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Either there's a rule of law or there's not. You can't hide from the police and then claim that the very act of hiding is an act of torture enacted on you by th

Either there's a rule of law or there's not. You can't hide from the police and then claim that the very act of hiding is an act of torture enacted on you by the police.

k1m 7y ago
You're assuming he had a lot of choice in the matter and that the UN didn't take that into account. Nils Melzer when asked about it responded: "Mr. Assange was about as free to leave as someone sitting on a rubber boat in a shark pool." - https://twitter.com/NilsMelzer/status/1134400849097220102 https://twitter.com/NilsMelzer/status/1134400849097220102 Also, as far as I'm aware, Assange didn't claim he was tortured, the UN experts on torture came to that conclusion.
raxxorrax 7y ago
The rule of law is followed to the letter by state actors as everyone knows...
authoritarian 7y ago
> Either there's a rule of law or there's not. You can't hide from the police and then claim that the very act of hiding is an act of torture enacted on you by the police. So by that logic Anne Frank was in the wrong, and wasn't psychologically abused/tortured in any way by the Nazis because she was breaking the law?
- lucozade 7y ago
  Please don't. Assange jumped bail after a multi stage judicial process on charges of rape and sexual molestation. Ms Frank was hiding to avoid genocidal extermination by an occupying force during war. They're not equivalent.
  - authoritarian 7y ago
    I didn't say they were equivalent. OP said that there's rule of law, and that if you are hiding from the police you can't claim that having to hide is an act of torture, which is obviously not always the case
- solipsism 7y ago
  Part of the rule of law is that laws must be just and impartial. The laws and actions of the Third Reich obviously did not have that quality. The two situations aren't remotely comparable. But you probably know that, you're just trolling.
  - authoritarian 7y ago
    Throughout history it's been very clearly demonstrated that laws are not always just and impartial. I'd even go so far as to argue that there has never been a time in history where all laws were just and impartial. Having a difference of opinion doesn't automatically make the other person a troll, and acting like that's the case doesn't lead to productive discourse
klagermkii 7y ago
The "rule of law" isn't about individual citizens submitting to the system. It's about the people in power following a standardised process based on the crime that was supposedly committed, and being applied uniformly, vs the "rule of man" where things are handled on an adhoc manner based on who's in power and who's being charged. The system can be breaching the "rule of law", not the individuals targeted by that system.
- solipsism 7y ago
  I didn't claim Assange was breaching the rule of law. Part of the rule of law is that individuals are accountable for their actions. A court of law is usually the correct way to determine accountability. The state is obligated to protect individuals (in this case the women who were allegedly raped) via the justice system. The idea that having to flee charges is tantamount to being tortured implies the state does not have that right. If there is to be the rule of law, the state has not only the right but the obligation.

Either there's a rule of law or there's not. You can't hide from the police and then claim that the very act of hiding is an act of torture enacted on you by the police.

k1m 7y ago

You're assuming he had a lot of choice in the matter and that the UN didn't take that into account. Nils Melzer when asked about it responded: "Mr. Assange was about as free to leave as someone sitting on a rubber boat in a shark pool." - https://twitter.com/NilsMelzer/status/1134400849097220102 https://twitter.com/NilsMelzer/status/1134400849097220102 Also, as far as I'm aware, Assange didn't claim he was tortured, the UN experts on torture came to that conclusion.

raxxorrax 7y ago

The rule of law is followed to the letter by state actors as everyone knows...

authoritarian 7y ago

> Either there's a rule of law or there's not. You can't hide from the police and then claim that the very act of hiding is an act of torture enacted on you by the police. So by that logic Anne Frank was in the wrong, and wasn't psychologically abused/tortured in any way by the Nazis because she was breaking the law?

lucozade 7y ago
Please don't. Assange jumped bail after a multi stage judicial process on charges of rape and sexual molestation. Ms Frank was hiding to avoid genocidal extermination by an occupying force during war. They're not equivalent.
- authoritarian 7y ago
  I didn't say they were equivalent. OP said that there's rule of law, and that if you are hiding from the police you can't claim that having to hide is an act of torture, which is obviously not always the case
solipsism 7y ago
Part of the rule of law is that laws must be just and impartial. The laws and actions of the Third Reich obviously did not have that quality. The two situations aren't remotely comparable. But you probably know that, you're just trolling.
- authoritarian 7y ago
  Throughout history it's been very clearly demonstrated that laws are not always just and impartial. I'd even go so far as to argue that there has never been a time in history where all laws were just and impartial. Having a difference of opinion doesn't automatically make the other person a troll, and acting like that's the case doesn't lead to productive discourse

klagermkii 7y ago

The "rule of law" isn't about individual citizens submitting to the system. It's about the people in power following a standardised process based on the crime that was supposedly committed, and being applied uniformly, vs the "rule of man" where things are handled on an adhoc manner based on who's in power and who's being charged. The system can be breaching the "rule of law", not the individuals targeted by that system.

solipsism 7y ago
I didn't claim Assange was breaching the rule of law. Part of the rule of law is that individuals are accountable for their actions. A court of law is usually the correct way to determine accountability. The state is obligated to protect individuals (in this case the women who were allegedly raped) via the justice system. The idea that having to flee charges is tantamount to being tortured implies the state does not have that right. If there is to be the rule of law, the state has not only the right but the obligation.