10 ms·

While this is a great step forward, it's still going to take years for this to be even remotely accessible. I've been in therapy and taking various medications

While this is a great step forward, it's still going to take years for this to be even remotely accessible. I've been in therapy and taking various medications for years and haven't found anything that really works, at least for more than a brief period. Don't forget esketamine was also granted breakthrough treatment status recently, but I have yet to find a doctor willing to try it because it's "so new". On top of that, it's still outrageously expensive even with insurance, if insurance will even cover it at all because it's "so new" and I haven't yet exhausted every compound that's ever existed. Sigh.

tempsy 7y ago
Not to be facetious but why is the legal status of these drugs preventing you from trying them? Ketamine, LSD, shrooms are all accessible, and recreational varieties are not expensive.
- tyri_kai_psomi 7y ago
  Most people don't like to intentionally break the law.
  - fabiomaia 7y ago
    Most people intentionally stream movies illegally. The moral aspect of breaking the law is not a very strong argument here. I think the bigger moral issue with buying street drugs is that you are essentially funding organized crime.
    - tyri_kai_psomi 7y ago
      You mistakenly assume I mean strictly from a moral perspective. Assume a cost:benefit analysis, where the factors are, depending on the person, some combination of morality, desire to not face consequences (legal system, job, family), and perceived risk:reward ratio.
  - collyw 7y ago
    I would be surprised if there were a driver out there who hadn't gone above the speed limit.
- selectodude 7y ago
  Not OP, but I wouldn't even know where to begin trying to source street drugs, nor am I particularly interested in learning.
  - givinguflac 7y ago
    Ultimately this is the answer. On top of that though, I have no guarantee that these are real compounds and not cut with something. The last thing I need while in search of mental health is brain damage or poisoning.
    - selectodude 7y ago
      It's ludicrously expensive (I think I paid $3,000 for six sessions), but I've done a round at a local IV ketamine infusion center here in Chicago to great effect.
    - tempsy 7y ago
      there are test kits you can buy - buying on the darknet is similar to ebay - there are reviews and seller ratings etc if you are really struggling, cost is prohibitive, and you think this might be an option then trying it once or twice at home is reasonable risk reward tradeoff, speaking from personal experience.
    - jschwartzi 7y ago
      It’s rare with LSD but occasionally they’ll substitute a research chemical with similar effects. You’re more likely to have that happen with “MDMA” that is actually methamphetamine or one of the analogues. Both are horrible. There are places that sell home testing kits which are very useful since you don’t know what you’re getting by looking at it. People used to test for each other at raves until the police said it was a form of condoning drug use and shut it down. So now people still buy but it’s more dangerous.
    - WhompingWindows 7y ago
      Brain damage or poisoning are much, much less likely than simply having a bad trip, which can have PTSD-like symptoms. But if set and setting are carefully controlled, bad trips are much less likely to occur, as you have no overly negative stimuli to induce a bad trip.
- Beltiras 7y ago
  No regulatory body watching the production is one thing. You are buying from criminals. I'm all-in on the legalization of all drugs if only for the consumer protections it would introduce. Then there's the issue of harm-reduction for those that truly have a dependency/addiction problem AND generally freedom for freedoms sake. The psilocybin treatment is also reported as way more effective when administered as part of therapy. You are supposed to trip under the guidance of a professional.
  - AnthonBerg 7y ago
    ”You are supposed to trip under the guidance of a professional” I don’t think that this statement is technically accurate - fortunately. Studies have shown that following a certain protocol or setting will increase the effectiveness. That framework is published science.
    - Beltiras 7y ago
      I'm speaking within the framework of what is sensible, given the science. If you want the trip to have more lasting effect then according to the research you should have someone guiding you along. It kinda makes sense too. You can spend a trip looking at butterflies and admiring them taking with you from the experience a certain wonder for the beauty of nature. It might even help you with your depression somewhat but will not substitute professional guidance that will help you confront what is an underlying psychological issue actually causing the depression.
      - xorfish 7y ago
        I think the point was that a sitter doesn't need to do it professionaly. A trusted, sober guide with some experience will work as well.
    - unR34L 7y ago
      Could you provide a link to the protocol or framework that you mentioned? I’m considering trying Psylocybin and would like to get informed beforehand.
- astura 7y ago
  This is a ridiculous question, the answer is because they are illegal, of course. Most of us aren't willing to risk a criminal record. I wouldn't know where I could obtain such items even if I wanted to buy them. If I can't buy something off the shelf at a retail store I'm simply not going to bother. Sketchy/unknown supply chain. Tons of us have jobs (or whole careers!) that we could lose for using illegal drugs, many of those jobs include random drug tests. I'm not risking my entire fucking livelihood without a damn good reason.
  - tempsy 7y ago
    Hardly ridiculous. Marijuana is still illegal at the federal level but might as well be considered legal at this point. No one is going to go to jail because you purchased a small amount of drugs. If you are the seller it's a different story.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
