4 ms·

> At the same time, not allowing an owner to rent is transferring wealth to corporate hoteliers. If you truly want this level of freedom, you need to not buy a

by ohazi 7y ago

> At the same time, not allowing an owner to rent is transferring wealth to corporate hoteliers. If you truly want this level of freedom, you need to not buy a condo or a property with a HOA. Additional rules for owners makes sense for condos and buildings with obviously shared common infrastructure and resources. I think it makes less sense for detached housing. Apparently a large number of developers building new houses at the subdivision-scale (not in California, lol) are now putting in HOAs automatically. It's going to be a pretty shitty situation in 30 years.

thisisastopsign 7y ago
I have a rental property that is in an HOA and I rent it out. What are you inferring?
- tingletech 7y ago
  I'm not sure the exact point of the grand parent post -- but for a multi-unit building with the units titled as condos (which would usually have an owner's association) the rules for getting conventional financing in the US (I'm spacing on what those are called) dictate a certain percentage of the units must be owner occupied, lest the loans are not re-sellable in the secondary mortgage markets. Condo HOAs will thus sometimes try to pass rules or amend bylaws to establish rental restrictions of various sorts -- most commonly setting a minimum lease term, but sometimes trying to set percentages of units that must be owner occupied, limiting the numbers of units that can be owned by a single owner, or establishing a time frame a unit must be owner occupied before it can be rented. My understanding is that most of the new apartment buildings they are building around me in Oakland and trying to rent out are "pre-converted" or already titled as condos -- but as the investors are renting them out generally there is no HOA to speak of as there is one owner. But, should market conditions change, common areas and separate titles are already established so less paperwork would be required to sell off the units.
- ohazi 7y ago
  Is your rental property a house or a condo? I'm asserting that buying a detached house that falls under an HOA is something that should generally be avoided. With a house, there are rarely shared resources that actually need to be managed so any potential benefit is minimal at best, and bad HOAs can be a nightmare, so the risk is high. I'm also lamenting the fact that developers building new neighborhoods of detached houses (e.g. in places like Austin) are apparently putting almost all of them under HOAs, perhaps because of some legal meme that doing so somehow reduces risk for the developer, or increases sale prices. I think this is an unfortunate trend.
  - lotsofpulp 7y ago
    In my experience, most people want HOAs.
  - imtringued 7y ago
    Yes that sounds counterproductive. Multi-family buildings obviously need a central organisation because things like the elevator, roof, etc are shared infrastructure that requires funding from all occupants. A detached house can be fully owned by the occupant or the landlord. There is no need for middlemen.
  - thisisastopsign 7y ago
    Ya, I have a detached house. I’ve noticed the trend with HOAs being established by the builder. You’re right that there’s minimum shared property generally. Fortunately, every HOA I’ve been in has been good. On the other hand, I’ve looked in areas without HOAs and people didn’t take care of their property or yards, which drove their neighbor’s home value down (the deals seemed good enough to buy, until you drove up and saw your future neighbors).

by ohazi 7y ago

thisisastopsign 7y ago

I have a rental property that is in an HOA and I rent it out. What are you inferring?

tingletech 7y ago
I'm not sure the exact point of the grand parent post -- but for a multi-unit building with the units titled as condos (which would usually have an owner's association) the rules for getting conventional financing in the US (I'm spacing on what those are called) dictate a certain percentage of the units must be owner occupied, lest the loans are not re-sellable in the secondary mortgage markets. Condo HOAs will thus sometimes try to pass rules or amend bylaws to establish rental restrictions of various sorts -- most commonly setting a minimum lease term, but sometimes trying to set percentages of units that must be owner occupied, limiting the numbers of units that can be owned by a single owner, or establishing a time frame a unit must be owner occupied before it can be rented. My understanding is that most of the new apartment buildings they are building around me in Oakland and trying to rent out are "pre-converted" or already titled as condos -- but as the investors are renting them out generally there is no HOA to speak of as there is one owner. But, should market conditions change, common areas and separate titles are already established so less paperwork would be required to sell off the units.
ohazi 7y ago
Is your rental property a house or a condo? I'm asserting that buying a detached house that falls under an HOA is something that should generally be avoided. With a house, there are rarely shared resources that actually need to be managed so any potential benefit is minimal at best, and bad HOAs can be a nightmare, so the risk is high. I'm also lamenting the fact that developers building new neighborhoods of detached houses (e.g. in places like Austin) are apparently putting almost all of them under HOAs, perhaps because of some legal meme that doing so somehow reduces risk for the developer, or increases sale prices. I think this is an unfortunate trend.
- lotsofpulp 7y ago
  In my experience, most people want HOAs.
- imtringued 7y ago
  Yes that sounds counterproductive. Multi-family buildings obviously need a central organisation because things like the elevator, roof, etc are shared infrastructure that requires funding from all occupants. A detached house can be fully owned by the occupant or the landlord. There is no need for middlemen.
- thisisastopsign 7y ago
  Ya, I have a detached house. I’ve noticed the trend with HOAs being established by the builder. You’re right that there’s minimum shared property generally. Fortunately, every HOA I’ve been in has been good. On the other hand, I’ve looked in areas without HOAs and people didn’t take care of their property or yards, which drove their neighbor’s home value down (the deals seemed good enough to buy, until you drove up and saw your future neighbors).