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Dude, I've worked as an ER/Critical care nurse for years. I push a drug, a person's heart rate changes. I tweak a drug on an IV pump, a person's blood pressur

Dude, I've worked as an ER/Critical care nurse for years. I push a drug, a person's heart rate changes. I tweak a drug on an IV pump, a person's blood pressure comes out of shock and normalizes. The idea that pharmacology doesn't help people is quite simply wrong. Sure, the protocol for Advanced Cardiac Life support changes every 2 years, because some therapies that we use to thing were very effective, are proven to be less effective than new ones. But, there is a strong self-corrective factor in Medicine. The ideal isn't to do what the pharma companies push the doctors to do. The ideal is to do whatever the best science says increases lifespan, quality of life and decreases morbidity and mortality. At times, studies are funded by pharma companies, and the research is tainted. Current best practices are a moving target, because the science changes. But, over all, good medical practice is a big plus. Sure there are drugs that have great promise, are pushed through FDA approval and then are found to have bad side effects and/or not as effective as once thought... (e.g. Vioxx, Celebrex... both recalled several years after approval). But, for every drug that isn't effective, or has bad complications, there are dozens that do work. And, many more are found to have other beneficial uses. For example, mucomyst is a drug that was developed to help break up mucous plugs in people's lungs. Then, is was found to work as the antidote for one of the most common and toxic poisonings: tylenol. It's also used to protect people's kidney's during IV contrast injections. I'm sorry but the anti-pharma, anti-vaccination stuff that flies around the internet is one of the clearest examples of FUD I've seen, and it's very harmful. I've seen a number of people die because they didn't trust medicine and they didn't trust doctors. Please, check what you are saying before someone gets permanently hurt by your ideas.

kingkongrevenge 18y ago
Key words are ER and Critical Care. That stuff works great and makes progress all the time. It's also somewhat irrelevant to the bulk of medical practice and health care costs, which pertain to chronic conditions and lifestyle disease.
- iamelgringo 18y ago
  If people don't manage their chronic diseases with medication, where do they end up? The ER. If a diabetic doesn't take insulin or their anti-high-blood-sugar pills, where do they end up? The ER in a diabetic coma. A daily dose of insulin is like $1 a day. An ER visit/ICU hospitalization for a diabetic coma is around $20-50k depending on the severity. If an asthmatic doesn't manage their chronic condition with the appropriate inhalers, where do they end up? The ER. IF they let it go too long, they end up on life support in the ICU. Pneumonia used to be a leading cause of death, now it's not. Why? Antibiotics and oxygen therapy. People used to get polio all the time. I haven't seen an active case of polio every in my 15 year nursing career. Why? The polio vaccine. The incidence of tetanus has dropped from 600,000 deaths in '92 to less than 150,000 deaths world wide. Why? The tetanus vaccine. Ref: http://www.emedicine.com/emerg/topic574.htm http://www.emedicine.com/emerg/topic574.htm Please, stop saying the pharmacology doesn't work. It does. It saves lives. Are there problems with the system? Sure. But please stop spreading FUD about "Big Pharma".
  - Alex3917 18y ago
    @iamelgringo/arn What do you think of this paper on iatrogenic deaths? http://www.ourcivilisation.com/medicine/usamed.htm http://www.ourcivilisation.com/medicine/usamed.htm I ask as a genuine question, I haven't done enough research to evaluate the truthfulness of it.
    - iamelgringo 18y ago
      I have zero doubt that this is true. I have been around a lot of those medical errors, and I have seen people who have been killed by medical errors and malpractice. It's tragic. But, just because there are problems, that doesn't mean that the system doesn't work. In the article that you posted, they mentioned 10's of millions of unnecessary antibiotics. The reason that antibiotics are prescribed for viral infections is twofold. And, it's primarily because people want them. If I take my child who has been sick for 1 week to the ER, spend 3 hours waiting in line for a 5-10 minute visit with an ER doc. I want to go home with a prescription in hand. If not, I'm going to be very angry. So, it's easier for the MD to prescribe an antibiotic than deal with the 5-10 minute conversation convincing the parents that it's only 2008 and we haven't found a cure for the common cold yet. As for unnecessary medical procedures... That pretty much speaks to 95% of plastic surgery cases and 80% of dermatology practices. Our society also has very high expectations of the medical community. We used to go to a shaman, priest or pastor when our family was dying and looked for answers or expected miracles. Now, we take then in a ambulance to the hospital and expect answers and miracles from our doctors and medical systems. Doctors feel those expectations and generally work very hard in very difficult circumstances. They also are trying to make a decent living to pay for the 12-15 years of schooling they suffered through. So, the average MD will work 70-110 hours a week. When you work that much, you're bound to make mistakes. There's no doubt about it, there are a lot of problems with the system, but that doesn't mean that we should throw the baby out with the bath water. Tips to getting better health care: #1 Bar none, go to the rich people's hospital. Go to the neighborhood with the most expensive homes, and find a doctor in that neighborhood. You get much better medical care in those areas because that's where the good doctors go to practice. After working in 35 different hospitals in 15 years, I settled on working at an upper class/upper middle class hospital in Silicon Valley. That was deliberate. I can give better care here than any where else I've ever worked.