    - wallace_f 7y ago
      That's obnoxiously ignorant. Even in high school one of my friends had their house raided and electronics, other valuables consfiscated. A dealer scapegoated him, and he had been searched and found with a pipe with resin in it. He carried the pipe to be cool. He had smoked weed less than 5 times at that point. I have other friends with criminal records for minute quantitites of personal use marijuana.
    - givinguflac 7y ago
      I’ve been to jail for a small amount of MJ. The chain of custody and the purity/contamination of a plant is much easier to track, then something like a powder a pill or liquid. There is literally no circumstance where I would trust something that wasn’t a plant on the black market
      - tempsy 7y ago
        Everyone has a different risk tolerance. People use LSD, ketamine, and shrooms all the time.
- liquidify 7y ago
  I would imagine a lot of people don't want to take LSD because of difficulty guaranteeing that it is actually real LSD-25 and not some other derivative. I think the American CIA was responsible for spiking the LSD supply with more dangerous alternatives at one point. And now, there are plenty of variants that are either mixed in and then sold, or sold directly as LSD, when they are actually not. Testing is difficult because the common tests only test for the presence of LSD-25, not the purity, and not for the presence of substitutes. Someone who mixed the pure substance with some more dangerous derivative would be impossible to detect without lab grade tools. This has stopped me from trying LSD for my whole life. I assume there are many others that don't want to take mind altering substances with unknown purity.
  - collyw 7y ago
    There is plenty of information on the internet on how to grow mushrooms.
  - melq 7y ago
    What sort of impurities are you concerned with? Are there many drugs that are psychoactive at such low (microgram) doses?
    - adrusi 7y ago
      Fentanyl is active in a range very similar to LSD, it's the biggest concern. 25i-NBOMe is a drug similar in effect to LSD, but with a somewhat worse track record for safety. It's not likely to harm you, and unless you're fairly familiar with LSD, you might not notice the difference, but it has caused deaths due to severe vasoconstriction, which hasn't happened with LSD, even though many more people have used the latter. It's requires larger doses than LSD does, but it's still active at doses well under a milligram, and is usually sold on blotter paper just like LSD is. Strychnine is also active in the LSD dose range. There was definitely some propaganda about strychnine-tainted LSD in the 70s, so it's hard to know if this has ever happened, or if it's just urban legend. But it's chemically plausible. Fortunately, you don't have to just pray that your blotter doesn't have fentanyl in it. You can buy chemical test kits on the clear market and rule out all the culprits that should be cause for concern, and test that your blotter contains LSD (or at least a compound containing an indole group...). See https://www.reddit.com/r/ReagentTesting/ https://www.reddit.com/r/ReagentTesting/ for links to vendors and more information.
- fiblye 7y ago
  There’s a very real risk of getting a knock at your door and going to prison. That’s more than enough to scare some people.
- kleer001 7y ago
  The substance is only part of the equation, there's a lot of value in the skill and wisdom in an individual therapist's attention and work. And no licensed therapist is going to risk working with street pharm.
- trashface 7y ago
  All of those are illegal in the US. And living there, you really, really, REALLY want to avoid the criminal justice system. Especially if you have anxiety/depression, which will trigger that system's "abnormal" profiling.
dwaltrip 7y ago
I stumbled upon this the other day: https://www.mycomeditations.com https://www.mycomeditations.com It looks fairly legitimate. Also, there are clinics in some major cities for ketamine treatment, but it isn't cheap. A couple grand for 6 infusions.
- givinguflac 7y ago
  Yeah, but after a few minutes of searching I can't find anything about where that "mycomeditations" place is physical located, which is sketchy enough for me to steer clear. Thanks though. But yeah I don't have thousands of dollars lying around
  - FDSGSG 7y ago
    A quick google search finds "100 Great Bay Rd, Treasure Beach, Jamaica". Given that the retreat is in Jamaica listing the specific address seems pretty meaningless, you aren't going to be able to streetview it.
  - Gene_Parmesan 7y ago
    Looks like Jamaica.
    - dwaltrip 7y ago
      Yep. From what I can tell, Jamaica and the Netherlands are the only countries where psilocybin is legal.
      - anesmithbeck 7y ago
        That's correct - we also run psilocybin retreats in Jamaica: https://atmanretreat.com https://atmanretreat.com
  - cartoonworld 7y ago
    Well, at the very least you can see Shane Mauss at Mycomeditations in January[0] [0] - http://www.shanemauss.com/club-dates/ http://www.shanemauss.com/club-dates/
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
turbo_fart_box 7y ago
Buy ketamine from darkweb and sniff it to your heart's content
- 19793378 7y ago
  Taking ketamine as a suppository (if you get powdered ketamine, you can just dissolve it in water) is much more pleasant than snorting it, and you get better control over the dosage. 5ml hobby syringes work well. If the price of prescribed IV ketamine treatment is a concern, this is well worth trying.
  - GordonS 7y ago
    Apart from reduced bioavailability, is there anything wrong with the oral route?
WalterSear 7y ago
Yes it still sucks. What worked for me was finding a doctor who specializes in treatment resistant depression, rather than a regular psychiatrist - they will be comfortable and open to prescribing many more 'difficult' medications such as strong MAOIs, transcranial stimulation, and ketamine.
throwaway837373 7y ago
There are plenty of legal "ketamine clinics" in big cities. Might suggest looking for those.

