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A nicer gesture would be asking what they need and supplying them. Cash is not always the best medium for reasons related to not having enough background inform

A nicer gesture would be asking what they need and supplying them. Cash is not always the best medium for reasons related to not having enough background information. Some of them may use it for worsening their condition (addiction) and others don't know how to get good supplies from it - mindset change due to homelessness.

YeGoblynQueenne 7y ago
That's not right. You don't get to decide what people do with your gifts. That, too, is not how giving works. For those who are addicted (and let's repeat that not everyone who is homeless is an addict, at least not yet) their addiction won't magickally vanish if you don't give them money to spend on drugs. They'll find their drugs anyway. Maybe not with your money, but they won't get any better because you didn't give them money. And they'll probably do something desperate to get it if they don't have money so you're probably protecting them from the worse if you do give them money. Personally, I live in a place with a large population of homeless people and I give money. The majority don't look like they're junkies or anything, but even for the ones who are, if enough people give them money they'll get their drugs and they'll have some left to go and get themselves something else they need. You just have to fill the pot up. I sometimes ask people what they need, if they're sitting outside a store. A guy once asked me for a Cadbury's and a bottle of Gatorade. I thought, yech, on both counts and the chocolate is defo unhealthy, but maybe it was a way to combat the cold or get a quick hit of energy? How would I know? I've never sat on my arse on a cold dirty pavement for days. If the folks who do that don't know best what they need, then I certainly don't so I might as well go with what they say. Edit: And, to be perfectly honest, giving doesn't make me feel any better and it's not really helping the homeless much. What those people need is to get off the streets. Small donations like I can afford (I'm a PhD student after all) is at best helping them get by, if enough other people chip in. In the article, Anita helped the author's mother get a job. That's the kind of thing that changes a person's life, although of course packing up a warm meal for them is a very good start. There was a young guy who was sitting in the same place for at least three or four years. I used to give him money when I went by on my way home from work (before I was a PhD student). It didn't matter that I gave him money. He was still there for all those years. You don't get people out of poverty by giving them your change. Not that you shouldn't - but what is needed is, well, scuse the involuntary pun but radical societal change. Is that coming from anywhere?
- thrwaway69 7y ago
  > For those who are addicted (and let's repeat that not everyone who is homeless is an addict, at least not yet) their addiction won't magickally vanish if you don't give them money to spend on drugs. They'll find their drugs anyway. Maybe not with your money, but they won't get any better because you didn't give them money. And they'll probably do something desperate to get it if they don't have money so you're probably protecting them from the worse if you do give them money. I agree but you need to account for both parties involved. Giving money opposed to asking them for what they need and supplying it increases the risk area for harm and it's inevitably a moral burden as well if someone thinks they are fueling addiction when they might not be, it's hard to know. Addiction is a complex problem which can't be solved by a passway. The best they can do is focus on supplies for improvement in qualify of life for the homeless within a reasonable timeframe. Not only improvement in what you eat and self caring products lead to distraction from addiction but helps you stand up. It opens up opportunity to ask about them and give emotional fulfillment as well. Throwing money in a bin or putting it on their hand doesn't which is what most people would do if they were to just give out money. > I sometimes ask people what they need, if they're sitting outside a store. A guy once asked me for a Cadbury's and a bottle of Gatorade. I thought, yech, on both counts and the chocolate is defo unhealthy, but maybe it was a way to combat the cold or get a quick hit of energy? How would I know? I've never sat on my arse on a cold dirty pavement for days. If the folks who do that don't know best what they need, then I certainly don't so I might as well go with what they say. Sure that's a good point and I didn't imply to act like you know what they need. That is more of a quality issue. Giving money is unknowingly restricting and letting their mindset dictate short term benefit over long term. They may try to get a cheaper unhealthy chocolate due to dollar difference or thought of saving up.
  - YeGoblynQueenne 7y ago
    Thinking of what I wrote about the guy who wanted the chocoloate and the gatorade later, I realise that there's another reason he might have asked for chocolate, and that's mental health. Sometimes, what you really need to have is what you want, because it will make you feel better. Like, emotionally "feel". Anyway I dont' agree with you, still. There's so many things that people can do with money that isn't getting high. If I buy someone a meal from outside I can only buy something ready-made (a sandwich or a kebab etc). That's not very healthy. Maybe if enough people give them money they can find a place to stay for a while (or a good Samarithan can pay for a night's stay at a motel) or they can buy something to cook and go to a friend's place to cook it and have a proper meal. I really don't think that the majority of homeless in my area are addicts. They mostly seem like people down on their luck. It's so easy to end up on the streets these days, especially in the bloody UK where social nets are threadabare and being torn apart constantly. Then of course once you're on the streets it is so easy to start drinking or shooting to "get by". Like you say addiction a complex problem but I don't accept that giving money makes it worse or doesn't help those who suffer from it. If I'm wrong, I hope I find out soon.
jrochkind1 7y ago
One person's "worsening their condition" is another person's self-medication. Sure, you can ask them what they need, but the nice thing about cash if they can use it to buy whatever they need, that's what cash is for. And have the dignity to decide for themselves what it is, not have to tell you and get it approved like you're their teacher or boss. I mean, are you spending some of YOUR money on alcohol, drugs, and cigarettes? Then you can afford to give someone cash without needing to worry about whether they might do the same, and whether that's good for them or not.
- fastball 7y ago
  What is the point of giving someone money so that they can die of an overdose using the drugs you helped them buy?
  - jlokier 7y ago
    The OP explained: It gives them dignity and perhaps self-determination. Both of those things have value. A person can still die from self-determination of course, so it comes down to a decision about what you think matters the most.
    - fastball 7y ago
      They already have self-determination without you giving them money to buy drugs. And dying of an overdose doesn't give you any dignity.
      - jrochkind1 7y ago
        You are not able to predict who is going to die of an overdose -- let alone because of your gift (ie suggeseting they wouldn't have otherwise, it is your gift that led to that). So you can decide to treat everyone with dignity as an adult, or nobody with dignity as an adult. You are advocating for nobody (or at least nobody who is on the streets), out of an abundance of 'caution'. You are mistaken if you think you are helping people by being an asshole to them. But it is certainly your right to do so.
vraivroo 7y ago
No, a nicer gesture would be respecting their dignity and humanizing them. It's popular to rationalize those who are worse off as being worse at making decisions, but it's not accurate, fair, or humane.

