7 ms·

BB10 and Windows Phone 8 were the victims of the apple Google duopoly but both were individually far ahead of them. I still have hope Microsoft would make a com

BB10 and Windows Phone 8 were the victims of the apple Google duopoly but both were individually far ahead of them. I still have hope Microsoft would make a comeback. I could hope that BB open sources BB10 but that is not going to happen.

thedance 7y ago
I mean, no. BlackBerry was a victim of having a terrible product going head to head with the iPhone. As a development platform it was garbage. I vividly remember the inaugural BlackBerry developer conference where one of the sessions devolved into a revolt. People had written apps for the iPhone and they were not pleased with the APIs on the BB. Every attendee at that conference was supposed to receive a 9000 but they shipped a year late. RIM needed no duopoly to kill them. They died of natural causes.
- mardifoufs 7y ago
  Yep, I think people tend to forget how bad the blackberry line up was compared to the iPhones and even androids they were competing against. Their flagship in ~2011 was the Bold, which could barely browse the internet, had a horrible camera and an extremely dated UI. Going up against the iPhone 4s which is still functional to this day. Sometimes some companies just deserve to fail. The current duopoly formed because the competition just couldn't keep up, and that's on them
  - thedance 7y ago
    The API for BB app development allowed you to have UI elements like text labels or buttons, stacked vertically on the screen. That was the whole thing. If you wanted a table you were on your own. The web browser was very similar to MSIE 3, or NetPositive: it laid everything out vertically, didn’t support tables or CSS. When the iPhone came out with a real web browser it was like it came from another galaxy.
    - exikyut 7y ago
      I get the vertical UI was because the system had initially gone all-in on a scrollwheel, and never fundamentally moved on beyond that point.
- thoraway1010 7y ago
  Same revolt happened with users, including executives. There was tons of pressure to stay with Blackberry (it WAS the monopoly incumbent - almost every major IT department had invested in it - telcos loved it for the $$$). Seriously - someone like Obama or Trump would be told they could only use a blackberry because it was more "secure" supposedly. Users told the same thing. From top to bottom after folks got to try out the iphone from apple (no telco lock in at start at all - I bought the iphone 1 full price in cash when sold) just would not go back to blackberry. It actually worked out for a while. people carried two phones. The blackberry required by their work and an iphone. The crazy thing is blackberry just kept on falling behind in huge leaps backwards. It was nuts. Apple's execution was really pretty good given the ramp they had.
- exikyut 7y ago
  Was this conference recorded anywhere?
toast0 7y ago
Windows Phone was a victim of Microsoft for the most part. Windows Phone 7 was incompatible with Windows Mobile 6, so developers had to start over. Windows phone 8 had a new prefered app framework, so developers needed to support two apps. Windows mobile 10 had a new prefered app framework that was ironically called universal; but windows mobile 10 was released without any of the polish of previous windows phone releases and without any low end phones, so it never had more users than windows phone 8 or 7. If windows mobile 10 had a well organized release, it might still be a thing. The only company to blame for that is Microsoft.
scarface74 7y ago
BlackBerry was outselling iPhones, 3 years after the iPhone was introduced. BlackBerry lost because of incompetence.
- zimpenfish 7y ago
  Thing I remember most about my BlackBerry was a system update taking the better part, if not more, of an hour. A power cycle would take 10-15 minutes. Everything was just ... treacle. The iPhone 4 was no speed demon but it was night and day to the BlackBerry.
- simonh 7y ago
  That was only possible because BlackBerry cut their prices to the bare bones. They basically resorted to only competing with basic non feature phones. As such they enjoyed a fair bit of popularity, they were better than phones with only basic call and text capabilities, but they weren't making any money.

thedance 7y ago

I mean, no. BlackBerry was a victim of having a terrible product going head to head with the iPhone. As a development platform it was garbage. I vividly remember the inaugural BlackBerry developer conference where one of the sessions devolved into a revolt. People had written apps for the iPhone and they were not pleased with the APIs on the BB. Every attendee at that conference was supposed to receive a 9000 but they shipped a year late. RIM needed no duopoly to kill them. They died of natural causes.

mardifoufs 7y ago
Yep, I think people tend to forget how bad the blackberry line up was compared to the iPhones and even androids they were competing against. Their flagship in ~2011 was the Bold, which could barely browse the internet, had a horrible camera and an extremely dated UI. Going up against the iPhone 4s which is still functional to this day. Sometimes some companies just deserve to fail. The current duopoly formed because the competition just couldn't keep up, and that's on them
- thedance 7y ago
  The API for BB app development allowed you to have UI elements like text labels or buttons, stacked vertically on the screen. That was the whole thing. If you wanted a table you were on your own. The web browser was very similar to MSIE 3, or NetPositive: it laid everything out vertically, didn’t support tables or CSS. When the iPhone came out with a real web browser it was like it came from another galaxy.
  - exikyut 7y ago
    I get the vertical UI was because the system had initially gone all-in on a scrollwheel, and never fundamentally moved on beyond that point.
thoraway1010 7y ago
Same revolt happened with users, including executives. There was tons of pressure to stay with Blackberry (it WAS the monopoly incumbent - almost every major IT department had invested in it - telcos loved it for the $$$). Seriously - someone like Obama or Trump would be told they could only use a blackberry because it was more "secure" supposedly. Users told the same thing. From top to bottom after folks got to try out the iphone from apple (no telco lock in at start at all - I bought the iphone 1 full price in cash when sold) just would not go back to blackberry. It actually worked out for a while. people carried two phones. The blackberry required by their work and an iphone. The crazy thing is blackberry just kept on falling behind in huge leaps backwards. It was nuts. Apple's execution was really pretty good given the ramp they had.
exikyut 7y ago
Was this conference recorded anywhere?

toast0 7y ago

Windows Phone was a victim of Microsoft for the most part. Windows Phone 7 was incompatible with Windows Mobile 6, so developers had to start over. Windows phone 8 had a new prefered app framework, so developers needed to support two apps. Windows mobile 10 had a new prefered app framework that was ironically called universal; but windows mobile 10 was released without any of the polish of previous windows phone releases and without any low end phones, so it never had more users than windows phone 8 or 7. If windows mobile 10 had a well organized release, it might still be a thing. The only company to blame for that is Microsoft.

scarface74 7y ago

BlackBerry was outselling iPhones, 3 years after the iPhone was introduced. BlackBerry lost because of incompetence.

zimpenfish 7y ago
Thing I remember most about my BlackBerry was a system update taking the better part, if not more, of an hour. A power cycle would take 10-15 minutes. Everything was just ... treacle. The iPhone 4 was no speed demon but it was night and day to the BlackBerry.
simonh 7y ago
That was only possible because BlackBerry cut their prices to the bare bones. They basically resorted to only competing with basic non feature phones. As such they enjoyed a fair bit of popularity, they were better than phones with only basic call and text capabilities, but they weren't making any money.