tempsy 7y ago

Not to be facetious but why is the legal status of these drugs preventing you from trying them? Ketamine, LSD, shrooms are all accessible, and recreational varieties are not expensive.

tyri_kai_psomi 7y ago
Most people don't like to intentionally break the law.
- fabiomaia 7y ago
  Most people intentionally stream movies illegally. The moral aspect of breaking the law is not a very strong argument here. I think the bigger moral issue with buying street drugs is that you are essentially funding organized crime.
  - tyri_kai_psomi 7y ago
    You mistakenly assume I mean strictly from a moral perspective. Assume a cost:benefit analysis, where the factors are, depending on the person, some combination of morality, desire to not face consequences (legal system, job, family), and perceived risk:reward ratio.
- collyw 7y ago
  I would be surprised if there were a driver out there who hadn't gone above the speed limit.
selectodude 7y ago
Not OP, but I wouldn't even know where to begin trying to source street drugs, nor am I particularly interested in learning.
- givinguflac 7y ago
  Ultimately this is the answer. On top of that though, I have no guarantee that these are real compounds and not cut with something. The last thing I need while in search of mental health is brain damage or poisoning.
  - selectodude 7y ago
    It's ludicrously expensive (I think I paid $3,000 for six sessions), but I've done a round at a local IV ketamine infusion center here in Chicago to great effect.
  - tempsy 7y ago
    there are test kits you can buy - buying on the darknet is similar to ebay - there are reviews and seller ratings etc if you are really struggling, cost is prohibitive, and you think this might be an option then trying it once or twice at home is reasonable risk reward tradeoff, speaking from personal experience.
  - jschwartzi 7y ago
    It’s rare with LSD but occasionally they’ll substitute a research chemical with similar effects. You’re more likely to have that happen with “MDMA” that is actually methamphetamine or one of the analogues. Both are horrible. There are places that sell home testing kits which are very useful since you don’t know what you’re getting by looking at it. People used to test for each other at raves until the police said it was a form of condoning drug use and shut it down. So now people still buy but it’s more dangerous.
  - WhompingWindows 7y ago
    Brain damage or poisoning are much, much less likely than simply having a bad trip, which can have PTSD-like symptoms. But if set and setting are carefully controlled, bad trips are much less likely to occur, as you have no overly negative stimuli to induce a bad trip.
Beltiras 7y ago
No regulatory body watching the production is one thing. You are buying from criminals. I'm all-in on the legalization of all drugs if only for the consumer protections it would introduce. Then there's the issue of harm-reduction for those that truly have a dependency/addiction problem AND generally freedom for freedoms sake. The psilocybin treatment is also reported as way more effective when administered as part of therapy. You are supposed to trip under the guidance of a professional.
- AnthonBerg 7y ago
  ”You are supposed to trip under the guidance of a professional” I don’t think that this statement is technically accurate - fortunately. Studies have shown that following a certain protocol or setting will increase the effectiveness. That framework is published science.
  - Beltiras 7y ago
    I'm speaking within the framework of what is sensible, given the science. If you want the trip to have more lasting effect then according to the research you should have someone guiding you along. It kinda makes sense too. You can spend a trip looking at butterflies and admiring them taking with you from the experience a certain wonder for the beauty of nature. It might even help you with your depression somewhat but will not substitute professional guidance that will help you confront what is an underlying psychological issue actually causing the depression.
    - xorfish 7y ago
      I think the point was that a sitter doesn't need to do it professionaly. A trusted, sober guide with some experience will work as well.
  - unR34L 7y ago
    Could you provide a link to the protocol or framework that you mentioned? I’m considering trying Psylocybin and would like to get informed beforehand.
astura 7y ago
