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The sun is the most significant contributor to the temperature on the planet earth. For now, this contribution seems stable, but in the past, the heat of the s

The sun is the most significant contributor to the temperature on the planet earth. For now, this contribution seems stable, but in the past, the heat of the sun has fluctuated quickly. CO2 may be the primary contributor to our climate temperature at the moment, but to think that a government is entirely responsible for climate temperature is like saying your parents are responsible for the current behaviour of the sun. It is too simplistic, and it will encourage people to believe that a government has more say about reality than it does. We should prepare for warmer and colder climates: In our near future, there could be a small scale nuclear war between Pakistan and India, there could be a massive volcanic eruption or a meteor strike. This last era of climatic temperature stability was a lucky thing that let civilization rise as quickly as it did. A responsible government would harden it's seed stocks against warmer/colder temperatures and train up its youth to be dynamic and imaginative problem solvers.

JonnyaiR 7y ago
They aren't suing the German Government because they say it's responsible for Global Warming, they're suing because the German Government publicly announced Goals for CO2 reduction till 2020 by 40% which they failed to deliver by a wide margin. By the way the scientific consensus is that CO2 is the biggest contributor to global Warming, proven time and time again.
- ratboy666 7y ago
  I imagine that the "consensus" has been proven, sure. "scientific consensus" is not a thing. Also, "proven time and time again"? Just to let you know, water vapour is a much larger contributor. Sure, sue because the Government lied. Why don't you vote them out? Can you sue them?
  - pjc50 7y ago
    Yes, water vapor is a contributor - but at an equilibrium rate determined by the temperature! In the narrow band of temperature we live in, increases in CO2 drive an increase in vapor which magnifies their effect. There's even a nice explainer in IPCC AR5 about this ("FAQ 8.1"): https://www.ipcc.ch/site/assets/uploads/2018/02/WG1AR5_Chapter08_FINAL.pdf https://www.ipcc.ch/site/assets/uploads/2018/02/WG1AR5_Chapt... > Currently, water vapour has the largest greenhouse effect in the Earth’s atmosphere. However, other greenhouse gases, primarily CO2, are necessary to sustain the presence of water vapour in the atmosphere. Indeed, if these other gases were removed from the atmosphere, its temperature would drop sufficiently to induce a decrease of water vapour, leading to a runaway drop of the greenhouse effect that would plunge the Earth into a frozen state. So greenhouse gases other than water vapour provide the temperature structure that sustains current levels of atmo-spheric water vapour. Therefore, although CO2 is the main anthropogenic control knob on climate, water vapour is a strong and fast feedback that amplifies any initial forcing by a typical factor between two and three. Water vapour is not a significant initial forcing, but is nevertheless a fundamental agent of climate change.
  - tito 7y ago
    Yes, consensus. From NASA’s https://climate.nasa.gov/scientific-consensus/# https://climate.nasa.gov/scientific-consensus/# "The number of papers rejecting AGW [Anthropogenic, or human-caused, Global Warming] is a miniscule proportion of the published research, with the percentage slightly decreasing over time. Among papers expressing a position on AGW, an overwhelming percentage (97.2% based on self-ratings, 97.1% based on abstract ratings) endorses the scientific consensus on AGW.” J. Cook, et al, "Consensus on consensus: a synthesis of consensus estimates on human-caused global warming," Environmental Research Letters Vol. 11 No. 4, (13 April 2016); DOI:10.1088/1748-9326/11/4/048002 Agreed that the point of science isn’t consensus. It’s ok.
simion314 7y ago
In the case of Germany there are good reasons to blame the politicians, replacing existing nuclear with coal to score with the greens is one such reason.
krageon 7y ago
It's common courtesy to provide a foundation for outlandish claims when you make them. Otherwise it just sounds like you're making a whole lot of things up.
- mikelyons 7y ago
  Making these kind of claims often relies on obscuring any sort of foundation, and mental gymnastics to deny anything other than a sarcastic take on common courtesy.

JonnyaiR 7y ago

They aren't suing the German Government because they say it's responsible for Global Warming, they're suing because the German Government publicly announced Goals for CO2 reduction till 2020 by 40% which they failed to deliver by a wide margin. By the way the scientific consensus is that CO2 is the biggest contributor to global Warming, proven time and time again.

ratboy666 7y ago
I imagine that the "consensus" has been proven, sure. "scientific consensus" is not a thing. Also, "proven time and time again"? Just to let you know, water vapour is a much larger contributor. Sure, sue because the Government lied. Why don't you vote them out? Can you sue them?
- pjc50 7y ago
  Yes, water vapor is a contributor - but at an equilibrium rate determined by the temperature! In the narrow band of temperature we live in, increases in CO2 drive an increase in vapor which magnifies their effect. There's even a nice explainer in IPCC AR5 about this ("FAQ 8.1"): https://www.ipcc.ch/site/assets/uploads/2018/02/WG1AR5_Chapter08_FINAL.pdf https://www.ipcc.ch/site/assets/uploads/2018/02/WG1AR5_Chapt... > Currently, water vapour has the largest greenhouse effect in the Earth’s atmosphere. However, other greenhouse gases, primarily CO2, are necessary to sustain the presence of water vapour in the atmosphere. Indeed, if these other gases were removed from the atmosphere, its temperature would drop sufficiently to induce a decrease of water vapour, leading to a runaway drop of the greenhouse effect that would plunge the Earth into a frozen state. So greenhouse gases other than water vapour provide the temperature structure that sustains current levels of atmo-spheric water vapour. Therefore, although CO2 is the main anthropogenic control knob on climate, water vapour is a strong and fast feedback that amplifies any initial forcing by a typical factor between two and three. Water vapour is not a significant initial forcing, but is nevertheless a fundamental agent of climate change.
- tito 7y ago
  Yes, consensus. From NASA’s https://climate.nasa.gov/scientific-consensus/# https://climate.nasa.gov/scientific-consensus/# "The number of papers rejecting AGW [Anthropogenic, or human-caused, Global Warming] is a miniscule proportion of the published research, with the percentage slightly decreasing over time. Among papers expressing a position on AGW, an overwhelming percentage (97.2% based on self-ratings, 97.1% based on abstract ratings) endorses the scientific consensus on AGW.” J. Cook, et al, "Consensus on consensus: a synthesis of consensus estimates on human-caused global warming," Environmental Research Letters Vol. 11 No. 4, (13 April 2016); DOI:10.1088/1748-9326/11/4/048002 Agreed that the point of science isn’t consensus. It’s ok.

simion314 7y ago

In the case of Germany there are good reasons to blame the politicians, replacing existing nuclear with coal to score with the greens is one such reason.

krageon 7y ago

It's common courtesy to provide a foundation for outlandish claims when you make them. Otherwise it just sounds like you're making a whole lot of things up.

mikelyons 7y ago
Making these kind of claims often relies on obscuring any sort of foundation, and mental gymnastics to deny anything other than a sarcastic take on common courtesy.