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I'm surprised they're issuing a statement admitting they made a "misstep". Surely they knew in advance the original update (removing support for their earliest

by stirlo 7y ago

I'm surprised they're issuing a statement admitting they made a "misstep". Surely they knew in advance the original update (removing support for their earliest adopters) would be received extremely negatively. I would have thought their comms strategy would have been to hold the line and wait for it to die down rather than revising their status so quickly. Either way the damage is done. It's become clear through the "recycling" program, the revision of the Sonos ONE after only 16 months and now the lobotomizing of the original Play 5 that they are not going to stand behind their products like they used to. I'm not buying more $400 speakers from a company that's aim is to force upgrades by deprecating support to bring up their quarterly sales figures. Time to buy some Chromecast or Airplay 2 devices and sign up for an ecosystem from a company that has a different revenue stream and doesn't need to force rapid hardware refreshes.

tranklor 7y ago
>revision of the Sonos ONE after only 16 months The original ONE is still supported >lobotomizing of the original Play 5 discontinued 4 years ago - that's a pretty long tail and in line with Apple >Time to buy some Chromecast or Airplay 2 devices Airplay support depends on mfg of your device. Apple has a similar policy to sonos (5 years for phones, i believe) - but they state it on their site! I think Sonos' biggest mistake was not having a transparent policy like Apple does. The real issue here, to me, is that they broke an unstated and unwritten promise: consumers inferred that devices had lifetime support - an inference that i think is completely reasonable!
- taneq 7y ago
  > discontinued 4 years ago - that's a pretty long tail and in line with Apple My stereo system was built in 1999. It still works fine and will continue to do so no matter what Sony does with their web servers.
  - corebit 7y ago
    Your ability to find tapes, discs, or things to plugin to it (assuming it even supports that) are disappearing with increasing speed.
    - berbec 7y ago
      Are you suggesting RCA jacks are getting phased out? That's the only way I need to worry.
      - klodolph 7y ago
        When buying home theater equipment recently I’ve had to make sure it had RCA jacks. Plenty of TVs don’t have them, I think.
      - heavymark 7y ago
        Yes, definitely not a given a new tv you buy will still have rca jacks.
      - pimeys 7y ago
        RCA and XLR are still pretty much the standard. You just need to look for studio equipment from companies such as Genelec, Neumann, Pioneer et.al.
    - jzwinck 7y ago
      My family has a Sony receiver bought in 1966. It works great with sources from phonograph to smartphone. There is no feeling of anything disappearing, on the contrary it is a device which is extremely pleasant to use and otherwise unthought of. Tuning its radio using a heavily weighted and lightly damped knob is faster than digital, the power-on latency is a few milliseconds, and most sources can be selected with a single press instead of scrolling an endless, feelless knob like many modern models. Who is making receivers now that people will enjoy in 2073?
      - cr0sh 7y ago
        I go to hamfests often; if I ever need old audio gear, I can get it there (recently picked up a home-built crystal set with the galena cat-whisker still hooked up - I have yet to try to see if I can get it to work, but it looks complete). Not too long back I bought a bluetooth adapter for my old Realistic component stereo system (that I bought as a high-schooler in 1989) - my wife likes to use it to listen to music and audio books, both inside the house and outside on the back patio. If I ever wanted to do some kind of "streaming music/speaker system" - there are plenty of open source options out there. Or I would run wiring for speakers like others here have done. But for now, our needs and simple, and we're fine with that.
  - pryce 7y ago
    My stereo system is from 2003. There is something deeply warped about accepting this idea each electronic product we buy should have a 2-4 year life expectancy.
  - tranklor 7y ago
