4 ms·

The WHO and the US government have lost their credibility. I'm looking to state and local governments to step up. The California state government looks like t

The WHO and the US government have lost their credibility. I'm looking to state and local governments to step up. The California state government looks like they are doing and saying the right things ( better than the federal government at least ). Actions speak louder than words, look at what is working ( South Korea ) and what isn't.

creaghpatr 7y ago
Unfortunately the California government seems to support the Trump administrations' coronavirus response. https://www.newsweek.com/californias-democrat-governor-praises-trumps-coronavirus-response-every-single-thing-he-said-1491294 https://www.newsweek.com/californias-democrat-governor-prais...
- beamatronic 7y ago
  I am hoping, hope being the operative word here, that Governor Newsom is trying to telegraph to us that behind the scenes, he is having somewhat productive conversations with the Vice President.
- munk-a 7y ago
  Honestly, at a time like this, where California might need federal resources if a bad outbreak occurs in the state - it serves no one to needlessly antagonize the federal government. It's politics - everyone else should be criticizing the white house in particular, but government officials really need to remain on the administration's good side.
  - jeromegv 7y ago
    I’d like to congratulate The United States of America’s for allowing their country health response to a pandemic to be about pleasing the great leader for political reasons Do people realize how fucked that is?
    - munk-a 7y ago
      Oh, I'm not applauding the state of affairs - it's insanely depressing (especially when coupled with the recent primary developments). But, yea, politics is a thing. There have been other petty administrations in the past and this is, sadly, how they tend to function.
    - creaghpatr 7y ago
      The vast majority of the relief effort has been apolitical. Dem house and GOP senate got an $8B bill through in two weeks- that's pretty nuts in terms of bipartisan effort.
    - rconti 7y ago
      Most of us do. Some merely pretend not to recognize it when asked in polls. However, there is also a not-insubstantial cult that will never change their minds, and take their beliefs to the grave with them.
- dragonwriter 7y ago
  From your source: “Correction: This article and headline has been updated to clarify that Governor Newsom was specifically referring to the support from the White House regarding the docking of the Grand Princess cruise ship.” There is no endorsement of the federal policy beyond the handling of that specific task.
  - creaghpatr 7y ago
    Thank god!
pbhjpbhj 7y ago
Why do you say that about WHO?
- beamatronic 7y ago
  They failed to do anything in the early stages! They should have declared pandemic weeks ago, instead of today.
  - TeMPOraL 7y ago
    In their defense, apparently they got trigger-happy in H1N1 days and got burned for calling pandemic too early.
    - beamatronic 7y ago
      I'll gladly take trigger-happy health authorities! That's literally their primary function: to sound the alarm. Edit: I'm looking at you, Santa Clara County Health department, for NOT doing enough.
      - catalogia 7y ago
        > That's literally their primary function: to sound the alarm. Yes, but if they sound the alarm too frequently they'll get a reputation as "the boy who cries wolf." When there really is a wolf, their alarm needs to be believed for it to have any value. What they have here is an unenviable balancing act. Sound the alarm too frequently, and the alarm is worthless. Sound the alarm too infrequently, and the alarm is worthless. Edit: Blackwater rebrands itself to make itself more obscure, which runs precisely counter to the goal of spreading public awareness / sounding alarms.
        munk-a 7y ago
        I actually don't know if that's really a huge concern - if the WHO burned their public trust they could always be publicly dismantled and replaced with a new committee[1] - these outbreaks happen rarely enough that public memory isn't going to sustain that well across multiple failures. Good behavior induced by fear is a real asset in pandemics so we need to not be hesitant to use it. 1. A.k.a. "The Blackwater Approach"
claudeganon 7y ago
I'm impressed by academic institutions' response in Seattle, although I think they should've have gone even further. It's still incredible to me that local labs discovered community transmission and federal officials told them to immediately stop testing and effectively did nothing to further intervene: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/10/us/coronavirus-testing-delays.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/10/us/coronavirus-testing-de...
- vvanders 7y ago
  +1 also UW's response has been awesome to see.
shadowgovt 7y ago
What did the WHO do to lose credibility? I think I missed that story.
- eveningcoffee 7y ago
  They downplayed the threat in the beginning and strongly advised against travel ban.
  - ejstronge 7y ago
    Hmm, do you have evidence of the threat being downplayed? The initial advice against the travel ban was quite political, but it's the classic case of a nonprofit needing to appease its donors. At any rate, I recall them saying that travel bans are ineffective against stopping viral spread (which has clearly been proven true). Their utility on slowing transmission is less clear, though I've read that travel controls have indeed proven helpful.
  - simonh 7y ago
    The problem with travel bans is that there can be all sorts of unintended side effects that exacerbate the problem. It encourages people to make heavier use of illicit and non-mainstream travel channels that can't be monitored or controlled effectively. It may reduce overall travel, but much of the travel that does occur takes place in conditions that are dramatically more likely to cause problems. Also travel bans can lead to severe humanitarian issue on top of the existing health crisis.
    - eveningcoffee 7y ago
      Alternative to the complete ban would have been forced quarantine for every person entering the country like Israel is doing.
      - simonh 7y ago
        This virus is going to be around for a very, very long time. As soon as it spread through the general population in China, it was over. Take China, everyone is talking as though they solved the problem, but it’s only a matter of time before it breaks out there again. In fact it’s almost certainly already happening. Even draconian lockdowns of people entering the country can only delay the inevitable. Now delays can be valuable. The slower the spread, the lower the peak strain on health services, but it cannot be stopped. How long is Israel going to do this, a week? A month? Six months? What about next year when there’s another outbreak? Maybe we’ll have a vaccine by then, but maybe not.
nomel 7y ago
> US government have lost their credibility If they had credibility for being able to move quickly for something this widespread, or anything at all really, I think it was fiction in someones mind.

