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Clearview’s App Used by Justice Department, ICE, Macy’s, Walmart, and the NBA
- prophesi 7y agoIs there a news site that actually shows the leaked list of clients?
- bobthepanda 7y agoBreach consumer trust at your own peril. At some tipping point I could see HIPAA-style mandates come into force for general data.
- kevin_thibedeau 7y agoIt'll take a few libel suits for false accusations first. Plus a court willing to award meaningful damages.
- A4ET8a8uTh0 7y agoI would like to say you are right, but the pendulum seems to swinging in the direction of rendering HIPAA toothless. Breaking point may cone, but I have zero idea what it will be given the breaches we already saw.
- michaelbuckbee 7y agoThe largest effect of data privacy regulations is on self-policing behavior. Every person at every hospital in the US knows what HIPAA is and is at least aware of it and potential impacts. There is training, consideration is given to it with respect to IT decisions, etc. It is a very different set of behaviors than pre-HIPAA. Same with GDPR, you very clearly see large corporations at least asking: "Do we need this data?" and there's a patchwork of state privacy laws (CCPA being the most prominent) that are in effect. Case in point: Illinois has really stringent biometric data laws that include facial recognition and I would not be surprised at all if they were right now preparing for legal action against Clearview for violations.
- maxerickson 7y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Consumer_Privacy_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Consumer_Privacy_Ac... Took effect this year.
- bobthepanda 7y agoI'd hope to see something like this at the national level, but state level is a good start.
- mokus 7y agoMaybe it’s petty but I kind of like the idea of it being a morass of 50 different privacy laws so that a company has to tiptoe through a global minefield to sell data about me.
- vanadium 7y agoThe NYPA seems to have more HIPAA-like teeth to it. https://www.adweek.com/digital/new-yorks-privacy-bill-failed-last-session-but-it-gives-us-a-look-at-what-future-laws-might-look-like/ https://www.adweek.com/digital/new-yorks-privacy-bill-failed...
- ocdtrekkie 7y agoIllinois’ biometric data law has already started to make it's way into some courts: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biometric_Information_Privacy_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biometric_Information_Privacy_...
- markovbot 7y agoPerhaps you haven't been paying attention recently to how things go in the US. If there is any kind of regulation, it will be loophole-ridden and only implemented after consulting with the absolute worst offenders to make sure it won't impact their bottom line too much. Law enforcement's use of this style of abusive technology will never be curtailed or in any way reigned in, but seeing as American law enforcement has never abused their power in the past, I'm sure that will continue to not be an issue.
- JohnFen 7y ago> I could see HIPAA-style mandates That would be helpful, but let's not forget that HIPAA isn't exactly some sort of gold standard. It's reasonably weak and full of loopholes.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- microdrum 7y agoSo it was just a list of customers that was leaked? Sounds like a CRM hack or something.
- MR4D 7y agoI presume the NBA learned that from China? Oh, wait... /sarcasm
- sailfast 7y agoAre there any examples so far around gross mis-use of this data? Building a large list of potential suspects and/or getting some direction for further study based on a face match sounds very useful, but sending a swat team to someone's house and ruining their lives based on a terrible match on a crappy picture is a whole other side of the scale. I understand why a company collecting this information is annoying / frustrating, but it was also inevitable, was it not? EDIT: Example, LinkedIn just got told by a court that they must allow crawling. A quick crawl of profiles and photos would yield a beginning of one of these types of databases, etc - one it's on the web, you have to assume it can be used for facial recognition. Either way I am happy that people are recognizing the import of what they post online - even if it's just a picture.
- llamataboot 7y agoI think I'd refer to it more as "terrifying" and "unpreventable without regulation" more than annoying myself.
- sailfast 7y agoI agree it is terrifying. Is it really preventable with regulation though? You can't really put the data back in the box.
- Scoundreller 7y ago> Building a large list of potential suspects and/or getting some direction for further study based on a face match sounds very useful, but sending a swat team to someone's house and ruining their lives based on a terrible match on a crappy picture is a whole other side of the scale. How do we know they were inputting pictures of suspects? Could have inputted people they have a beef with, ex-girlfriends/boyfriends, ex-spouses, online dating profiles, annoying non-criminal activists, citizens/politicians that threaten police budgets, etc.
- sp332 7y agoClearview encouraged customers and potential customers to abuse their access. https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/ryanmac/clearview-ai-cops-run-wild-facial-recognition-lawsuits https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/ryanmac/clearview-ai-co... "Clearview has also previously instructed police to act in direct violation of the company's code of conduct, which was outlined in a blog post on Monday."
- jppope 7y agoI'm curious if we're entitled to royalties when our likeness gets used. Anyone know one way or another?
- binarymax 7y agoProbably not. Only if it’s a photo that you own the copyright of, and you didn’t divest that copyright when you gave the photo to a site that had a reshare clause in its terms of use.
- paulryanrogers 7y agoDidn't Harrison Ford trademark his face? Then they have to pay him to use it on toys and mechanise?
- sgc 7y agoCould I trademark someone else's face and claim royalties? It seems like a legal stretch, or at least indicates a legal reality I can't support. Unless he has secretly had so much plastic surgery he designed it.
- JohnFen 7y ago> Could I trademark someone else's face and claim royalties? To get a trademark, the mark you're registering has to be actively used in commerce. There are other laws that come into play if you're using someone else's likeness in commerce. The entire purpose of trademark is to prevent consumer confusion (for instance, to prevent one company from using another company's logo on their products).
