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A jedermann Konto or Basiskonto refers only to a personal account. If a client uses this account for commercial activities (eg receiving payments in the said in

A jedermann Konto or Basiskonto refers only to a personal account. If a client uses this account for commercial activities (eg receiving payments in the said industry), the bank has every right to close the account.

yati 7y ago
So I can't use my personal account to receive salaries? Does the bank have to know/care about the details my profession?
- odiroot 7y ago
  You can if you're employed by another entity. You cannot use the same account to run a business.
- ptaipale 7y ago
  Depends on what your "salary" is. In the EU, the banks are obligated to find out where you get your money. And they have an obligation to close your account if they don't get satisfactory answers. "Know your customer". My bank has recently started to ask customers to clarify transfers, and even shoot and send some video of themselves, smiling, and explaining things. I haven't got that myself yet but several colleagues have. I'm thinking I should change banks, but am unsure if any other bank is any better, because this is the result of government regulation. The EU laws to fight money laundering are in conflict with national laws for privacy. And because laws for money laundering impact tax revenue, they will triumph over privacy.
  - Ralfp 7y ago
    In EU there is an anti-money laundering directive, but it’s mostly up to member countries how they’ll implement it. As usual some countries implemented it reasonably while others didn’t.
    - rusk 7y ago
      There are new stricter rules coming in 2020, which is, some theorise, a major motivation behind brexit ...
    - ptaipale 7y ago
      The regulation is rather new, and at least Scandinavian banks seem to be hyper sensitive to be on the safe side from the money laundering risk point of view. In part this is due to the allegations and campaigns against Nordea and the actual laundering scandal at Swedbank. The privacy of customers (against having to provide personal information to the bank) is secondary.
  - GoblinSlayer 7y ago
    This is what puzzles me. Why they need an explanation how money flows in their own system? Don't they see all transfers?
    - ptaipale 7y ago
      They may see who is the sender of transfer, but that in itself is not a sufficient explanation for where the funds actually come and whether they are legitimate. Series of transfers are a basic step in money laundering processes, so from that point of view the need for clarification of each step is understandable.
  - TheOtherHobbes 7y ago
    My business got a KYC letter last year. So far I've ignored it. They haven't shut the account yet. These things are usually treated as box ticking exercises, not as fervent investigative due diligence. I would guess money laundering happens elsewhere. For as little as $1m you can set up or buy a bank of your own. For $10m or more you can buy a regulated operating bank with employees and deposits. The process is more complicated than plain old incorporation, but I would guess it won't be unduly troubling to people with a lot of spare cash at hand.
    - ptaipale 7y ago
      I suppose you can ignore the letters, if having your bank account suspended for some weeks doesn't cause major business risks to you. The downside with box ticking exercises is that eventually, someone may calculate the ticks, and his/her guidelines will say that this account belongs to a risky category.
  - krageon 7y ago
    Your bank doesn't need to be so invasive, so if they are you need to switch. There is no EU directive that tells them to clarify things using some sort of weird video proof.
    - ptaipale 7y ago
      But that may still be the easiest of ways required by the financial authority - which comes up with its own rules, the EU rules only being the minimum of what regulators in each country must implement. Often regulators want to be stricter, in order appear as "good tax collectors" and to avoid being targeted by social media campaigns etc.
- kmlx 7y ago
  yes. they will close your account if you receive money from dubious activities (sex and drugs usually). they will also close your account if you can't prove where the money is from. i had this issue myself in europe. a friend paid me back a hefty sum. my friend had issues proving where he got the money from. my account was swiftly closed.
  - oAlbe 7y ago
    What happens when an account is closed? Do they send you a check with the remainder of the money on the account, or do you lose everything?
    - kmlx 7y ago
      you lose everything.
merb 7y ago
btw. that's not technically the truth since you can open a Basiskonto as a company.

yati 7y ago

So I can't use my personal account to receive salaries? Does the bank have to know/care about the details my profession?

odiroot 7y ago
You can if you're employed by another entity. You cannot use the same account to run a business.
ptaipale 7y ago
Depends on what your "salary" is. In the EU, the banks are obligated to find out where you get your money. And they have an obligation to close your account if they don't get satisfactory answers. "Know your customer". My bank has recently started to ask customers to clarify transfers, and even shoot and send some video of themselves, smiling, and explaining things. I haven't got that myself yet but several colleagues have. I'm thinking I should change banks, but am unsure if any other bank is any better, because this is the result of government regulation. The EU laws to fight money laundering are in conflict with national laws for privacy. And because laws for money laundering impact tax revenue, they will triumph over privacy.
- Ralfp 7y ago
  In EU there is an anti-money laundering directive, but it’s mostly up to member countries how they’ll implement it. As usual some countries implemented it reasonably while others didn’t.
  - rusk 7y ago
    There are new stricter rules coming in 2020, which is, some theorise, a major motivation behind brexit ...
  - ptaipale 7y ago
    The regulation is rather new, and at least Scandinavian banks seem to be hyper sensitive to be on the safe side from the money laundering risk point of view. In part this is due to the allegations and campaigns against Nordea and the actual laundering scandal at Swedbank. The privacy of customers (against having to provide personal information to the bank) is secondary.
- GoblinSlayer 7y ago
  This is what puzzles me. Why they need an explanation how money flows in their own system? Don't they see all transfers?
  - ptaipale 7y ago
    They may see who is the sender of transfer, but that in itself is not a sufficient explanation for where the funds actually come and whether they are legitimate. Series of transfers are a basic step in money laundering processes, so from that point of view the need for clarification of each step is understandable.
- TheOtherHobbes 7y ago
  My business got a KYC letter last year. So far I've ignored it. They haven't shut the account yet. These things are usually treated as box ticking exercises, not as fervent investigative due diligence. I would guess money laundering happens elsewhere. For as little as $1m you can set up or buy a bank of your own. For $10m or more you can buy a regulated operating bank with employees and deposits. The process is more complicated than plain old incorporation, but I would guess it won't be unduly troubling to people with a lot of spare cash at hand.
  - ptaipale 7y ago
    I suppose you can ignore the letters, if having your bank account suspended for some weeks doesn't cause major business risks to you. The downside with box ticking exercises is that eventually, someone may calculate the ticks, and his/her guidelines will say that this account belongs to a risky category.
- krageon 7y ago
  Your bank doesn't need to be so invasive, so if they are you need to switch. There is no EU directive that tells them to clarify things using some sort of weird video proof.
  - ptaipale 7y ago
    But that may still be the easiest of ways required by the financial authority - which comes up with its own rules, the EU rules only being the minimum of what regulators in each country must implement. Often regulators want to be stricter, in order appear as "good tax collectors" and to avoid being targeted by social media campaigns etc.
kmlx 7y ago
yes. they will close your account if you receive money from dubious activities (sex and drugs usually). they will also close your account if you can't prove where the money is from. i had this issue myself in europe. a friend paid me back a hefty sum. my friend had issues proving where he got the money from. my account was swiftly closed.
- oAlbe 7y ago
  What happens when an account is closed? Do they send you a check with the remainder of the money on the account, or do you lose everything?
  - kmlx 7y ago
    you lose everything.

merb 7y ago

btw. that's not technically the truth since you can open a Basiskonto as a company.