    Can it connect to Spotify? Or do you need another device to do that?
    - rtsil 7y ago
      That's the point. Separate the "smart" components, which are short-lived and at the whims of the manufacturer, from the "dumb" components that are not at the mercy of constant updates, online accounts and sunsetting. You can connect to Shopify from a chromecast, airplay, bluetooth from a phone or anything else yet to be devised.
      - rekoil 7y ago
        I've been saying this exact same thing about "Smart TVs" for so long. There really aren't options these days, if you want a good current-gen TV, you're getting a "smart" TV. The smart components in these will get outdated quickly (perhaps slower now than 5 years ago, but still quite quickly), but I'm gonna be fine with my current TV panel for far longer than I will the OS that's on it. I'm very concerned about what will happen to all of these TVs when consumers feel that they are too slow or can't install the apps they want to use. I fear they will just replace the TV with another smart TV that will last 3-4 years.
      - tranklor 7y ago
        Sure, for a complex device like a TV. But for a small, self contained speaker? That's messy and complex, and frankly, people buy Sonos units to avoid that very situation. It's not a bug, it's a feature.
    - SamWhited 7y ago
      My stereo is from 1973 and the Raspberry Pi I have connected to its inputs can play Spotify just fine and will get updates for much longer. Or I could plug my phone up. Or a more consumer friendly device like a Roku. Or a bluetooth module that pairs wirelessly with my phone. If and when I do decide to update the Pi is a single device that costs $40 or so instead of having to do that much per speaker. Sonos devices just aren't worth it, they're insanely overpriced and provide little to no real benefit over any number of other options that separate out the stereo from the thing that plays music.
- JohnFen 7y ago
  > discontinued 4 years ago - that's a pretty long tail and in line with Apple That may be in line with Apple, but it's not a long tail. It's short. I expect that any hardware I buy will function for decades.
  - deleted 7y ago
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  - deleted 7y ago
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  - lostlogin 7y ago
    I’m not sure that’s a fair comparison either. One primarily makes computers which change quite fast (though my 10ish year old Macs actually work better than when they were purchased) and one makes audio stuff, which really doesn’t change that much.
- stirlo 7y ago
  >The original ONE is still supported After announcing the Sonos ONE with heaps of fanfare they introduced a 2nd Gen revision only 16 months later and said that in the future only the 2nd Gen ONE would receive new features. Considering past Sonos products had been sold with the same hardware for multiple years updating after such a short time signaled a move to planned hardware obsolescence and quicker upgrade cycles confirmed by their latest moves. As someone who rushed out and bought a 1st Gen ONE this had already soured me before they crippled all my Play 5s.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
taneq 7y ago
The idea that $400 speakers should only continue to function under the continued charity of the company that sold them is farcical in any event.
- ebeip90 7y ago
  "continue to function" != "receive new features" They'll all continue to work exactly as they already do.
  - heavymark 7y ago
    That is the new news today. The previous news was they would eventually no longer continue to function, todays announcement reaffirms no new features but now says they are working on a plan to make sure they continue to function with other legacy hardware as they do today.
    - madeofpalk 7y ago
      I don’t believe that’s correct? At least from the screenshots of emails I read, it stated that old devices won’t get software updates, but will continue to work. Additionally, any newer devices will not get software updates _while they’re on the same Sonos network as the old one_, because they all have to run the same version. Edit: here’s what I read https://mobile.twitter.com/seanbonner/status/1219760460028760065 https://mobile.twitter.com/seanbonner/status/121976046002876.... It very plainly states the devices will continue operating but none of your connected devices will be updated while you’re using old ones.