- redler 7y agoIs the Obey logo trademarked?
- bosswipe 7y agoDo you give up copyright when you upload photos to Facebook or LinkedIn?
- sp332 7y ago"Reporting this story was surreal. Numerous organizations initially denied that they had ever used Clearview. We then followed up, and those same orgs later found that employees had signed up and used the software without approval from higher ups. This happened multiple times." https://twitter.com/RMac18/status/1233151964881416192 https://twitter.com/RMac18/status/1233151964881416192
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- yellow_lead 7y agoI know it's been brought up before, but again, I would love to know the mental gymnastics Peter Thiel has done to rationalize backing this. The same Peter Thiel that sued Gawker for violating his privacy.
- Gibbon1 7y agoIt's the difference between liberty and equality. Thiel loves liberty (his) and hates equality (yours).
- burkaman 7y agoThis one makes him money.
- railys 7y agoWhy are you surprised by him? He's highly intelligent, and absolutely without scruples. The perfect businessman. He's a good model for the future of AI, where superintelligence's goals conflicts with basic human values.
- icanhackit 7y ago> I would love to know the mental gymnastics Nothing special. Cognitive dissonance is alive and well in the filthy-rich through to the dirt-poor. As we can see - your level of personal agency will be the determining factor in how much the world suffers from it. Unfortunately we silo our processes in virtual-mental-machines at the expense of good ideas cross-pollinating terrible ones.
- maram 7y agoThiel and Rudy Giuliani's pal ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Here is a quote from a NYTimes story that was published last month, and got updated this month https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/18/technology/clearview-privacy-facial-recognition.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/18/technology/clearview-priv... >>In addition to Mr. Ton-That, Clearview was founded by Richard Schwartz — who was an aide to Rudolph W. Giuliani when he was mayor of New York — and backed financially by Peter Thiel, a venture capitalist behind Facebook and Palantir.
- tmpynews 7y ago
- sneak 7y agoAt what point are end users responsible for data they publish globally, such as instagram images?
- uoaei 7y agoSo much for "our only customers are law enforcement"
- bogomipz 7y agoThe amount of retail and mundane consumer businesses on here is really disturbing: Best Buy, Equinox Gym, Rite Aid Pharmacy, Home Depot, Kohls Department store? What is going on? What possible use cases do these companies have that require facial recognition searches?
- moandcompany 7y agoFor retail businesses, it's likely related to loss-prevention and shoplifting.
- bogomipz 7y agoCould you walk me through how that would work in practice though. Aren't these searches manual? How would this be an effective tool in something concerned with real time like loss prevention?
- dylan604 7y agoIt doesn't really take a stretch of the imagination to come up with something. Ever seen Minority Report? They used retinal scans to ID shoppers to provide them with targeted ads, just replace that with facial recoginition. For the security/loss prevention aspect, stores have cameras on all of the entrances. The facial recognition systems could ID known shoplifters/return scammers/etc and alert security for "closer" scrutiny.
- bogomipz 7y agoBut it's not a real time system. You have to have a target and do a search. From Clearview's homepage: "Clearview is an after-the-fact research tool. Clearview is not a surveillance system and is not built like one. For example, analysts upload images from crime scenes and compare them to publicly available images." Do you imagine Rite Aid and Equinox Gym which are not exactly bastions of technology are developing sophisticated Minority Report type systems?
- moandcompany 7y ago
- kylek 7y agoLooks like Californians and Europeans can opt out of something (if you upload a photo ........ ) https://clearview.ai/privacy/requests https://clearview.ai/privacy/requests
- chopin 7y agoOpt-out is not legal under GDPR.
- tmpynews 7y agoThat NPR story on this is very informative. Clearview actually has a list of all journalists and they programmed th journalist's photos into their application flow. They automatically block and even take away the license of the individual that is talking to the reporter.
- anitil 7y agoAny chance you have a link?
- bgilly 7y agoThe Daily podcast has an episode on this called "The end of privacy as we know it" https://pca.st//episode/3af9bbfd-6992-429c-9b54-c646b288aef1 https://pca.st//episode/3af9bbfd-6992-429c-9b54-c646b288aef1 which discusses the reporter's info being masked and the police officer who worked with her having his access revoked.
- sergiotapia 7y agoStop using your real names, use pseudonyms and drop random incorrect pieces of information. These companies can detect you based on writing style alone!
- xfitm3 7y agoI buy groceries at my local Walmart neighborhood market and they recently replaced the self checkout kiosks with NCR systems that video your face while checking out. Seems to me that I need to use a spare bag to cover the camera, or wait in line for a human next time I go shopping.
- bobbylarrybobby 7y agoYou don't think the human-operated registers will eventually also have cameras next to them?
- dkdk8283 7y agoI don’t know, but I certainly hope not. If this happens I don’t know how I can shop.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- jgaa 7y agoThe only relevant response to this is to remove all pictures from Linkedin, Github and social sites - and only publish pictures on sites we control our self where we claim 100% copyright for all pictures. May be we could offer these pictures for sale to 3rd party use, for a small fee of few hundred million euros per picture. If someon scrape them and use that information commerially, and we somehow discover that, it's just to send them an invoice and see them in court.
- hatenberg 7y agoBut but China. America really needs a mirror sometimes. Maybe the VP copying the Chinese health care PR handbook should be another warning.