3 ms·

Note this also part of why Lasik is so expensive. You basically have to buy out your optometrist.

philwelch 7y ago
What? LASIK practitioners are opthamologists (not optometrists!) who, typically, do nothing except LASIK procedures. LASIK is "expensive" because there are plenty of people who are willing to pay $3000 for permanently better eyesight, LASIK equipment is expensive (especially the best and newest equipment), and because there's really not much of a low end to the market (because people generally only want the best available options in the "shining lasers into your eyes to permanently reshape them" market). Also, LASIK isn't that expensive compared to other surgical operations. Here's a price list from the Surgery Center of Oklahoma, which specializes in low-cost, out-of-pocket surgical procedures with transparent pricing: https://surgerycenterok.com/pricing/ https://surgerycenterok.com/pricing/ And here's the pricing from the LASIK specialist I went to: https://sharpe-vision.com/pricing/ https://sharpe-vision.com/pricing/ Notice how LASIK is pretty cheap compared to other surgeries--and this is from a cash surgical center in Oklahoma as opposed to the higher-cost locations Sharpe Vision operates from. I mean, there are cheaper surgeries out there, but probably because they're simpler and require less expensive equipment. For example, a local urologist in my area, "Dr. Snip", charges $1000 for a vasectomy: https://www.drsnip.com/getting-started/#billing https://www.drsnip.com/getting-started/#billing
- Scoundreller 7y ago
  I think the price is LASIK can be inflated by the costs it’s saving you from: often a couple decades of contacts and solution purchasing. That’s my main argument against getting the procedure done: my work benefits cover my lenses/contacts, so the $thousands doesn’t yield any out-of-pocket savings. If it saves me several hundred a year, it would be a good ROI. But I also stock up when chickpeas are 20 cents off/can. I do always think about going overseas though.
  - philwelch 7y ago
    The quality of life improvement is pretty huge. Sometimes you just get better vision after LASIK than you can be corrected to. I tested at 20/15 and sometimes 20/10 after my procedure.
- angry_octet 7y ago
  LASIK is notoriously profitable. Even more than Ortho, possibly less than radiology. Normally I would be annoyed by this, but LASIK has a small but significant rate of severely bad outcomes, and a larger rate of poor outcomes (e.g. extreme light sensitivity), and the cost reduces the number of bad outcomes.
  - philwelch 7y ago
    It’s also free of the notorious inefficiencies of insurance-bound medicine. So the profitability doesn’t necessarily translate to higher cost for the patient (at least comparing out-of-pocket prices). It’s almost like an actual free market!
latchkey 7y ago
I'm now living in Vietnam. Friend of mine wants laser eye surgery after I told them about my great experience with it in San Francisco. We go to the local eye hospital in Saigon which looks on the outside like it hasn't changed much since 1974. Kind of scary for a third world country. Turns out that the doctor speaks perfect english, they have all the very latest equipment and offer many different procedures depend on your eyes, they do literally tens of thousands of procedures a year. My friends operation cost $1600 and they were completely healed up within 24 hours. Mine cost $7500 and took 6 months. We are both happy with the results though. Of course mine was more complicated, I needed PRK which is more invasive... but still. The hospital here has the newer laser version of PRK (SMILE), which my 'best' doctor in SF didn't offer. Any way, I'm surprised medical tourism isn't more of a thing. I know that Thailand is starting to crack down on it because people are stiffing the hospitals with the bill. But this experience definitely opened my eyes (ha ha) to being more open about finding alternatives.
- quotemstr 7y ago
  > Thailand is starting to crack down on it because people are stiffing the hospitals with the bill. Why is that the government's problem? Hospitals can just require payment in advance or the use of some kind of escrow service.
  - latchkey 7y ago
    Thank you for calling me out on that. I didn't read deeply enough into the article. I stand corrected... the issue is more about tourists going to thailand without insurance. https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Asia-Insight/Tourism-proves-hazardous-to-Thai-hospitals-financial-health https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Asia-Insight/Tourism-prove... Also interestingly enough while searching for the above article, it seems Chinese medical tourism in Thailand is also on the rise.

