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Secret doorway in UK Parliament leads to historical treasure trove
- jerome-jh 7y agoSo the treasure is a light bulb? Pretty boring.
- onion2k 7y agoAny hoard of gold and jewels would have been pilfered by the politicians years ago.
- StarDucks 7y agoHow did they just so happen to have the key to a hidden door that hadn't been opened in 68 years that they didn't even know existed?
- fenaer 7y agoThey didn't have the key. The team turned to Parliament's locksmith for help and, with some difficulty, he was able to open the wood panel door, to reveal a tiny, stone-floored chamber, with a bricked-up doorway on the far wall. Looks like the locksmith picked it maybe?
- gnud 7y agoThe locksmith got the door open. It doesn't say he had the key.
- asynch8 7y agoNope, but the video doesn't mention how they acquired the key either, they just demonstrate how it opens. I'll be honest and say that I didn't read very far into the article either and just skimmed it while listening to the video.
- toyg 7y agoThey didn’t, they made a new key. An old lock for a service door is likely to be trivial to crack these days. Edit: from the Guardian: “Liz Hallam Smith, the team’s historical consultant from the University of York, said: “[...] Once a key was made for it, the panelling opened up like a door into this secret entrance.”
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- toyg 7y agoI wonder if the “graffiti artist” Tom Porter and the recorded stonemason Thomas Parker, are actually the same person. A cockney accent interacting with an RP ear would make Porter and Parker quite similar. Name misspellings of labourers were likely very common before mass-education was introduced in late XIX century.
- foldr 7y ago>A cockney accent interacting with an RP ear would make Porter and Parker quite similar Not really? The first vowel and third consonant are different in both dialects. (Note that while the 't' in Porter is subject to t-glottalization, the 'k' in Parker isn't.)
- thaumasiotes 7y ago> The first vowel and third consonant are different in both dialects. To my eye, each word has no more than two consonants in RP?
- foldr 7y agoTo your ear you mean? Yes, both dialects are non-rhotic. I mean the third orthographically.
- thaumasiotes 7y agoNo, I meant to my eye; I don't speak RP. But what training I have says to analyze e.g. "parker" as CVCV, p-ar-k-er. I don't see more difficulty in saying "ar" is the first vowel in "parker" than in saying "th" is the second consonant in "wither"...
- foldr 7y agoOrthographically speaking, 'p' is the first consonant, 'r' is the second consonant, and 'k' is the third consonant. Phonetically speaking, 'k' is the second consonant.
- coder1001 7y agoI guess these things get lost overtime if there is no system of documenting what happened and is happening with any building over a long period of time? A nice startup idea would be to create a system/website/app that documents what happens to any building over time including all maintenance and future plans! City councils have something like this but I imagine it is pretty simple and does not capture a lot.
- arethuza 7y agoI think that's what BIM systems are for: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Building_information_modeling https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Building_information_modeling
- coder1001 7y agoA startup that simplifies the process/visualisation and makes it accessible to whoever is going to use it will always win!
- DizzyDoo 7y ago> For some reason I feel like anything IBM does is overly complicated and over the top! I think you've misread 'BIM' as 'IBM'. Building Information Modelling is a specific task for software, as the linked wiki page describes.
- coder1001 7y agoYes I did! Sorry, edited the comment! Thanks
- pjc50 7y agoIn some ways the app is easy. Capturing what happens is not, especially if there's no immediate incentive to do so. And writing an app in 2020 doesn't tell you want happened in 1660. Then you have to cope with app longevity; most apps deployed in 2020 will be dead by 2030 while the Houses of Parliament will still be there (unless they burn down due to ongoing fire code issues)
- anonsivalley652 7y agoOrrrrrrrrrder! (While I go "inspect" the jewels.) (Too bad, no more Bercow in the HoC; he'll have to say it in lecture halls from now on. :')
- known 7y agoBritish are known for building many escape routes e.g. The road in 1942 as an evacuation route in preparation for a possible Japanese invasion of South India. With a maximum elevation of 2,480 meters (8,140 ft) just south of Vandaravu Peak, it was among the highest roads in India, south of the Himalayas, prior to its closure in 1990 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kodaikanal%E2%80%93Munnar_Road https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kodaikanal%E2%80%93Munnar_Road
- foxx-boxx 7y agoThe official history says Peter the Great of Russia used that door to eavesdrop the British Parliament while he was invited to the UK. He was wondered and puzzled by hearing democratic Parliament, as we all know, British people are very noisy, when the gather together, they all speak simultaneously. Russia (like China, India and then Arabs) was occupied by Mongols and had no connection to Europe for centuries.
- cosmodisk 7y agoI can almost imagine Boris Johnson pushing everybody aside whilst approaching the tiny door and screaming: "Let me through,let me through! The gold is all mine,the gold is all mine!" Obviously all this happening while Patel smirking in the shadows knowing too well that the gold was stolen by Cameron ages ago.
