3 ms·

AA may be the most effective of the options studied but that doesn't mean it is a successful program. It just means it is the most effective of what are general

by tssva 7y ago

AA may be the most effective of the options studied but that doesn't mean it is a successful program. It just means it is the most effective of what are generally non-successful programs.

Supermancho 7y ago
> that doesn't mean it is a successful program Chronic Alcoholics had limbs (hands) cut off during early history. It wasn't very successful comparatively or maybe it wasn't "the best". The best known behavioral solution is the best behavioral solution qualitatively (which is a mix of programs, statistically). But calling such a program (as AA) something non-successful means you've using different criterion than the bar of sustained sobriety and reduced frequency of relapse. It's not clear what differentiates successful from non-successful in your estimation?
- snurfer 7y ago
  The silent majority of sober people are those who quit drinking using self-help. Those people don't talk about their program.
  - tanseydavid 7y ago
    Do you have a link or citation for that? Is this just your impression that you are relating?
    - snurfer 7y ago
      No citation, but consider this: before the creation of AA (1930-something), are we to believe no one ever stopped drinking successfully?
      - daseiner1 7y ago
        Are you aware that you're arguing in bad faith throughout this thread, or do you think these are strong points you're making? "Someone must've quitted drinking before AA existed" => "the silent majority of quitters do so via self-help" is nowhere close to a valid conclusion. Particularly for someone who's prided themself on their rationality elsewhere..
  - metabagel 7y ago
    My own impression is that AA would not have worked for me. Too preachy. Too pessimistic. For me, what helped was psychotherapy, joining a meditation group, an antidepressant, and solving the underlying root cause of my drinking (a failing relationship). I haven’t had an alcoholic drink in 4 years, and I don’t miss it.

by tssva 7y ago

AA may be the most effective of the options studied but that doesn't mean it is a successful program. It just means it is the most effective of what are generally non-successful programs.

Supermancho 7y ago

> that doesn't mean it is a successful program Chronic Alcoholics had limbs (hands) cut off during early history. It wasn't very successful comparatively or maybe it wasn't "the best". The best known behavioral solution is the best behavioral solution qualitatively (which is a mix of programs, statistically). But calling such a program (as AA) something non-successful means you've using different criterion than the bar of sustained sobriety and reduced frequency of relapse. It's not clear what differentiates successful from non-successful in your estimation?

snurfer 7y ago
The silent majority of sober people are those who quit drinking using self-help. Those people don't talk about their program.
- tanseydavid 7y ago
  Do you have a link or citation for that? Is this just your impression that you are relating?
  - snurfer 7y ago
    No citation, but consider this: before the creation of AA (1930-something), are we to believe no one ever stopped drinking successfully?
    - daseiner1 7y ago
      Are you aware that you're arguing in bad faith throughout this thread, or do you think these are strong points you're making? "Someone must've quitted drinking before AA existed" => "the silent majority of quitters do so via self-help" is nowhere close to a valid conclusion. Particularly for someone who's prided themself on their rationality elsewhere..
- metabagel 7y ago
  My own impression is that AA would not have worked for me. Too preachy. Too pessimistic. For me, what helped was psychotherapy, joining a meditation group, an antidepressant, and solving the underlying root cause of my drinking (a failing relationship). I haven’t had an alcoholic drink in 4 years, and I don’t miss it.