This is a ridiculous question, the answer is because they are illegal, of course. Most of us aren't willing to risk a criminal record. I wouldn't know where I could obtain such items even if I wanted to buy them. If I can't buy something off the shelf at a retail store I'm simply not going to bother. Sketchy/unknown supply chain. Tons of us have jobs (or whole careers!) that we could lose for using illegal drugs, many of those jobs include random drug tests. I'm not risking my entire fucking livelihood without a damn good reason.
- tempsy 7y ago
  Hardly ridiculous. Marijuana is still illegal at the federal level but might as well be considered legal at this point. No one is going to go to jail because you purchased a small amount of drugs. If you are the seller it's a different story.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - wallace_f 7y ago
    That's obnoxiously ignorant. Even in high school one of my friends had their house raided and electronics, other valuables consfiscated. A dealer scapegoated him, and he had been searched and found with a pipe with resin in it. He carried the pipe to be cool. He had smoked weed less than 5 times at that point. I have other friends with criminal records for minute quantitites of personal use marijuana.
  - givinguflac 7y ago
    I’ve been to jail for a small amount of MJ. The chain of custody and the purity/contamination of a plant is much easier to track, then something like a powder a pill or liquid. There is literally no circumstance where I would trust something that wasn’t a plant on the black market
    - tempsy 7y ago
      Everyone has a different risk tolerance. People use LSD, ketamine, and shrooms all the time.
liquidify 7y ago
I would imagine a lot of people don't want to take LSD because of difficulty guaranteeing that it is actually real LSD-25 and not some other derivative. I think the American CIA was responsible for spiking the LSD supply with more dangerous alternatives at one point. And now, there are plenty of variants that are either mixed in and then sold, or sold directly as LSD, when they are actually not. Testing is difficult because the common tests only test for the presence of LSD-25, not the purity, and not for the presence of substitutes. Someone who mixed the pure substance with some more dangerous derivative would be impossible to detect without lab grade tools. This has stopped me from trying LSD for my whole life. I assume there are many others that don't want to take mind altering substances with unknown purity.
- collyw 7y ago
  There is plenty of information on the internet on how to grow mushrooms.
- melq 7y ago
  What sort of impurities are you concerned with? Are there many drugs that are psychoactive at such low (microgram) doses?
  - adrusi 7y ago
    Fentanyl is active in a range very similar to LSD, it's the biggest concern. 25i-NBOMe is a drug similar in effect to LSD, but with a somewhat worse track record for safety. It's not likely to harm you, and unless you're fairly familiar with LSD, you might not notice the difference, but it has caused deaths due to severe vasoconstriction, which hasn't happened with LSD, even though many more people have used the latter. It's requires larger doses than LSD does, but it's still active at doses well under a milligram, and is usually sold on blotter paper just like LSD is. Strychnine is also active in the LSD dose range. There was definitely some propaganda about strychnine-tainted LSD in the 70s, so it's hard to know if this has ever happened, or if it's just urban legend. But it's chemically plausible. Fortunately, you don't have to just pray that your blotter doesn't have fentanyl in it. You can buy chemical test kits on the clear market and rule out all the culprits that should be cause for concern, and test that your blotter contains LSD (or at least a compound containing an indole group...). See https://www.reddit.com/r/ReagentTesting/ https://www.reddit.com/r/ReagentTesting/ for links to vendors and more information.
fiblye 7y ago
There’s a very real risk of getting a knock at your door and going to prison. That’s more than enough to scare some people.
kleer001 7y ago
The substance is only part of the equation, there's a lot of value in the skill and wisdom in an individual therapist's attention and work. And no licensed therapist is going to risk working with street pharm.
trashface 7y ago
All of those are illegal in the US. And living there, you really, really, REALLY want to avoid the criminal justice system. Especially if you have anxiety/depression, which will trigger that system's "abnormal" profiling.

