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So if the cannon is created using the great firewall, how does the Chinese government establish any sort of plausible argument that this isn't state-sponsored a
by pkilgore 7y ago
So if the cannon is created using the great firewall, how does the Chinese government establish any sort of plausible argument that this isn't state-sponsored activity?
Do they just not care?
Some day soon a war will not be started with an assassins bullet but with a tool like this. I wonder when we start looking at them the same way?
- NedIsakoff 7y agoThe question is, you know I'm using it. Besides some words, what the heck are you going to do?
- eznoonze 7y agoThey don't care. It is of course state sponsored. The denial is just their way to fool their own people. The Chinese Communist Party rule by lies and violence. Those are the 2 keywords to understand CCP.
- faitswulff 7y agoDon't forget that the power behind the CCP's lies and violence is economic clout, both abroad and domestically.
- eznoonze 7y agoYes, absolutely. The economic clout gives them the confidence and means. That needs to be dealt with. Declaw!
- cc81 7y agoLike how the world dealt with the US after Snowden's reveals?
- microcolonel 7y agoThey were all doing the same and worse, it turns out. They could hardly complain. Americans must regain the courage and dignity of differing from the hundred lame, neoliberal, tacit fascist-enabling bugman regimes that litter the world. It's often good not to be like them.
- erikpukinskis 7y agoI’m a U.S. citizen and I’m “dealing with the US” in my own way. But such a thing takes time. You don’t upset and entire economic regime in a year or even a decade. It takes the utmost patience, to the point of organizing for outcomes you may not even see in your lifetime. One shouldn’t mistake a seeming return to the status quo as proof that the status quo is just as strong.
- oblio 7y agoHow do you "deal" with another country developing economically?
- fred_is_fred 7y agoWhy should they care, what's anyone going to do about it?
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- criddell 7y agoFor one, we should all be making sure our websites use https all the time. If all you have is a personal website serving up mostly static content then it might not seem like you need to bother with a certificate but things like the Great Cannon are a great argument that you do. It's not unlike a public health argument for why everybody should be vaccinated.
- marcosdumay 7y agoHTTPS will help your users not getting infected by code that a 3rd party injected on your site. But it will probably not help against the cannon, because the Chinese probably have some china controlled certificate installed.
- kick 7y agoThey've done it before, with GitHub: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5124784 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5124784
- gruez 7y ago>But it will probably not help against the cannon, because the Chinese probably have some china controlled certificate installed. The whole point of the cannon is that you can leverage the bandwidth of other countries. The CCP already controls the telecoms in China. They don't need to hijack Chinese computers for DDoS attacks when they can directly DDoS from their ISP's backbone.
- LandR 7y agoChina is essentially carrying out humanitrian atrocities not entirely dissimilar to the holocaust and no one cares, or if they "care", don't care to do anything about it. So no, no one is going to do anything about them DDoSing some sites.
- Causality1 7y agoExactly. WW2 didn't start because Hitler tried to exterminate the jews; it started because he invaded other countries. China could put a hundred million people to the sword and nobody would care as long as it stayed inside its own borders.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- jersey 7y agoHitler didn't start murdering jews in mass until after he invaded countries.
- lazyguy2 7y agoAlthough the Soviets certainly were mass murderers before WW2 and British and USA still sided with them. Hitler was elected under the pretense that he represented socialism that was friendlier to the middle class and workers. This way people could get their socialist improvements to the economy (which was shit due to bad world-wide economy and war reparations) while still having defense against the the sort of upheaval and murderous destruction that the Reds represented. The take-home lesson of WW2 shouldn't be that 'The other side was evil and we won'. Because the entire Eastern half of Europe and most of Asia was submitted to governments that were incredibly evil due to the Soviet victory. WW2's lessons are meaningless without WW1. They really are effectively the same war. The treaty of Versailles and the humiliation of the German civilian government are directly responsible for the rise of power of the Fascism in Germany. The take-home lesson of the 20th century wars is that massive murder and atrocities are only possible because people obey their governments. That 'The people' cannot discern true evil running the state until it's far too late. Because evil doesn't show up saying "Elect me because I want to gas the Jews". They gain power by promising what you want. By telling you what you want to hear. And once they gain power then it is the average person's willingness to obey authority and carry out orders is what turns shoe makers, engineers, and doctors into mass murderers. Which is the sort of thing that is happening in many parts of China. Always remember that in Vichy France when they rounded up the Jews for the holocaust it wasn't the Germans troops that went around arresting them. It was the French police that rounded up people to be put on those trains. It was under the order's of the French politicians. This problem of obeying governments is not something that is limited by national borders.
- blackearl 7y agoAccording to the article, the attacks are currently ineffective for a number of reasons, one being their js code is bugged. Imagine Gavrillo Princip's gun was prone to jamming consistently.
- SlowRobotAhead 7y agoWait, didn’t that happen though? I thought the arch duke was originally supposed to be killed in a failed bombing, and the handgun was a second and happenstance scenario.
