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Quite impressed with the valuation. Transferwise Borderless seems to have a better business model with sane prices and not "everything free". And Revolut stil

Quite impressed with the valuation. Transferwise Borderless seems to have a better business model with sane prices and not "everything free". And Revolut still uses their e-money license instead of their proper Lithuanian banking license. Quite surprising.

Kkoala 7y ago
Yep, Transferwise Borderless is quite great. They also offer things that Revolut doesn't such as U.S. bank account, plus Revolut just feels bloated and complex with hidden fees.
- romasato 7y ago
  Not sure what hidden fees are you referring to? As far as I can tell, all the fees are explained on their website and in the app.
  - Kkoala 7y ago
    On the website it just says things like "No fee ATM withdrawals up to €200 per month", but what about after 200€?? I found a help section that is vague too saying "We can provide an estimate of the potential fees...", so not very transparent. Transferwise you can see/calculate on the frontpage what the fee will be.
    - ValentineC 7y ago
      > On the website it just says things like "No fee ATM withdrawals up to €200 per month", but what about after 200€?? TransferWise debit card's landing page [1] doesn't have the ATM fee either. Their pricing page [2] does. I was able to find Revolut's pricing page [3], which includes the ATM fee, with a simple search. [1] https://transferwise.com/gb/borderless/card https://transferwise.com/gb/borderless/card [2] https://transferwise.com/gb/borderless/pricing https://transferwise.com/gb/borderless/pricing [3] https://www.revolut.com/legal/fees https://www.revolut.com/legal/fees
      - Aeolun 7y ago
        2% of all withdrawals?! WTF is this insanity. I thought it might be interesting for a bit, but never mind. Are they preying on people that live in countries without a working banking system?
        jermaustin1 7y ago
        I cannot tell if you are being sarcastic or not, but here in the US almost ever ATM that isn't at YOUR bank will charge a $2-$5 fee for withdrawal and then the bank will hit you with another $2-$5 fee. So depending on your bank, if you want $20, it could cost you $10. OR (story time) if you are like me, and you end up needing cash in rural Oklahoma to pay an upcoming cash-only toll, and you pull off at the ONLY gas station between you and the toll, you could get hit with a $20 fee to pull out $20 (because its a freaking casino). That said, there are many online-only banks that are part of ATM groups that have 100k free atms at various places all over. I use them. And when traveling abroad, oddly enough the best cash card I've ever had is a CapitalOne debit card. I only use it when traveling, but no FX fees, and no ATM fees. So in the UK, most of the major banks and grocery chains have free ATMs, so I get free access to my money even abroad.
        ValentineC 7y ago
        > I only use it when traveling, but no FX fees, and no ATM fees. Do they reimburse your ATM fees if you were to use a third-party ATM in the US, or just not charge you an additional fee to withdraw at third-party ATMs?
        jermaustin1 7y ago
        I actually have never tested that theory out. I probably have $30 on it currently (haven't gone out of country in a few months, so haven't needed to fill it), I'll try to pull money out at the next ATM I come across and reply here.
        ValentineC 7y ago
- superpermutat0r 7y ago
  I also like the fact that if I have lets say $100 in various currencies (10 different currencies) and try to pay for something valued $95 in some other currency, Revolut will not make the purchase but Transferwise will autoconvert between the currencies and make the purchase. Revolut only autoconverts if one currency has $95 equivalent.
juskrey 7y ago
Transferwise has real human phone support, which so far was great for my business account. +1 for prices - I am paying Transferwise fees with pleasure, knowing all those money are returning back to me via great services.
- throwaway3157 7y ago
  I haven't used Borderless, but Transferwise in general has been fantastic. I looked at Revolut, but have been too happy with Transferwise to even truly consider it
literallycancer 7y ago
There's less reporting requirements for e-money IIRC.
khweroii 7y ago
I actually moved from TransferWise to Revolut, because Revolut has somewhat better FX rates (TransferWise rates are also good).
- ValentineC 7y ago
  I've been using Revolut to transfer money between countries because of its near-perfect exchange rate on weekdays, but I fear the day my account would suddenly be locked for weeks because I hit some secret anti-money laundering limit, or because I'm suddenly seen as a customer who is just making them lose money.
  - rciorba 7y ago
    I had that happen recently. Fortunately I was not in a rush. I had to complain on social media after the situation hadn't been resolved in a couple of weeks, then magically I got some proper support.
kashyapc 7y ago
TransferWise has a robust "no bovine manure" approach. I've used different kinds of services from them over four years, and they have been consistently excellent. I make sure to tell so whenever I talk to them, and politely make a note to not lose sight of the valuable things that customers are happy about (transparency, competent human support). And I like it that they charge a decent price. I have a general allergy to "gratis services", especially in finance-related things.
tempotemporary 7y ago
I wouldn’t say it’s “everything free”. If you purchase outside of FOREX hours you pay 2% on top of every tx. People tend to spend more when they have free time, i.e. on weekends, where the 2% fee applies. My guess is that Revolut is doing just great in terms of revenue.