- nallerooth 7y agoI wonder how much history would be lost to us if people didn't write stuff on walls. :D
- thaumasiotes 7y agoI recall reading a hand-wringing article about a canyon with a lot of ancient Native American graffiti carved on the walls, and how it was in a state of crisis because modern American teenagers kept carving their own graffiti on the walls. I don't really see how we can defend the idea that the ancient graffiti is historically valuable and it's a good thing it was left there, but the modern graffiti is a menace that needs to be stamped out.
- JoeAltmaier 7y agoI get the idea - the old stuff was impulsive nonsense too, of no more real value except as it illuminates how the human spirit never changes much. But older-is-better/more important is a foundational principle of historical academics.
- wyattpeak 7y agoThat's not really the idea - ancient graffiti is of vastly more value that the mere fact that someone wrote it. Ancient graffiti gives us insight into language and pronunciation (misspelling is very useful in reconstructing pronunciation), aspects of life considered taboo or otherwise unworthy of educated record (sex, usually), the lives of the comparatively poor and unimportant. It tells us about who was where, when, and doing what, in a way official records (if they exist) often don't. Many of the things we've learned from graffiti can't be learned elsewhere. Things really would be lost to future historians if we managed to stamp out modern graffiti. Thankfully, we won't, so the question is moot.
- roywiggins 7y agoYou might as well ask why ancient cesspools are historically valuable and best left alone for archaeologists to work on, while we still clean garbage off the streets. It's because they're old and rare. A pile of modern garbage? Not interesting. A pile of Roman garbage? That's an archaeological site.
- lorenzhs 7y agoThere's a great (long) article on the building of the Palace of Westminster at https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/dec/01/a-tale-of-decay-the-houses-of-parliament-are-falling-down https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/dec/01/a-tale-of-decay..., on how new infrastructure has just been added over time, never removing the old stuff because there's no time, and—with plans being lost—how this results in new shafts being found every now and then in the course of fixing leaks etc.
- Drakar1903 7y agoGood to see both software architects and architecture architects run into same issues with legacy stuff.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- a3n 7y agoBlocking a hall is like commenting out code.
- dnadler 7y agoHa, more like putting it in a block like `if (debug == True) ...`
- ignoramous 7y agoQuite famously, software design patterns take inspiration from the field of Architecture [0]. The industry would do well to learn from them in how they deal with legacy systems, as well? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_design_pattern#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_design_pattern#Histor...
- walrus01 7y agoBy the time of the Truman presidency, apparently the White House was in such poor condition that the only way to save it was to entirely gut its interior and rebuild. It was gutted so thoroughly that they're driving heavy earth moving equipment around inside the building. There's a good photo at: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_House#Truman_reconstruction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_House#Truman_reconstruct... Looks like they kept the external walls and built a new steel frame inside.
- sjg007 7y agoThere’s the plot for National Treasure 3 and 4z
- mprev 7y agoI wonder if the file format they use to store the digitised plans will still be readable 300 years from now.
- walrus01 7y agoArchitectural plans in vector format are quite small in file size. I imagine it will be more of a ship of theseus type situation, where the files reside on one big NAS/SAN type system (which of course has backups) and are migrated while online to new bigger storage systems over time, repeat several many dozen times.
- mcphage 7y agoThe UK does have some experience with that gang aft agley: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_Domesday_Project https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BBC_Domesday_Project
- james_anderson 7y agoReminds me of the castle in Gormenghast
- walrus01 7y agoIt's not every day that you see a news article reference dendrochronology https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dendrochronology https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dendrochronology
- noisy_boy 7y agoWhen I was a young boy, I had fantasies of such secret doorways/passages/treasures being everywhere due to consumption of copious stories/comics involving such plots. When I did visit old ruins/temples etc, my searching eyes would be looking for that overlooked odd stone that was waiting for centuries just to be pushed so that it can reveal its ancient secrets. Reading this discovery of the secret doorway sort of gave me a sense of vicarious validation.
- andrepd 7y agoReading Don Rosa treasure hunts made me that way as well x)
- everyone 7y agoMe and my friend once discovered one when we were kids.. Dunno what age we were, say 8.. We were exploring this abandoned country estate house that was near his house.. In a library there was one shelf that was still filled with books, turns they were fake books and the shelf was a door. It led to a stone staircase going down to a little underground chapel.. It was super creepy at the time.. Awesome experience tho. I still remember it obvs. That house has since been done up and is a super posh hotel / golf course now. Now called 'Faithlegg house hotel'.
- MockObject 7y agoI wonder why anyone would take such pains to hide an innocent chapel.
- MrL567 7y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clandestine_church https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clandestine_church Hidden chapels are fairly common in Europe during the Reformation when one could not be a practicing Catholic in a Protestant country and vice versa.