      - londons_explore 7y ago
        Which presumably means when you buy a very new device and hook it up to your network with a very old device, there will be no software version that runs on both...
      - dlandis 7y ago
        I don’t think so. Without updates it could lose compatibility with the services it integrates with, if the service is changed.
cm2187 7y ago
The damage was done a long time ago when they announced they would brick your device unless you signed up to an online account.
- netsharc 7y ago
  Well, this blog post seems to suggest the blowback from their "we're killing off legacy hardware" was too much that they had to make this blog post. I hope the blowback doesn't cease and people stop buying Sonos, but maybe I'm just being vindicative. If they stop their greedy policies, that would also make the world a better place.
wlj 7y ago
They’re admitting a misstep, but they’re not actually changing much. At best, there’s a vague pledge to update legacy players a bit longer, but they’re still breaking your current whole home audio system, because legacy and modern players will need to be split into two separate systems.
- dickeytk 7y ago
  No the article says the opposite. It says they’ll continue working together: “First, rest assured that come May, when we end new software updates for our legacy products, they will continue to work just as they do today. We are not bricking them, we are not forcing them into obsolescence, and we are not taking anything away.”
  - opencl 7y ago
    They'll continue working together if and only if you never update the software on the newer devices in your system ever again.
    - stirlo 7y ago
      That was the original stance, it's unclear to me if it still is. The post they made seems to be intentionally vague...
      - wlj 7y ago
        I just found this [0] in their forums from Sonos employee: “In May, you’ll be able to decide if you want to keep your legacy devices operating with your modern devices, and you’ll be able to put them all into a non-updating legacy system” So they are actually reversing course to a certain extent. If there’s one thing Sonos has shown throughout this mess, it’s that they’re really quite poor at communicating things clearly. [0] https://en.community.sonos.com/ask-a-question-228987/questions-following-the-end-of-support-announcement-6836166?postid=16396728 https://en.community.sonos.com/ask-a-question-228987/questio...
    - 7y ago
awb 7y ago
> I'm surprised they're issuing a statement admitting they made a "misstep". Here's the original Email Sonos sent on Jan. 21 (Tuesday). It's pretty bad and implies that your legacy products might stop working in the future and almost definitely won't work with new products. > End of software updates > In May the following products in your system will be classified as legacy and no longer receive software updates and new features. This will affect your listening experience. [My products] > Legacy products were introduced between 2005 and 2011 and, given the age of the technology, do not have enough memory or processing power to sustain future innovation. > Please note that because Sonos is a system, all products operate on the same software. If modern products remain connected to legacy products after May, they also will not receive software updates and new features. > You have options > Continue using legacy products > You can continue using legacy products after May, but your system will no longer receive software updates and new features. Over time this is likely to disrupt access to services and overall functionality. > Trade up legacy products > Save 30% on a new product when you upgrade through the Sonos Trade Up program.
givinguflac 7y ago
You seriously misunderstand what’s happened here. Sonos didn’t change anything at all, they just explained it again because (clearly you) didn’t get it. All you people suggesting chrome cast as an audio solution are hilarious. It’s literally already in the unsupported state without updates that Sonos is going to do with products ten times as old. Wtf are you thinking? What is the difference in your mind between Sonos issuing bug fixes but not new features, and relying on chromecast audio which already stopped supports years ago? It’s absurd