kingkongrevenge 18y ago

Key words are ER and Critical Care. That stuff works great and makes progress all the time. It's also somewhat irrelevant to the bulk of medical practice and health care costs, which pertain to chronic conditions and lifestyle disease.

iamelgringo 18y ago
If people don't manage their chronic diseases with medication, where do they end up? The ER. If a diabetic doesn't take insulin or their anti-high-blood-sugar pills, where do they end up? The ER in a diabetic coma. A daily dose of insulin is like $1 a day. An ER visit/ICU hospitalization for a diabetic coma is around $20-50k depending on the severity. If an asthmatic doesn't manage their chronic condition with the appropriate inhalers, where do they end up? The ER. IF they let it go too long, they end up on life support in the ICU. Pneumonia used to be a leading cause of death, now it's not. Why? Antibiotics and oxygen therapy. People used to get polio all the time. I haven't seen an active case of polio every in my 15 year nursing career. Why? The polio vaccine. The incidence of tetanus has dropped from 600,000 deaths in '92 to less than 150,000 deaths world wide. Why? The tetanus vaccine. Ref: http://www.emedicine.com/emerg/topic574.htm http://www.emedicine.com/emerg/topic574.htm Please, stop saying the pharmacology doesn't work. It does. It saves lives. Are there problems with the system? Sure. But please stop spreading FUD about "Big Pharma".
- Alex3917 18y ago
  @iamelgringo/arn What do you think of this paper on iatrogenic deaths? http://www.ourcivilisation.com/medicine/usamed.htm http://www.ourcivilisation.com/medicine/usamed.htm I ask as a genuine question, I haven't done enough research to evaluate the truthfulness of it.
  - iamelgringo 18y ago
    I have zero doubt that this is true. I have been around a lot of those medical errors, and I have seen people who have been killed by medical errors and malpractice. It's tragic. But, just because there are problems, that doesn't mean that the system doesn't work. In the article that you posted, they mentioned 10's of millions of unnecessary antibiotics. The reason that antibiotics are prescribed for viral infections is twofold. And, it's primarily because people want them. If I take my child who has been sick for 1 week to the ER, spend 3 hours waiting in line for a 5-10 minute visit with an ER doc. I want to go home with a prescription in hand. If not, I'm going to be very angry. So, it's easier for the MD to prescribe an antibiotic than deal with the 5-10 minute conversation convincing the parents that it's only 2008 and we haven't found a cure for the common cold yet. As for unnecessary medical procedures... That pretty much speaks to 95% of plastic surgery cases and 80% of dermatology practices. Our society also has very high expectations of the medical community. We used to go to a shaman, priest or pastor when our family was dying and looked for answers or expected miracles. Now, we take then in a ambulance to the hospital and expect answers and miracles from our doctors and medical systems. Doctors feel those expectations and generally work very hard in very difficult circumstances. They also are trying to make a decent living to pay for the 12-15 years of schooling they suffered through. So, the average MD will work 70-110 hours a week. When you work that much, you're bound to make mistakes. There's no doubt about it, there are a lot of problems with the system, but that doesn't mean that we should throw the baby out with the bath water. Tips to getting better health care: #1 Bar none, go to the rich people's hospital. Go to the neighborhood with the most expensive homes, and find a doctor in that neighborhood. You get much better medical care in those areas because that's where the good doctors go to practice. After working in 35 different hospitals in 15 years, I settled on working at an upper class/upper middle class hospital in Silicon Valley. That was deliberate. I can give better care here than any where else I've ever worked.