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I'm proud to say that my vehicle has zero tracking, is user serviceable, and my purchase of it had zero carbon impact. It's also 32 years old, gets 14-15mpg, a

I'm proud to say that my vehicle has zero tracking, is user serviceable, and my purchase of it had zero carbon impact. It's also 32 years old, gets 14-15mpg, and drives like a truck. It's a 1988 Chevy Suburban. I bought it a few years ago, for $1450 and really haven't put much into it overall. It runs reasonable well (still some things to figure out) and is comfortable. If I had some money I'd fix some of the things wrong with it and update the interior with seats out of a newer model, but overall, it just works. And that's what I see going UP in value over time. To think I could own a car that could tell some corporate partner where I went for lunch is just unfathomable. I can't afford to own a car that "cool" and I'm glad for it.

bagacrap 7y ago
I'm glad you're happy with your ownership of that thing, but I'm more glad that most of them are off the road by now as we've made great strides in emissions and crash safety since the 80s, not to mention mileage. These are factors with measurable real-world impact on your fellow citizens, and, I would submit, more important than your paranoid secrecy wrt your dietary habits.
- geocrasher 7y ago
  Heh it's not paranoia, it's just a matter of privacy. Then again, my phone already knows, so it's moot. Crash safety has come a long way, no doubt. But mileage really has not. For all the complexity of a modern Suburban (at over $50K USD!) it gets 14 MPG around town and up to 23 MPG on the highway. Mine gets about 14/17. Since most of my driving is local, it doesn't really matter.
  - bagacrap 7y ago
    FWIW unless you have a diesel your official city mileage was 11 when the car was new. But as someone who has to live near other people and use roadways myself, I'm more concerned about tailpipe emissions. NOx standards are literally 100x more stringent starting in 2025 than 30 years ago (50x now compared to 1988).
- munmaek 7y ago
  > These are factors with measurable real-world impact on your fellow citizens, and, I would submit, more important than your paranoid secrecy wrt your dietary habits. 1. Why is this one or the other? Can't we have efficient cars that also don't track us? 2. How, in 2020, do people still not understand how serious location data is? In the USA, and likely anywhere that has cars + little public transportation (like rural areas), your car basically displays your life. Where you live, work, eat, meet people, attend events, etc. How long until law enforcement asks for all people who drove near a protest/rally? Or advertisers get that data and start targeting you based on where you drove? Why should a freaking car company (who is 100% guaranteed going to sell your data) have access to your entire location profile? The thought of this alone is frustrating and maddening because of how easily we hand out our data. People have no idea how powerful bulk collection of user data is.
- wearenotsafe 7y ago
  > paranoid secrecy Do you work in the industry or have you simply been conditioned to parrot the notion that anyone concerned with being spied upon is crazy?
ropiwqefjnpoa 7y ago
You don't need to go that old or inefficient to avoid tracking or data uploads. Many modern cars have no GPS's or cell service (black box only).
- geocrasher 7y ago
  Indeed! It's a matter of what I already have. I didn't go that old because o those things, those things are in place because I bought a vehicle that old. I'm just counting my blessings out loud, that's all ;)

bagacrap 7y ago

I'm glad you're happy with your ownership of that thing, but I'm more glad that most of them are off the road by now as we've made great strides in emissions and crash safety since the 80s, not to mention mileage. These are factors with measurable real-world impact on your fellow citizens, and, I would submit, more important than your paranoid secrecy wrt your dietary habits.

geocrasher 7y ago
Heh it's not paranoia, it's just a matter of privacy. Then again, my phone already knows, so it's moot. Crash safety has come a long way, no doubt. But mileage really has not. For all the complexity of a modern Suburban (at over $50K USD!) it gets 14 MPG around town and up to 23 MPG on the highway. Mine gets about 14/17. Since most of my driving is local, it doesn't really matter.
- bagacrap 7y ago
  FWIW unless you have a diesel your official city mileage was 11 when the car was new. But as someone who has to live near other people and use roadways myself, I'm more concerned about tailpipe emissions. NOx standards are literally 100x more stringent starting in 2025 than 30 years ago (50x now compared to 1988).
munmaek 7y ago
> These are factors with measurable real-world impact on your fellow citizens, and, I would submit, more important than your paranoid secrecy wrt your dietary habits. 1. Why is this one or the other? Can't we have efficient cars that also don't track us? 2. How, in 2020, do people still not understand how serious location data is? In the USA, and likely anywhere that has cars + little public transportation (like rural areas), your car basically displays your life. Where you live, work, eat, meet people, attend events, etc. How long until law enforcement asks for all people who drove near a protest/rally? Or advertisers get that data and start targeting you based on where you drove? Why should a freaking car company (who is 100% guaranteed going to sell your data) have access to your entire location profile? The thought of this alone is frustrating and maddening because of how easily we hand out our data. People have no idea how powerful bulk collection of user data is.
wearenotsafe 7y ago
> paranoid secrecy Do you work in the industry or have you simply been conditioned to parrot the notion that anyone concerned with being spied upon is crazy?

ropiwqefjnpoa 7y ago

You don't need to go that old or inefficient to avoid tracking or data uploads. Many modern cars have no GPS's or cell service (black box only).

geocrasher 7y ago
Indeed! It's a matter of what I already have. I didn't go that old because o those things, those things are in place because I bought a vehicle that old. I'm just counting my blessings out loud, that's all ;)