by stirlo 7y ago

tranklor 7y ago

>revision of the Sonos ONE after only 16 months The original ONE is still supported >lobotomizing of the original Play 5 discontinued 4 years ago - that's a pretty long tail and in line with Apple >Time to buy some Chromecast or Airplay 2 devices Airplay support depends on mfg of your device. Apple has a similar policy to sonos (5 years for phones, i believe) - but they state it on their site! I think Sonos' biggest mistake was not having a transparent policy like Apple does. The real issue here, to me, is that they broke an unstated and unwritten promise: consumers inferred that devices had lifetime support - an inference that i think is completely reasonable!

taneq 7y ago
> discontinued 4 years ago - that's a pretty long tail and in line with Apple My stereo system was built in 1999. It still works fine and will continue to do so no matter what Sony does with their web servers.
- corebit 7y ago
  Your ability to find tapes, discs, or things to plugin to it (assuming it even supports that) are disappearing with increasing speed.
  - berbec 7y ago
    Are you suggesting RCA jacks are getting phased out? That's the only way I need to worry.
    - klodolph 7y ago
      When buying home theater equipment recently I’ve had to make sure it had RCA jacks. Plenty of TVs don’t have them, I think.
    - heavymark 7y ago
      Yes, definitely not a given a new tv you buy will still have rca jacks.
    - pimeys 7y ago
      RCA and XLR are still pretty much the standard. You just need to look for studio equipment from companies such as Genelec, Neumann, Pioneer et.al.
  - jzwinck 7y ago
    My family has a Sony receiver bought in 1966. It works great with sources from phonograph to smartphone. There is no feeling of anything disappearing, on the contrary it is a device which is extremely pleasant to use and otherwise unthought of. Tuning its radio using a heavily weighted and lightly damped knob is faster than digital, the power-on latency is a few milliseconds, and most sources can be selected with a single press instead of scrolling an endless, feelless knob like many modern models. Who is making receivers now that people will enjoy in 2073?
    - cr0sh 7y ago
      I go to hamfests often; if I ever need old audio gear, I can get it there (recently picked up a home-built crystal set with the galena cat-whisker still hooked up - I have yet to try to see if I can get it to work, but it looks complete). Not too long back I bought a bluetooth adapter for my old Realistic component stereo system (that I bought as a high-schooler in 1989) - my wife likes to use it to listen to music and audio books, both inside the house and outside on the back patio. If I ever wanted to do some kind of "streaming music/speaker system" - there are plenty of open source options out there. Or I would run wiring for speakers like others here have done. But for now, our needs and simple, and we're fine with that.
- pryce 7y ago
  My stereo system is from 2003. There is something deeply warped about accepting this idea each electronic product we buy should have a 2-4 year life expectancy.
- tranklor 7y ago
  Can it connect to Spotify? Or do you need another device to do that?
  - rtsil 7y ago
    That's the point. Separate the "smart" components, which are short-lived and at the whims of the manufacturer, from the "dumb" components that are not at the mercy of constant updates, online accounts and sunsetting. You can connect to Shopify from a chromecast, airplay, bluetooth from a phone or anything else yet to be devised.
    - rekoil 7y ago
      I've been saying this exact same thing about "Smart TVs" for so long. There really aren't options these days, if you want a good current-gen TV, you're getting a "smart" TV. The smart components in these will get outdated quickly (perhaps slower now than 5 years ago, but still quite quickly), but I'm gonna be fine with my current TV panel for far longer than I will the OS that's on it. I'm very concerned about what will happen to all of these TVs when consumers feel that they are too slow or can't install the apps they want to use. I fear they will just replace the TV with another smart TV that will last 3-4 years.
    - tranklor 7y ago
      Sure, for a complex device like a TV. But for a small, self contained speaker? That's messy and complex, and frankly, people buy Sonos units to avoid that very situation. It's not a bug, it's a feature.
  - SamWhited 7y ago
    My stereo is from 1973 and the Raspberry Pi I have connected to its inputs can play Spotify just fine and will get updates for much longer. Or I could plug my phone up. Or a more consumer friendly device like a Roku. Or a bluetooth module that pairs wirelessly with my phone. If and when I do decide to update the Pi is a single device that costs $40 or so instead of having to do that much per speaker. Sonos devices just aren't worth it, they're insanely overpriced and provide little to no real benefit over any number of other options that separate out the stereo from the thing that plays music.
JohnFen 7y ago
> discontinued 4 years ago - that's a pretty long tail and in line with Apple That may be in line with Apple, but it's not a long tail. It's short. I expect that any hardware I buy will function for decades.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- lostlogin 7y ago
  I’m not sure that’s a fair comparison either. One primarily makes computers which change quite fast (though my 10ish year old Macs actually work better than when they were purchased) and one makes audio stuff, which really doesn’t change that much.
stirlo 7y ago
>The original ONE is still supported After announcing the Sonos ONE with heaps of fanfare they introduced a 2nd Gen revision only 16 months later and said that in the future only the 2nd Gen ONE would receive new features. Considering past Sonos products had been sold with the same hardware for multiple years updating after such a short time signaled a move to planned hardware obsolescence and quicker upgrade cycles confirmed by their latest moves. As someone who rushed out and bought a 1st Gen ONE this had already soured me before they crippled all my Play 5s.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

taneq 7y ago

The idea that $400 speakers should only continue to function under the continued charity of the company that sold them is farcical in any event.