What? LASIK practitioners are opthamologists (not optometrists!) who, typically, do nothing except LASIK procedures. LASIK is "expensive" because there are plenty of people who are willing to pay $3000 for permanently better eyesight, LASIK equipment is expensive (especially the best and newest equipment), and because there's really not much of a low end to the market (because people generally only want the best available options in the "shining lasers into your eyes to permanently reshape them" market). Also, LASIK isn't that expensive compared to other surgical operations. Here's a price list from the Surgery Center of Oklahoma, which specializes in low-cost, out-of-pocket surgical procedures with transparent pricing: https://surgerycenterok.com/pricing/ https://surgerycenterok.com/pricing/ And here's the pricing from the LASIK specialist I went to: https://sharpe-vision.com/pricing/ https://sharpe-vision.com/pricing/ Notice how LASIK is pretty cheap compared to other surgeries--and this is from a cash surgical center in Oklahoma as opposed to the higher-cost locations Sharpe Vision operates from. I mean, there are cheaper surgeries out there, but probably because they're simpler and require less expensive equipment. For example, a local urologist in my area, "Dr. Snip", charges $1000 for a vasectomy: https://www.drsnip.com/getting-started/#billing https://www.drsnip.com/getting-started/#billing

Scoundreller 7y ago
I think the price is LASIK can be inflated by the costs it’s saving you from: often a couple decades of contacts and solution purchasing. That’s my main argument against getting the procedure done: my work benefits cover my lenses/contacts, so the $thousands doesn’t yield any out-of-pocket savings. If it saves me several hundred a year, it would be a good ROI. But I also stock up when chickpeas are 20 cents off/can. I do always think about going overseas though.
- philwelch 7y ago
  The quality of life improvement is pretty huge. Sometimes you just get better vision after LASIK than you can be corrected to. I tested at 20/15 and sometimes 20/10 after my procedure.
angry_octet 7y ago
LASIK is notoriously profitable. Even more than Ortho, possibly less than radiology. Normally I would be annoyed by this, but LASIK has a small but significant rate of severely bad outcomes, and a larger rate of poor outcomes (e.g. extreme light sensitivity), and the cost reduces the number of bad outcomes.
- philwelch 7y ago
  It’s also free of the notorious inefficiencies of insurance-bound medicine. So the profitability doesn’t necessarily translate to higher cost for the patient (at least comparing out-of-pocket prices). It’s almost like an actual free market!

latchkey 7y ago

I'm now living in Vietnam. Friend of mine wants laser eye surgery after I told them about my great experience with it in San Francisco. We go to the local eye hospital in Saigon which looks on the outside like it hasn't changed much since 1974. Kind of scary for a third world country. Turns out that the doctor speaks perfect english, they have all the very latest equipment and offer many different procedures depend on your eyes, they do literally tens of thousands of procedures a year. My friends operation cost $1600 and they were completely healed up within 24 hours. Mine cost $7500 and took 6 months. We are both happy with the results though. Of course mine was more complicated, I needed PRK which is more invasive... but still. The hospital here has the newer laser version of PRK (SMILE), which my 'best' doctor in SF didn't offer. Any way, I'm surprised medical tourism isn't more of a thing. I know that Thailand is starting to crack down on it because people are stiffing the hospitals with the bill. But this experience definitely opened my eyes (ha ha) to being more open about finding alternatives.

quotemstr 7y ago
> Thailand is starting to crack down on it because people are stiffing the hospitals with the bill. Why is that the government's problem? Hospitals can just require payment in advance or the use of some kind of escrow service.
- latchkey 7y ago
  Thank you for calling me out on that. I didn't read deeply enough into the article. I stand corrected... the issue is more about tourists going to thailand without insurance. https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Asia-Insight/Tourism-proves-hazardous-to-Thai-hospitals-financial-health https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Asia-Insight/Tourism-prove... Also interestingly enough while searching for the above article, it seems Chinese medical tourism in Thailand is also on the rise.