YeGoblynQueenne 7y ago

That's not right. You don't get to decide what people do with your gifts. That, too, is not how giving works. For those who are addicted (and let's repeat that not everyone who is homeless is an addict, at least not yet) their addiction won't magickally vanish if you don't give them money to spend on drugs. They'll find their drugs anyway. Maybe not with your money, but they won't get any better because you didn't give them money. And they'll probably do something desperate to get it if they don't have money so you're probably protecting them from the worse if you do give them money. Personally, I live in a place with a large population of homeless people and I give money. The majority don't look like they're junkies or anything, but even for the ones who are, if enough people give them money they'll get their drugs and they'll have some left to go and get themselves something else they need. You just have to fill the pot up. I sometimes ask people what they need, if they're sitting outside a store. A guy once asked me for a Cadbury's and a bottle of Gatorade. I thought, yech, on both counts and the chocolate is defo unhealthy, but maybe it was a way to combat the cold or get a quick hit of energy? How would I know? I've never sat on my arse on a cold dirty pavement for days. If the folks who do that don't know best what they need, then I certainly don't so I might as well go with what they say. Edit: And, to be perfectly honest, giving doesn't make me feel any better and it's not really helping the homeless much. What those people need is to get off the streets. Small donations like I can afford (I'm a PhD student after all) is at best helping them get by, if enough other people chip in. In the article, Anita helped the author's mother get a job. That's the kind of thing that changes a person's life, although of course packing up a warm meal for them is a very good start. There was a young guy who was sitting in the same place for at least three or four years. I used to give him money when I went by on my way home from work (before I was a PhD student). It didn't matter that I gave him money. He was still there for all those years. You don't get people out of poverty by giving them your change. Not that you shouldn't - but what is needed is, well, scuse the involuntary pun but radical societal change. Is that coming from anywhere?

