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I agree with that, but writing code for industrial applications is fundamentally different from whipping up a backend for the hottest new Lyft for Parrots start

I agree with that, but writing code for industrial applications is fundamentally different from whipping up a backend for the hottest new Lyft for Parrots startup. If industrial equipment malfunctions, people can be killed or horribly maimed. Industrial equipment needs to do exactly what it was designed to do 24/7 for years or decades in horrible (EMI, temperature, etc) environments.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
jiofih 7y ago
Pretty sure that class of equipment will not be using any kind of Arduino board (see also: certifications above).
- dekhn 7y ago
  I've been in a few 27/4 biotech labs that run all the environmental sensors, and some of the industrial controls, off arduinos. ALways fun to open a field box and find a DIN-mounted Uno.
- CamperBob2 7y ago
  HN commenters love to talk about how Raspberry Pi and Arduino boards aren't suitable for use in production hardware. I recently had a chance to wander around one of the bigger EMS factories in the Bay Area, rubbernecking at everybody else's products in various stages of assembly. It's safe to say not many naysaying HN'ers have done that recently, or they would be saying something very different.
  - jiofih 7y ago
    The comment I was replying to was talking about DEATHS being caused by failure, not environmental sensors. I have nothing against its use.
    - CamperBob2 7y ago
      Agreed, and I'm not necessarily defending this practice, just saying that it is, in fact, being done. One of the RasPi-based devices I saw being assembled was actually some kind of medical device that will presumably have to be FDA-certified. It was going into a very nice enclosure, with top-grade plastics and other materials, and they were building a (literal) ton of them. In principle I'm sure that can be done successfully, but I have to wonder if it'll really save the company that much time or money.
spookthesunset 7y ago
> If industrial equipment malfunctions, people can be killed or horribly maimed. In what way does C vs. python or javascript have any impact on this? If anything, C has way more ability to shoot yourself in the foot than python or javascript. Hell, what about a non memory-managed language like rust? Like somebody else says, this feels more like a cultural issue than an actual technical issue.
- vineyardmike 7y ago
  Because the debate is often not C Vs JS/Python, it’s [C, Js, Python] Vs [Ladder Logic, PLC-specific Langs] where PLC languages have time-guarantees in the language
wolrah 7y ago
If someone is dumb enough to be using an Arduino in a life-critical application then what language they're programming it in is almost a moot point. To the larger point of coding for these kinds of applications, keep in mind that there are entire classes of bugs that are common in traditional microcontroller languages like C which literally do not exist in Python or Javascript. As far as I've seen as an outsider to the embedded world the main barriers to adoption of higher level languages have not been based upon concerns of reliability, but instead memory usage and timing constraints, the former of which is less and less of a real problem outside of extremely cost constrained applications.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

jiofih 7y ago

Pretty sure that class of equipment will not be using any kind of Arduino board (see also: certifications above).

dekhn 7y ago
I've been in a few 27/4 biotech labs that run all the environmental sensors, and some of the industrial controls, off arduinos. ALways fun to open a field box and find a DIN-mounted Uno.
CamperBob2 7y ago
HN commenters love to talk about how Raspberry Pi and Arduino boards aren't suitable for use in production hardware. I recently had a chance to wander around one of the bigger EMS factories in the Bay Area, rubbernecking at everybody else's products in various stages of assembly. It's safe to say not many naysaying HN'ers have done that recently, or they would be saying something very different.
- jiofih 7y ago
  The comment I was replying to was talking about DEATHS being caused by failure, not environmental sensors. I have nothing against its use.
  - CamperBob2 7y ago
    Agreed, and I'm not necessarily defending this practice, just saying that it is, in fact, being done. One of the RasPi-based devices I saw being assembled was actually some kind of medical device that will presumably have to be FDA-certified. It was going into a very nice enclosure, with top-grade plastics and other materials, and they were building a (literal) ton of them. In principle I'm sure that can be done successfully, but I have to wonder if it'll really save the company that much time or money.

spookthesunset 7y ago

> If industrial equipment malfunctions, people can be killed or horribly maimed. In what way does C vs. python or javascript have any impact on this? If anything, C has way more ability to shoot yourself in the foot than python or javascript. Hell, what about a non memory-managed language like rust? Like somebody else says, this feels more like a cultural issue than an actual technical issue.

vineyardmike 7y ago
Because the debate is often not C Vs JS/Python, it’s [C, Js, Python] Vs [Ladder Logic, PLC-specific Langs] where PLC languages have time-guarantees in the language

wolrah 7y ago

If someone is dumb enough to be using an Arduino in a life-critical application then what language they're programming it in is almost a moot point. To the larger point of coding for these kinds of applications, keep in mind that there are entire classes of bugs that are common in traditional microcontroller languages like C which literally do not exist in Python or Javascript. As far as I've seen as an outsider to the embedded world the main barriers to adoption of higher level languages have not been based upon concerns of reliability, but instead memory usage and timing constraints, the former of which is less and less of a real problem outside of extremely cost constrained applications.