- marcusverus 7y agoThere was a royal procession to City Hall in Sarajevo, during which a grenade was thrown at the Archduke. It (barely) missed, they drove off, and had a meeting with some local magistrate. After the meeting, Franz wanted to travel to the hospital to visit the civilians who'd been wounded by the errant grenade. En route, his driver, confused, took the same route from the morning procession. When they realized what was happening, they told him to turn around and get the out if there. When the driver stopped to turn around, they were ~1 block from the site of the first assassination attempt. One if the co-conspirators (who had lost his nerve the first time, and had been milling around and hoping that Franz would come back by), was standing where the car came to a stop. Two shots killed Fran's Ferdinand and his wife. Fun fact about this--Franz Ferdinand's death was not the cause of the Great War in the way that people tend to think it was. The assassination caused the war in the sense that it was a convenient excuse for a war that the Austro-Hungarians already wanted, but not because (Austro-Hungarian Emperor) Franz Joseph wanted revenge or anything like that. In fact, Franz Joseph's secretary later said that he "almost seemed grateful" that Ferdinand (whose marriage was so problematic that he had been forced to proactively abdicate on behalf of his children) was out of the way.
- SlowRobotAhead 7y agoThought so, that (in much less detail) was my recollection. Thanks for that.
- kradroy 7y agoBullets have been obsolete for decades. Wars are currently fought by selling shitty financial instruments en masse to your opponents while you sit and watch them implode from afar.
- basilgohar 7y agoThe ensuing civil strife that can occur if this is successful will make a literal, on the ground, bombs in the air, guns shoot war all the easier to attain for hawks that are good at stirring up the masses. Need I remind you that China has a male surplus, and sadly, military enlistment will become a stronger appeal for single men if they do not have a family nor hope of starting one in the traditional sense. More and more, war is looking like the nail to China's hammer of surplus men.
- chillacy 7y agoWW1 turned out to be far more deadly because the participants were stuck thinking of war in terms of old conflicts while technology advanced. I don’t see ground invasions working the same way against adversaries with nukes.
- emmelaich 7y agoPretty sure they don't care. They're also directing lasers at helicopter pilots, which is much closer to a actual war than mere bits. https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-12-06/chinese-fishing-vessels-laser-attacks-australian-military/11771808 https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-12-06/chinese-fishing-vesse...
- qxnqd 7y ago"They" as if it was the military doing it. It's probably bored fishermen. Edit: user "Apes" responded with: "Why is China giving their fishermen access to military grade lasers with helicopter tracking gear? I guess I'm just not familiar enough with fishing to understand how these military lasers would help catch fish." My response to his comment is: The part where they are "military grade lasers with helicopter tracking gear" is lucubration. You can blind any aircraft pilot using a 10€ laser from aliexpress. There have been lots of incidents of people blinding aeroplane pilots using those.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- seganddr 7y agoSays a brand new account....
- throw5543265 7y agoThe protesters in Hong Kong were also directing lasers at police and police helicopters. I don’t think that should be considered an “act of war.”
- Proven 7y agoDirecting lasers at foreign military aircraft in international waters vs. directing lasers at local police
- MR4D 7y agoWar seems to progress as follows: 0 - Peace 1 - Trade War 2 - Financial War 3 - Electronic War 4 - Shooting War Note that 1 & 2 are different types of Economic war, and could be grouped together. The steps occur in order, but steps can be skipped. From a US-centric point of view, North Korea and Iran seem to be at #3. China & Russia are at a limited version of #2. Chinese/HK seem to be at #3 with each other.Given how invisible Electronic War can be, it's possible that they are deep in #3. It's also possible that #4 might be initially fought with HK Police forces as a proxy. Think of that as "4a".
- EGreg 7y agoPretty sure that this is only recent at most
- jackcodes 7y agoExcept for the great electronic war of 1315
- tcbawo 7y agoPerhaps 3 could be rephrased as "industrial sabotage"
- chewbacha 7y agoI don't know who to attribute this to but I've heard a saying: "Countries that trade with each other don't make war with each other." As we isolate countries and disrupt trade we definitely are increasing the risk of conflict.
- Spooky23 7y agoThey don't need to hide anything. This type of activity is playing off of the success of the North Koreans and Russians in neutralizing US power in the face of a completely inept and corrupt government. The audience is other Asian and African states. The message is "we can act with impunity". The US will probably do some tit-for-tat exchange, but the US scope to do anything is limited due to the potential for impact on US businesses.
- kitteh 7y agoWhat's wild is how at times the GFW will be abused to profit the operators of the GFW itself. Redirecting people to sites owned by friends to drive traffic/sales, etc. Due to the nature of the GFW, there isn't a lot of auditing or transparency there. Only the Chinese carriers can generally engage them and it usually involves a visit to a specific building in Beijing (no foreigners allowed).