Kkoala 7y ago

Yep, Transferwise Borderless is quite great. They also offer things that Revolut doesn't such as U.S. bank account, plus Revolut just feels bloated and complex with hidden fees.

romasato 7y ago
Not sure what hidden fees are you referring to? As far as I can tell, all the fees are explained on their website and in the app.
- Kkoala 7y ago
  On the website it just says things like "No fee ATM withdrawals up to €200 per month", but what about after 200€?? I found a help section that is vague too saying "We can provide an estimate of the potential fees...", so not very transparent. Transferwise you can see/calculate on the frontpage what the fee will be.
  - ValentineC 7y ago
    > On the website it just says things like "No fee ATM withdrawals up to €200 per month", but what about after 200€?? TransferWise debit card's landing page [1] doesn't have the ATM fee either. Their pricing page [2] does. I was able to find Revolut's pricing page [3], which includes the ATM fee, with a simple search. [1] https://transferwise.com/gb/borderless/card https://transferwise.com/gb/borderless/card [2] https://transferwise.com/gb/borderless/pricing https://transferwise.com/gb/borderless/pricing [3] https://www.revolut.com/legal/fees https://www.revolut.com/legal/fees
    - Aeolun 7y ago
      2% of all withdrawals?! WTF is this insanity. I thought it might be interesting for a bit, but never mind. Are they preying on people that live in countries without a working banking system?
      - jermaustin1 7y ago
        I cannot tell if you are being sarcastic or not, but here in the US almost ever ATM that isn't at YOUR bank will charge a $2-$5 fee for withdrawal and then the bank will hit you with another $2-$5 fee. So depending on your bank, if you want $20, it could cost you $10. OR (story time) if you are like me, and you end up needing cash in rural Oklahoma to pay an upcoming cash-only toll, and you pull off at the ONLY gas station between you and the toll, you could get hit with a $20 fee to pull out $20 (because its a freaking casino). That said, there are many online-only banks that are part of ATM groups that have 100k free atms at various places all over. I use them. And when traveling abroad, oddly enough the best cash card I've ever had is a CapitalOne debit card. I only use it when traveling, but no FX fees, and no ATM fees. So in the UK, most of the major banks and grocery chains have free ATMs, so I get free access to my money even abroad.
        ValentineC 7y ago
        > I only use it when traveling, but no FX fees, and no ATM fees. Do they reimburse your ATM fees if you were to use a third-party ATM in the US, or just not charge you an additional fee to withdraw at third-party ATMs?
        jermaustin1 7y ago
        I actually have never tested that theory out. I probably have $30 on it currently (haven't gone out of country in a few months, so haven't needed to fill it), I'll try to pull money out at the next ATM I come across and reply here.
        ValentineC 7y ago
superpermutat0r 7y ago
I also like the fact that if I have lets say $100 in various currencies (10 different currencies) and try to pay for something valued $95 in some other currency, Revolut will not make the purchase but Transferwise will autoconvert between the currencies and make the purchase. Revolut only autoconverts if one currency has $95 equivalent.

juskrey 7y ago

Transferwise has real human phone support, which so far was great for my business account. +1 for prices - I am paying Transferwise fees with pleasure, knowing all those money are returning back to me via great services.

throwaway3157 7y ago
I haven't used Borderless, but Transferwise in general has been fantastic. I looked at Revolut, but have been too happy with Transferwise to even truly consider it

literallycancer 7y ago

There's less reporting requirements for e-money IIRC.

khweroii 7y ago

I actually moved from TransferWise to Revolut, because Revolut has somewhat better FX rates (TransferWise rates are also good).

ValentineC 7y ago
I've been using Revolut to transfer money between countries because of its near-perfect exchange rate on weekdays, but I fear the day my account would suddenly be locked for weeks because I hit some secret anti-money laundering limit, or because I'm suddenly seen as a customer who is just making them lose money.
- rciorba 7y ago
  I had that happen recently. Fortunately I was not in a rush. I had to complain on social media after the situation hadn't been resolved in a couple of weeks, then magically I got some proper support.

kashyapc 7y ago

TransferWise has a robust "no bovine manure" approach. I've used different kinds of services from them over four years, and they have been consistently excellent. I make sure to tell so whenever I talk to them, and politely make a note to not lose sight of the valuable things that customers are happy about (transparency, competent human support). And I like it that they charge a decent price. I have a general allergy to "gratis services", especially in finance-related things.

tempotemporary 7y ago

I wouldn’t say it’s “everything free”. If you purchase outside of FOREX hours you pay 2% on top of every tx. People tend to spend more when they have free time, i.e. on weekends, where the 2% fee applies. My guess is that Revolut is doing just great in terms of revenue.