- jpollock 7y agoIf it was in the UK, there was a period of time when the monarch was Catholic and burned Protestants at the stake and then the monarch changed and then the Catholics started getting burned. People of the "wrong" religion would have to practice in secret. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Priest_hole https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Priest_hole
- ocdtrekkie 7y agoMy honest first question when I read this is: Isn't knowing about every single passage and doorway absolutely critical to security in a facility where high risk persons work? It seems absolutely crazy to me to think that, as a US comparison, they would let the President go anywhere that might have passages the Secret Service is unaware of.
- chrisseaton 7y ago> It seems absolutely crazy to me to think that, as a US comparison, they would let the President go anywhere that might have passages the Secret Service is unaware of. Since the US President does occasionally visit the Palace of Westminster, we know the Secret Service demonstrably do allow him to go to such places.
- btilly 7y agoThis is a building where people are literally employed to walk the halls so that if there is a fire, it will be noticed in time to save the building. This is also a building where Parliament can be shut down for a day because a pipe burst and flooded the chambers where they deliberate. (Happened about a year ago during Brexit deliberations.) This is also a building where they know that they need to spend billions on renovations but can't. On the flip side, this also has one of the most impressive remaining medieval roofs in existence. Contains the lobby that gave us the word "lobbying". And contains more history than any building that you can find in the USA. If ever you go to London, get a tour of it. Seriously.
- Mvandenbergh 7y ago>This is also a building where they know that they need to spend billions on renovations but can't. Second line of the article: "Historians working on the renovation of the House of Commons found the lost 360-year-old passageway, hidden in a secret chamber." Planning permission has been filed for the first phase of works, not actually on the Palace of Westminster but on the other side of Portcullis House, to renovate those buildings so that everyone can move there for the years it will take to renovate.
- HendrikR 7y agoMost remarkable: "The bulb that still worked after 70 years" - "A light switch - probably installed in the 1950s - illuminated a large Osram bulb marked 'HM Government Property'."
- jsilence 7y agoYes there is a lightbulb conspiracy among producers that deliberately and jointly shortened the life span of their products in order to ramp up sales.
- dijit 7y agoThere's some truth to the fact that lightbulbs don't last as long as they used to; but there's a lot to unpick here. First: This bulb was not turned on, and a light-bulb in storage does not degrade, there's no oxidisation happening inside the bulb itself. Second: heavy filaments consume more power to emit light, and a heavy filament is the requirement to have a long-lived bulb Third: Even with a heavy filament, bulbs will dim in their light output with years of use. The longest running light bulb in the world (101 powered on years if I'm not mistaken) is less bright than a candle, although originally it was about as bright as a 40w bulb. More information on that bulb: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centennial_Light https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centennial_Light
- jacquesm 7y ago> and a light-bulb in storage does not degrade Depends on the quality of the seal and how well it was evacuated. Older bulbs tend to be higher quality, thicker glass, much more material around the seal (the spot where the wires cross through from inside the bulb to outside).
- pier25 7y agoAlso I imagine these bulbs from the 50s were more expensive than today's bulbs, no?
- jsilence 7y agoFor those downvoting me, here is the link to the trailer of the documentary of this 'planned obsolescence' conspiracy of the producers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KSC84K4rcY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KSC84K4rcY
- auiya 7y agoThere is also a pathway under the Ministry of Defense building to the preserved remains of Henry VIII's wine cellar. MoD is built on top of a section of the former Whitehall palace. It's a cool site to see that's closed off from the general public. I've been fortunate enough to visit, and it's perfectly preserved. One day when the MoD is done with that building, perhaps it will open to the public again. http://stuffaboutlondon.co.uk/london/henry-viiis-wine-cellar/ http://stuffaboutlondon.co.uk/london/henry-viiis-wine-cellar...
- sm4rk0 7y agoCan someone please mark that hidden passageway on this plan? http://images.adsttc.com/media/images/5763/6e3a/e58e/ce0d/8700/0050/newsletter/IMG_016.jpg http://images.adsttc.com/media/images/5763/6e3a/e58e/ce0d/87...
- smacktoward 7y agoThe American version might be the long-hidden Senate Bathtubs: https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/senate-bathtubs https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/senate-bathtubs
- pbhjpbhj 7y agoThree things intrigue me about this: 1) why did they release this today? They've had time to clean it (that door is spotless on the inside), and to wire in electrics [or they were there and this is a fraud] -- so why today, what's happening that they're keeping out of the news ... (it happens, witness Boris's "bus collection" story). 2) who in this day and age installs brass light switches, where did they even buy that switch this week (presumably this week, or how long have they been sitting on it)? 3) does Parliament really need it's own locksmith, or do they mean they booked their regular locksmith to come? Anyway, nice little puff piece.
- ggm 7y agoThe tunnel had electric lights? So.. lost in the sense that within the last seventy years somebody forgot, not lost for 170 years.