creaghpatr 7y ago

Unfortunately the California government seems to support the Trump administrations' coronavirus response. https://www.newsweek.com/californias-democrat-governor-praises-trumps-coronavirus-response-every-single-thing-he-said-1491294 https://www.newsweek.com/californias-democrat-governor-prais...

beamatronic 7y ago
I am hoping, hope being the operative word here, that Governor Newsom is trying to telegraph to us that behind the scenes, he is having somewhat productive conversations with the Vice President.
munk-a 7y ago
Honestly, at a time like this, where California might need federal resources if a bad outbreak occurs in the state - it serves no one to needlessly antagonize the federal government. It's politics - everyone else should be criticizing the white house in particular, but government officials really need to remain on the administration's good side.
- jeromegv 7y ago
  I’d like to congratulate The United States of America’s for allowing their country health response to a pandemic to be about pleasing the great leader for political reasons Do people realize how fucked that is?
  - munk-a 7y ago
    Oh, I'm not applauding the state of affairs - it's insanely depressing (especially when coupled with the recent primary developments). But, yea, politics is a thing. There have been other petty administrations in the past and this is, sadly, how they tend to function.
  - creaghpatr 7y ago
    The vast majority of the relief effort has been apolitical. Dem house and GOP senate got an $8B bill through in two weeks- that's pretty nuts in terms of bipartisan effort.
  - rconti 7y ago
    Most of us do. Some merely pretend not to recognize it when asked in polls. However, there is also a not-insubstantial cult that will never change their minds, and take their beliefs to the grave with them.
dragonwriter 7y ago
From your source: “Correction: This article and headline has been updated to clarify that Governor Newsom was specifically referring to the support from the White House regarding the docking of the Grand Princess cruise ship.” There is no endorsement of the federal policy beyond the handling of that specific task.
- creaghpatr 7y ago
  Thank god!

pbhjpbhj 7y ago

Why do you say that about WHO?

beamatronic 7y ago
They failed to do anything in the early stages! They should have declared pandemic weeks ago, instead of today.
- TeMPOraL 7y ago
  In their defense, apparently they got trigger-happy in H1N1 days and got burned for calling pandemic too early.
  - beamatronic 7y ago
    I'll gladly take trigger-happy health authorities! That's literally their primary function: to sound the alarm. Edit: I'm looking at you, Santa Clara County Health department, for NOT doing enough.
    - catalogia 7y ago
      > That's literally their primary function: to sound the alarm. Yes, but if they sound the alarm too frequently they'll get a reputation as "the boy who cries wolf." When there really is a wolf, their alarm needs to be believed for it to have any value. What they have here is an unenviable balancing act. Sound the alarm too frequently, and the alarm is worthless. Sound the alarm too infrequently, and the alarm is worthless. Edit: Blackwater rebrands itself to make itself more obscure, which runs precisely counter to the goal of spreading public awareness / sounding alarms.
      - munk-a 7y ago
        I actually don't know if that's really a huge concern - if the WHO burned their public trust they could always be publicly dismantled and replaced with a new committee[1] - these outbreaks happen rarely enough that public memory isn't going to sustain that well across multiple failures. Good behavior induced by fear is a real asset in pandemics so we need to not be hesitant to use it. 1. A.k.a. "The Blackwater Approach"

claudeganon 7y ago

I'm impressed by academic institutions' response in Seattle, although I think they should've have gone even further. It's still incredible to me that local labs discovered community transmission and federal officials told them to immediately stop testing and effectively did nothing to further intervene: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/10/us/coronavirus-testing-delays.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/10/us/coronavirus-testing-de...

vvanders 7y ago
+1 also UW's response has been awesome to see.

shadowgovt 7y ago

What did the WHO do to lose credibility? I think I missed that story.

eveningcoffee 7y ago
They downplayed the threat in the beginning and strongly advised against travel ban.
- ejstronge 7y ago
  Hmm, do you have evidence of the threat being downplayed? The initial advice against the travel ban was quite political, but it's the classic case of a nonprofit needing to appease its donors. At any rate, I recall them saying that travel bans are ineffective against stopping viral spread (which has clearly been proven true). Their utility on slowing transmission is less clear, though I've read that travel controls have indeed proven helpful.
- simonh 7y ago
  The problem with travel bans is that there can be all sorts of unintended side effects that exacerbate the problem. It encourages people to make heavier use of illicit and non-mainstream travel channels that can't be monitored or controlled effectively. It may reduce overall travel, but much of the travel that does occur takes place in conditions that are dramatically more likely to cause problems. Also travel bans can lead to severe humanitarian issue on top of the existing health crisis.
  - eveningcoffee 7y ago
    Alternative to the complete ban would have been forced quarantine for every person entering the country like Israel is doing.
    - simonh 7y ago
      This virus is going to be around for a very, very long time. As soon as it spread through the general population in China, it was over. Take China, everyone is talking as though they solved the problem, but it’s only a matter of time before it breaks out there again. In fact it’s almost certainly already happening. Even draconian lockdowns of people entering the country can only delay the inevitable. Now delays can be valuable. The slower the spread, the lower the peak strain on health services, but it cannot be stopped. How long is Israel going to do this, a week? A month? Six months? What about next year when there’s another outbreak? Maybe we’ll have a vaccine by then, but maybe not.

nomel 7y ago

> US government have lost their credibility If they had credibility for being able to move quickly for something this widespread, or anything at all really, I think it was fiction in someones mind.