ebeip90 7y ago
"continue to function" != "receive new features" They'll all continue to work exactly as they already do.
- heavymark 7y ago
  That is the new news today. The previous news was they would eventually no longer continue to function, todays announcement reaffirms no new features but now says they are working on a plan to make sure they continue to function with other legacy hardware as they do today.
  - madeofpalk 7y ago
    I don’t believe that’s correct? At least from the screenshots of emails I read, it stated that old devices won’t get software updates, but will continue to work. Additionally, any newer devices will not get software updates _while they’re on the same Sonos network as the old one_, because they all have to run the same version. Edit: here’s what I read https://mobile.twitter.com/seanbonner/status/1219760460028760065 https://mobile.twitter.com/seanbonner/status/121976046002876.... It very plainly states the devices will continue operating but none of your connected devices will be updated while you’re using old ones.
    - londons_explore 7y ago
      Which presumably means when you buy a very new device and hook it up to your network with a very old device, there will be no software version that runs on both...
    - dlandis 7y ago
      I don’t think so. Without updates it could lose compatibility with the services it integrates with, if the service is changed.

cm2187 7y ago

The damage was done a long time ago when they announced they would brick your device unless you signed up to an online account.

netsharc 7y ago
Well, this blog post seems to suggest the blowback from their "we're killing off legacy hardware" was too much that they had to make this blog post. I hope the blowback doesn't cease and people stop buying Sonos, but maybe I'm just being vindicative. If they stop their greedy policies, that would also make the world a better place.

wlj 7y ago

They’re admitting a misstep, but they’re not actually changing much. At best, there’s a vague pledge to update legacy players a bit longer, but they’re still breaking your current whole home audio system, because legacy and modern players will need to be split into two separate systems.

dickeytk 7y ago
No the article says the opposite. It says they’ll continue working together: “First, rest assured that come May, when we end new software updates for our legacy products, they will continue to work just as they do today. We are not bricking them, we are not forcing them into obsolescence, and we are not taking anything away.”
- opencl 7y ago
  They'll continue working together if and only if you never update the software on the newer devices in your system ever again.
  - stirlo 7y ago
    That was the original stance, it's unclear to me if it still is. The post they made seems to be intentionally vague...
    - wlj 7y ago
      I just found this [0] in their forums from Sonos employee: “In May, you’ll be able to decide if you want to keep your legacy devices operating with your modern devices, and you’ll be able to put them all into a non-updating legacy system” So they are actually reversing course to a certain extent. If there’s one thing Sonos has shown throughout this mess, it’s that they’re really quite poor at communicating things clearly. [0] https://en.community.sonos.com/ask-a-question-228987/questions-following-the-end-of-support-announcement-6836166?postid=16396728 https://en.community.sonos.com/ask-a-question-228987/questio...
  - 7y ago

awb 7y ago

> I'm surprised they're issuing a statement admitting they made a "misstep". Here's the original Email Sonos sent on Jan. 21 (Tuesday). It's pretty bad and implies that your legacy products might stop working in the future and almost definitely won't work with new products. > End of software updates > In May the following products in your system will be classified as legacy and no longer receive software updates and new features. This will affect your listening experience. [My products] > Legacy products were introduced between 2005 and 2011 and, given the age of the technology, do not have enough memory or processing power to sustain future innovation. > Please note that because Sonos is a system, all products operate on the same software. If modern products remain connected to legacy products after May, they also will not receive software updates and new features. > You have options > Continue using legacy products > You can continue using legacy products after May, but your system will no longer receive software updates and new features. Over time this is likely to disrupt access to services and overall functionality. > Trade up legacy products > Save 30% on a new product when you upgrade through the Sonos Trade Up program.

givinguflac 7y ago

You seriously misunderstand what’s happened here. Sonos didn’t change anything at all, they just explained it again because (clearly you) didn’t get it. All you people suggesting chrome cast as an audio solution are hilarious. It’s literally already in the unsupported state without updates that Sonos is going to do with products ten times as old. Wtf are you thinking? What is the difference in your mind between Sonos issuing bug fixes but not new features, and relying on chromecast audio which already stopped supports years ago? It’s absurd