thrwaway69 7y ago
> For those who are addicted (and let's repeat that not everyone who is homeless is an addict, at least not yet) their addiction won't magickally vanish if you don't give them money to spend on drugs. They'll find their drugs anyway. Maybe not with your money, but they won't get any better because you didn't give them money. And they'll probably do something desperate to get it if they don't have money so you're probably protecting them from the worse if you do give them money. I agree but you need to account for both parties involved. Giving money opposed to asking them for what they need and supplying it increases the risk area for harm and it's inevitably a moral burden as well if someone thinks they are fueling addiction when they might not be, it's hard to know. Addiction is a complex problem which can't be solved by a passway. The best they can do is focus on supplies for improvement in qualify of life for the homeless within a reasonable timeframe. Not only improvement in what you eat and self caring products lead to distraction from addiction but helps you stand up. It opens up opportunity to ask about them and give emotional fulfillment as well. Throwing money in a bin or putting it on their hand doesn't which is what most people would do if they were to just give out money. > I sometimes ask people what they need, if they're sitting outside a store. A guy once asked me for a Cadbury's and a bottle of Gatorade. I thought, yech, on both counts and the chocolate is defo unhealthy, but maybe it was a way to combat the cold or get a quick hit of energy? How would I know? I've never sat on my arse on a cold dirty pavement for days. If the folks who do that don't know best what they need, then I certainly don't so I might as well go with what they say. Sure that's a good point and I didn't imply to act like you know what they need. That is more of a quality issue. Giving money is unknowingly restricting and letting their mindset dictate short term benefit over long term. They may try to get a cheaper unhealthy chocolate due to dollar difference or thought of saving up.
- YeGoblynQueenne 7y ago
  Thinking of what I wrote about the guy who wanted the chocoloate and the gatorade later, I realise that there's another reason he might have asked for chocolate, and that's mental health. Sometimes, what you really need to have is what you want, because it will make you feel better. Like, emotionally "feel". Anyway I dont' agree with you, still. There's so many things that people can do with money that isn't getting high. If I buy someone a meal from outside I can only buy something ready-made (a sandwich or a kebab etc). That's not very healthy. Maybe if enough people give them money they can find a place to stay for a while (or a good Samarithan can pay for a night's stay at a motel) or they can buy something to cook and go to a friend's place to cook it and have a proper meal. I really don't think that the majority of homeless in my area are addicts. They mostly seem like people down on their luck. It's so easy to end up on the streets these days, especially in the bloody UK where social nets are threadabare and being torn apart constantly. Then of course once you're on the streets it is so easy to start drinking or shooting to "get by". Like you say addiction a complex problem but I don't accept that giving money makes it worse or doesn't help those who suffer from it. If I'm wrong, I hope I find out soon.

jrochkind1 7y ago

One person's "worsening their condition" is another person's self-medication. Sure, you can ask them what they need, but the nice thing about cash if they can use it to buy whatever they need, that's what cash is for. And have the dignity to decide for themselves what it is, not have to tell you and get it approved like you're their teacher or boss. I mean, are you spending some of YOUR money on alcohol, drugs, and cigarettes? Then you can afford to give someone cash without needing to worry about whether they might do the same, and whether that's good for them or not.

fastball 7y ago
What is the point of giving someone money so that they can die of an overdose using the drugs you helped them buy?
- jlokier 7y ago
  The OP explained: It gives them dignity and perhaps self-determination. Both of those things have value. A person can still die from self-determination of course, so it comes down to a decision about what you think matters the most.
  - fastball 7y ago
    They already have self-determination without you giving them money to buy drugs. And dying of an overdose doesn't give you any dignity.
    - jrochkind1 7y ago
      You are not able to predict who is going to die of an overdose -- let alone because of your gift (ie suggeseting they wouldn't have otherwise, it is your gift that led to that). So you can decide to treat everyone with dignity as an adult, or nobody with dignity as an adult. You are advocating for nobody (or at least nobody who is on the streets), out of an abundance of 'caution'. You are mistaken if you think you are helping people by being an asshole to them. But it is certainly your right to do so.

vraivroo 7y ago

No, a nicer gesture would be respecting their dignity and humanizing them. It's popular to rationalize those who are worse off as being worse at making decisions, but it's not accurate, fair, or humane.