dwaltrip 7y ago

I stumbled upon this the other day: https://www.mycomeditations.com https://www.mycomeditations.com It looks fairly legitimate. Also, there are clinics in some major cities for ketamine treatment, but it isn't cheap. A couple grand for 6 infusions.

givinguflac 7y ago
Yeah, but after a few minutes of searching I can't find anything about where that "mycomeditations" place is physical located, which is sketchy enough for me to steer clear. Thanks though. But yeah I don't have thousands of dollars lying around
- FDSGSG 7y ago
  A quick google search finds "100 Great Bay Rd, Treasure Beach, Jamaica". Given that the retreat is in Jamaica listing the specific address seems pretty meaningless, you aren't going to be able to streetview it.
- Gene_Parmesan 7y ago
  Looks like Jamaica.
  - dwaltrip 7y ago
    Yep. From what I can tell, Jamaica and the Netherlands are the only countries where psilocybin is legal.
    - anesmithbeck 7y ago
      That's correct - we also run psilocybin retreats in Jamaica: https://atmanretreat.com https://atmanretreat.com
- cartoonworld 7y ago
  Well, at the very least you can see Shane Mauss at Mycomeditations in January[0] [0] - http://www.shanemauss.com/club-dates/ http://www.shanemauss.com/club-dates/

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

turbo_fart_box 7y ago

Buy ketamine from darkweb and sniff it to your heart's content

19793378 7y ago
Taking ketamine as a suppository (if you get powdered ketamine, you can just dissolve it in water) is much more pleasant than snorting it, and you get better control over the dosage. 5ml hobby syringes work well. If the price of prescribed IV ketamine treatment is a concern, this is well worth trying.
- GordonS 7y ago
  Apart from reduced bioavailability, is there anything wrong with the oral route?

WalterSear 7y ago

Yes it still sucks. What worked for me was finding a doctor who specializes in treatment resistant depression, rather than a regular psychiatrist - they will be comfortable and open to prescribing many more 'difficult' medications such as strong MAOIs, transcranial stimulation, and ketamine.

throwaway837373 7y ago

There are plenty of legal "ketamine clinics" in big cities. Might suggest looking for those.