4 ms·

I'll agree you absolutely have to watch what you're doing and count miles and whatnot, but having the option is a powerful thing (even when you're making negati

by swiley 7y ago

I'll agree you absolutely have to watch what you're doing and count miles and whatnot, but having the option is a powerful thing (even when you're making negative money) and I wonder if regulating it too aggressively might take that away.

dsr_ 7y ago
I am 100% ok with using regulation to take away the ability to earn negative money.
- ZainRiz 7y ago
  I have 0% trust in regulators ability to do this without doing more harm to workers than good
- Reedx 7y ago
  Obviously. But are you going to do that so neatly it doesn't trigger unintended consequences? Which have the potential to make things worse. It's easy to say "let's do X to make Y better", but it's not that simple with any real world complex system. Look at bill AB5 for an example currently in progress and ostensibly about helping gig workers. Here's a sobering sample of second order effects: https://twitter.com/ms_andiloveall/status/1206705811042422785 https://twitter.com/ms_andiloveall/status/120670581104242278... https://twitter.com/delightedbite/status/1216834042881949697 https://twitter.com/delightedbite/status/1216834042881949697
pergadad 7y ago
Imagine all the alternative ways this valuable human time could be used. Do you really think the majority of people feel empowered and freely do this, or is it rather that they are stuck in a negative loop and can't get out. Also to highlight that currently the government is subsidising these companies by paying food stamps and Medicaid (in the case of the US), and the workers are subsidising them by taking any and all economic and personal risk (injury, accident, car breakdown, long term health issues, etc.)
- SpicyLemonZest 7y ago
  "Empowered" is a spectrum. Do I think the majority of gig economy drivers find their job empowering in some cosmic sense - no, probably not. But I'd certainly be much happier as a driver for Doordash than a sales clerk at Walmart, and the reasons are empowering things like "I don't have to spend 100% of my time around annoying customers" and "there's no manager who will come yell at me if I play around with my phone for a few minutes".
- swiley 7y ago
  I agree human time is undervalued in the modern economy and it’s often waisted, but I think door dash because of its flexibility might actually be part of a change that results in it being more valued rather than less.

by swiley 7y ago

dsr_ 7y ago

I am 100% ok with using regulation to take away the ability to earn negative money.

ZainRiz 7y ago
I have 0% trust in regulators ability to do this without doing more harm to workers than good
Reedx 7y ago
Obviously. But are you going to do that so neatly it doesn't trigger unintended consequences? Which have the potential to make things worse. It's easy to say "let's do X to make Y better", but it's not that simple with any real world complex system. Look at bill AB5 for an example currently in progress and ostensibly about helping gig workers. Here's a sobering sample of second order effects: https://twitter.com/ms_andiloveall/status/1206705811042422785 https://twitter.com/ms_andiloveall/status/120670581104242278... https://twitter.com/delightedbite/status/1216834042881949697 https://twitter.com/delightedbite/status/1216834042881949697

pergadad 7y ago

Imagine all the alternative ways this valuable human time could be used. Do you really think the majority of people feel empowered and freely do this, or is it rather that they are stuck in a negative loop and can't get out. Also to highlight that currently the government is subsidising these companies by paying food stamps and Medicaid (in the case of the US), and the workers are subsidising them by taking any and all economic and personal risk (injury, accident, car breakdown, long term health issues, etc.)

SpicyLemonZest 7y ago
"Empowered" is a spectrum. Do I think the majority of gig economy drivers find their job empowering in some cosmic sense - no, probably not. But I'd certainly be much happier as a driver for Doordash than a sales clerk at Walmart, and the reasons are empowering things like "I don't have to spend 100% of my time around annoying customers" and "there's no manager who will come yell at me if I play around with my phone for a few minutes".
swiley 7y ago
I agree human time is undervalued in the modern economy and it’s often waisted, but I think door dash because of its flexibility might actually be part of a change that results in it being more valued rather than less.