melinda are doing. Jack Ma is a member of the CPC. The CPC is the sole organ of power in China. Currently they are going to great lengths to try to make everyone around the world forget that they are the ones who caused this pandemic in the first place. They've even stooped to allowing the conspiracy theory to spread that the true origin of the virus is overseas. It's shameful. When the immediate crisis is over, the world needs to hold the CPC accountable. You don't get to set a fire and show up with a bucket three months later expecting to be declared a hero. So, Jack Ma donating masks around the world can be a positive thing for the people affected by the virus right now, but it can also be a cynical political move at the same time.

robomartin 7y ago

Well. Not so fast. It isn't cynicism to point out issues with this idea. You can't accept half a million random tests kits and use them for anything. It isn't that simple. At a minimum, we know nothing about where they came from, their traceability, method of manufacture, sterility, etc. And then there's the reality that "test kits" does not mean swab-to-result technology. There's a lot more to testing someone for, well, anything, than the mere extraction or collection of a sample. Extreme example, ten million blood test vials are useless if their manufacturing and quality isn't traceable and you don't have the chemistry needed to run blood analysis with them. Same with the million face masks. China isn't necessarily known for top quality manufacturing except for where external companies (Apple) put in massive process controls and supervision. Same issue here with masks. I would not trust them as far as I could throw them. This isn't being negative. It's reality. If you've ever manufactured anything in China you understand very well how careful you have to be not to end-up with junk. Sure, there are great factories and engineers there, but, to use the phrase, you have to trust but verify. That said, nice gesture. Yet, no, I would not touch any of that stuff unless our authorities can ascertain their quality and safety 100%. Our private enterprises are spinning up manufacturing of all of these items fast. I would much rather trust them. Sorry, but we need to start to decouple from China to the extent possible. If Europe and North America can't make their own masks and medical supplies we might as well hand over the keys and call it a good run. EDIT: Personal example about Chinese manufacturing as a consumer (I have plenty more stories as a manufacturer): We bought a jacuzzi tub directly from China. Alibaba, in fact. After much research we found the factory that make these tubs for everyone. By this I mean, they make them and companies like Whirlpool in the US put their logo on it. So, we bought one. Given that I understand the issues with Chinese manufacturing due to personal experience, the first thing I did when we got it was take it apart and test absolutely everything. This thing had almost every defect in the book. It had leaks. It had loose washers inside the electronics enclosure. It had copper wire strands in there as well. The screws on the barrier strip for the 120V in and out connections were lose. And a ground connection was missing. Without spending several hours fixing it, this thing would have leaked water and soap everywhere, shorted out, burned out and maybe even electrocuted someone. So, yeah, trust but verify. Everything. And, yeah #2, the people down-voting this have no clue whatsoever about the realities of manufacturing in China without serious and extensive controls. Ignorance is bliss.

xenadu02 7y ago

It's not much different from the Gates Foundation and similar ventures. When you're so rich money doesn't matter philanthropic works are expected. It also doesn't help that the current administration has bungled the testing from day 1; in the past we would have ramped up testing when the disease was spreading in China. Whether it's lack of leadership, incompetence, or deliberate we don't know. But Dear Leader certainly won't take responsibility for it and isn't interested in solving the problem so lack of leadership is definitely a factor. My guess is at least some in the administration were dumb enough to believe it wouldn't spread in the US.