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>Maybe I'm missing something, but what does the Cambridge Analytica scandal have to do with AI? I also missed all the bad things that happened because of Cambr

by treis 7y ago

>Maybe I'm missing something, but what does the Cambridge Analytica scandal have to do with AI? I also missed all the bad things that happened because of Cambridge Analytica. Even if we take their extremely dubious claims about their effectiveness at face value them running amok resulted in politicians being better able to target ads. That's not exactly the stuff of nightmares.

nooron 7y ago
I work in digital for the Democratic Party. You are correct. If you look at my comment history you’ll see me affirming this.
osrec 7y ago
Well, it sort of is my nightmare. I disagree with hyperbole in general, but politicians being able to easily manipulate truth across vast swathes of society is my idea of a nightmare (a pretty scary one at that).
save_ferris 7y ago
Did you watch the Channel 4 report[0]? The CEO of CA clandestinely advertised far more than just ads for the reporter posing as a potential client. They are in the business of winning elections, through whatever means necessary. He openly talked about things like targeting and entrapping political opponents with blackmail via "honeypots". His deputies made some really interesting statements during that report as well. I highly recommend watching the report, it's a fascinating watch. Based on what he was caught saying on camera, in addition to his deputies, and the reporting around their political campaigns in Africa using propaganda that claimed AIDS would come back if so-and-so were elected, it's not a stretch to imagine those people doing everything the can, legally and illegally, to sway an election. 0: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpbeOCKZFfQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpbeOCKZFfQ
- puranjay 7y ago
  But this has always happened in politics. CA just optimized it
  - virgilp 7y ago
    -people always travelled, automobile just optimized it -people always produced goods, factories just optimized it -people always used weapons, nuclear energy just optimized them ... never underestimate the impact of “just optimizing” something
- SmirkingRevenge 7y ago
  That footage certainly doesn't make them look good, but the real question is how much of that is sales-pitch, marketing bs, and how much of it is really effective. Every data upstart in the world has the best data, can target audiences with precision, get your brand unprecedented engagement, and use their magical ML algorithms to do magical things - according to their marketing and sales teams. Blah, blah, blah. Meanwhile if you could peek into the actual data engineering, their data is a giant mess, totally stale, and barely better than useless (which to be fair, is all it takes to make money in the data space right now). But it terms of actual influence... well... always be skeptical.
  - save_ferris 7y ago
    > The real question is how much of that is sales-pitch, marketing bs, and how much of it is really effective. Sure, they may not be able to deliver super effective results today, few startups in their early days do. What they’ve identified, though, is that there is a vast market of incredible wealth willing to pay for services like this. CA may have shut down, but Nix turned around and founded another company that does the exact same thing[0]. Keep in mind that these guys also have access to incredible investment money, they don’t have to go out and raise seed rounds, series rounds, etc. These companies are being built in secret, and it’s incredibly short-sighted to write them off for their capabilities today, because if they succeed tomorrow, we’re in really big trouble. 0: https://www.newsweek.com/what-emerdata-scl-group-executives-flee-new-firm-and-its-registered-office-909334 https://www.newsweek.com/what-emerdata-scl-group-executives-...
- lozf 7y ago
  See also "The Great Hack" (2019) via Netflix.
basch 7y ago
plus CA was an aggregate human misbehavior, people pressing "give away my friends data" en masse. It was millions of people being careless with each others data.
cm2012 7y ago
I am a professional FB advertiser and I would be shocked if the CA data was valuable in any way. Big lists of poorly targeted and categorized users are going to lose 99/100 against FB lookalike audiences.
- Supermancho 7y ago
  > I would be shocked if the CA data was valuable in any way. Indeed. There are plenty of companies that would pay a LOT of money to use that data in any meaningful way. It doesn't happen, but people will convince themselves it's important data, enabling a host of dying properties to fool a handful of market actors into getting a profitable exit. The amount of user data leveraged from most acquisitions is basically 0, excepting a few mailings. Conversely, consumer reach (active users) matters a great deal.

by treis 7y ago

nooron 7y ago

I work in digital for the Democratic Party. You are correct. If you look at my comment history you’ll see me affirming this.

osrec 7y ago

Well, it sort of is my nightmare. I disagree with hyperbole in general, but politicians being able to easily manipulate truth across vast swathes of society is my idea of a nightmare (a pretty scary one at that).

save_ferris 7y ago

Did you watch the Channel 4 report[0]? The CEO of CA clandestinely advertised far more than just ads for the reporter posing as a potential client. They are in the business of winning elections, through whatever means necessary. He openly talked about things like targeting and entrapping political opponents with blackmail via "honeypots". His deputies made some really interesting statements during that report as well. I highly recommend watching the report, it's a fascinating watch. Based on what he was caught saying on camera, in addition to his deputies, and the reporting around their political campaigns in Africa using propaganda that claimed AIDS would come back if so-and-so were elected, it's not a stretch to imagine those people doing everything the can, legally and illegally, to sway an election. 0: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpbeOCKZFfQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpbeOCKZFfQ

puranjay 7y ago
But this has always happened in politics. CA just optimized it
- virgilp 7y ago
  -people always travelled, automobile just optimized it -people always produced goods, factories just optimized it -people always used weapons, nuclear energy just optimized them ... never underestimate the impact of “just optimizing” something
SmirkingRevenge 7y ago
That footage certainly doesn't make them look good, but the real question is how much of that is sales-pitch, marketing bs, and how much of it is really effective. Every data upstart in the world has the best data, can target audiences with precision, get your brand unprecedented engagement, and use their magical ML algorithms to do magical things - according to their marketing and sales teams. Blah, blah, blah. Meanwhile if you could peek into the actual data engineering, their data is a giant mess, totally stale, and barely better than useless (which to be fair, is all it takes to make money in the data space right now). But it terms of actual influence... well... always be skeptical.
- save_ferris 7y ago
  > The real question is how much of that is sales-pitch, marketing bs, and how much of it is really effective. Sure, they may not be able to deliver super effective results today, few startups in their early days do. What they’ve identified, though, is that there is a vast market of incredible wealth willing to pay for services like this. CA may have shut down, but Nix turned around and founded another company that does the exact same thing[0]. Keep in mind that these guys also have access to incredible investment money, they don’t have to go out and raise seed rounds, series rounds, etc. These companies are being built in secret, and it’s incredibly short-sighted to write them off for their capabilities today, because if they succeed tomorrow, we’re in really big trouble. 0: https://www.newsweek.com/what-emerdata-scl-group-executives-flee-new-firm-and-its-registered-office-909334 https://www.newsweek.com/what-emerdata-scl-group-executives-...
lozf 7y ago
See also "The Great Hack" (2019) via Netflix.

basch 7y ago

plus CA was an aggregate human misbehavior, people pressing "give away my friends data" en masse. It was millions of people being careless with each others data.

cm2012 7y ago

I am a professional FB advertiser and I would be shocked if the CA data was valuable in any way. Big lists of poorly targeted and categorized users are going to lose 99/100 against FB lookalike audiences.

Supermancho 7y ago
> I would be shocked if the CA data was valuable in any way. Indeed. There are plenty of companies that would pay a LOT of money to use that data in any meaningful way. It doesn't happen, but people will convince themselves it's important data, enabling a host of dying properties to fool a handful of market actors into getting a profitable exit. The amount of user data leveraged from most acquisitions is basically 0, excepting a few mailings. Conversely, consumer reach (active users) matters a great deal.