4 ms·

No one who wants to talk securely should ever use a facebook-owned channel in the first place.

gpm 7y ago
It depends who your adversaries are. It's one thing to say "they shouldn't use a facebook channel to talk securely", it's another to say "they shouldn't use a facebook channel on the same device as they use another channel to talk securely". My understanding of this was that it is the latter. Unfortunately people often don't have the luxury of doing the latter.
- dotancohen 7y ago
  > Unfortunately people often don't have the luxury of doing the latter. What? Just don't install the Facebook or other social apps. I do have Telegram, but no other social media apps on my phone. If you need to communicate, then SMS / MMS / telephone is fine. What can be done with Facebook that cannot be done with normal SMS or MMS or phone calls or video calls?
  - pmoriarty 7y ago
    The Facebook app came pre-installed on my Android phone, and I couldn't get rid of it without rooting my phone (which would make it less secure).
    - e12e 7y ago
      Sad to see you're downvoted. The state of open source on Android is quite dire - it's difficult to run a fully patched ASOP - and the alternative is "customized" os installs with tons of crap. If nothing else, the more code that runs, the more bugs to exploit.
  - gpm 7y ago
    I also don't have any facebook apps on my phone - but from what I understand there are countries where whatsapp is how a lot of business is done. If you can't afford the time and opportunity cost of avoiding those businesses you have to install it.
    - dotancohen 7y ago
      I actually do live in a country where people expect you to have Whatsapp, both for personal and for business. And I still don't install it.
  - whack 7y ago
    SMS and MMS and phone calls are far less secure than whatsapp
pmoriarty 7y ago
Arguably, they shouldn't be using a smartphone or any computer at all, if they really want to be secure.
ahbyb 7y ago
Unless you're arguing that Facebook-owned channels are more prone to security bugs, I don't see how this conversation is useful. Let's not forget that whatsapp is end-to-end encrypted by default; they literally brought end-to-end encryption to the masses.

gpm 7y ago

It depends who your adversaries are. It's one thing to say "they shouldn't use a facebook channel to talk securely", it's another to say "they shouldn't use a facebook channel on the same device as they use another channel to talk securely". My understanding of this was that it is the latter. Unfortunately people often don't have the luxury of doing the latter.

dotancohen 7y ago
> Unfortunately people often don't have the luxury of doing the latter. What? Just don't install the Facebook or other social apps. I do have Telegram, but no other social media apps on my phone. If you need to communicate, then SMS / MMS / telephone is fine. What can be done with Facebook that cannot be done with normal SMS or MMS or phone calls or video calls?
- pmoriarty 7y ago
  The Facebook app came pre-installed on my Android phone, and I couldn't get rid of it without rooting my phone (which would make it less secure).
  - e12e 7y ago
    Sad to see you're downvoted. The state of open source on Android is quite dire - it's difficult to run a fully patched ASOP - and the alternative is "customized" os installs with tons of crap. If nothing else, the more code that runs, the more bugs to exploit.
- gpm 7y ago
  I also don't have any facebook apps on my phone - but from what I understand there are countries where whatsapp is how a lot of business is done. If you can't afford the time and opportunity cost of avoiding those businesses you have to install it.
  - dotancohen 7y ago
    I actually do live in a country where people expect you to have Whatsapp, both for personal and for business. And I still don't install it.
- whack 7y ago
  SMS and MMS and phone calls are far less secure than whatsapp

pmoriarty 7y ago

Arguably, they shouldn't be using a smartphone or any computer at all, if they really want to be secure.

ahbyb 7y ago

Unless you're arguing that Facebook-owned channels are more prone to security bugs, I don't see how this conversation is useful. Let's not forget that whatsapp is end-to-end encrypted by default; they literally brought end-to-end encryption to the masses.