12 ms·

I am no fighter pilot, but I (used to) fly airplanes, floatplanes and helicopters. A watch with a 12 day battery life makes little sense to me as I find it too

I am no fighter pilot, but I (used to) fly airplanes, floatplanes and helicopters. A watch with a 12 day battery life makes little sense to me as I find it too easy to forget to charge it. Even if you put it on a checklist, it may be too late to charge it when you are about to go. For my flights I mostly use an automatic Glycine 24hr watch with a second dial set on UTC for "Zulu" time. If the watch is running at the beginning of the flight (confirmed with a checklist) it will continue running during the flight. I have to admit that this Garmin MARQ looks lovely though :)

spapas82 7y ago
Hello could you please explain what's the added value of the 24h face? I looked at some pics and feels too crumped; however I understand that it's preferred among pilots. Thank you
- billziss 7y ago
  Zulu time where I mostly fly is 8 hours off local time. If the watch is a regular 12 hour watch you have to do a mental calculation for time and as a pilot you learn that the less mental calculations the better, when a lot of things are happening in the cockpit. It is true that the 24 hour display is cramped. But I got used to it after 15 years with this watch. I cannot find the exact version that I have online, but this one is the closest: https://www.jomashop.com/media/catalog/product/g/l/glycine-airman-blue-dial-automatic-men_s-gmt-watch-3930.38.lbk8.jpg https://www.jomashop.com/media/catalog/product/g/l/glycine-a... I have mine on a nato strap.
  - gorgoiler 7y ago
    What information are you receiving during flight that is in Zulu time? Are all communications done in Zulu time?
    - heelix 7y ago
      Yup. Weather, flight planning, most of the interaction with https://www.aviationweather.gov/ https://www.aviationweather.gov/
  - amscanne 7y ago
    I think the watch you linked is the Glycine Airman GMT. I believe the standard hour hand actually has a 12-hour sweep (yes, even though the labels are both 24-hour) and only the GMT hand (pointing to the 10) has a 24-hour sweep. From what you've described, you probably have the Glycine Airman Purist [1]. There is no GMT hand but the regular hour hand has a 24-hour sweep (and you can set the second hour dial). (I also have a Purist.) [1] https://www.jomashop.com/glycine-watch-gl0134.html https://www.jomashop.com/glycine-watch-gl0134.html
    - billziss 7y ago
      I was curious, so I dug out the watch. It is a Glycine Airman 2000. See here for a review from 1999: https://www.timezone.com/2002/09/17/the-glycine-airman-2000-3-time-zone-model-101599/ https://www.timezone.com/2002/09/17/the-glycine-airman-2000-... EDIT: A couple of differences from the watch presented in the article: - My watch has a transparent back. - My watch is 42mm and not 40mm (I may be wrong on this last one).
AdrianB1 7y ago
I fly sport planes and the battery in the iPad I use to augment the cockpit has a 5 hour life. I definitely have the "charged iPad" on the checklist, I don't make assumptions and I make sure to charge it before flight. I use it for GPS altitude only as I have 2 baro altimeters and an old Garmin GPS, but the iPad's GPS is usually more precise to indicate current height above ground. A 12 day battery life for a smartwatch I would only wear when flying is more than enough. I would not wear the smart watch on the ground, my regular watch is running without any maintenance for 21 years (Citizen EcoDrive).
- billziss 7y ago
  I think this likely has to do more with individual habits rather than anything else. But I find that watches that I do not use all the time are more likely not to be ready to be used when I need them. For example, I have an old Suunto Ambit watch that I used for outdoor activities and/or exercise. I found that because I was not wearing it all the time, it was not charged most of the time that I needed it.
  - loeg 7y ago
    I put my GPS watch on the charger and forget about it when I'm not using it.
- onion2k 7y ago
  Probably a silly question, but why can't you charge the iPad in flight? Surely planes have some sort of socket like cars?
  - ryanlol 7y ago
    >Surely planes have some sort of socket like cars? Unfortunately no, and often it’s not trivial to legally install one.
    - andromeduck 7y ago
      If you can install an iPad surely it wouldn't be too difficult to also install a battery pack to boost the battery life if nothing else.
smacktoward 7y ago
This is the U.S. military we're talking about, remember. When the battery on the watch runs down, they probably just throw the watch out and buy a new one.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
persistent 7y ago
These watches don't have anywhere near 12 day life with the GPS enabled. Depending on the watch and the temperature it is anywhere from 2 to 30 hours.
- billziss 7y ago
  Good catch! From the Garmin MARQ Aviator page: > Smartwatch mode: Up to 12 days > GPS mode: Up to 28 hours > GPS with Music: Up to 9 hours > UltraTrac™ mode: Up to 48 hours
  - dfox 7y ago
    Almost any GNSS receiver is by design power hungry. Modern mostly SDR constructions have faster time to (reasonable) fix, but still it involves large amounts of essentially opportunistic computantion to acquire and track the CDMA downlinks. This is one of the arguments why Spy-Fi style inconspicuous and globally accurate and useful trackers are nonsense. The whole process of associating with 2G GSM network and sending one MO-SM message is incredibly energy expensive, but getting reasonable GNSS fix is in completely different barpark.
    - mNovak 7y ago
      Possibly more feasible if you periodically capture and store a few ms raw IQ, then transfer a quick burst when the handler comes near, to do the nav solution offline.
      - angry_octet 7y ago
        Yep, there are a number of offline ways to solve for position. It needs 200-500mS of GNSS signal. I like the Yabby: https://www.digitalmatter.com/Devices/Lorawan-Trackers/Yabby-LoRaWAN https://www.digitalmatter.com/Devices/Lorawan-Trackers/Yabby... Also: http://chipfox.cz/ http://chipfox.cz/
mc32 7y ago
That does look like a 21st century fliegeruhr. Looks nice. One wouldn’t think a ‘watch’ would still prove useful for flight, but obviously the durability and modern features make this watch indispensable in flight emergencies.
- billziss 7y ago
  Agree. The Garmin MARQ Aviator is beautiful. They just need to make a solar version that does not require charging and then I am a buyer.
  - piquadrat 7y ago
    There is a solar version of the Fenix 6 (the slightly less ridiculously priced sportswatch brother of the MARQ series), and according to most reviews, it barely makes a dent on battery life. I wouldn't hold my breath for self-sufficiency.
nradov 7y ago
If you're wearing the watch on a daily basis then the battery gauge on the face makes it obvious when you need to recharge. You can fully charge the battery in the time it takes to shower and dress in the morning. And if you're only wearing it for flights then just leave it connected to the charger at other times.
LeftHandPath 7y ago
They are functional, durable, and extremely common in my office of Learjet and King Air pilots. I agree with you on the battery life. Personally I'd rather have some world-timer, but I'm an asshole.
throw0101a 7y ago
There's a reason why second timezone watches are called "GMT": the original one (Rolex GMT-Master) was designed in partnership with Pan-Am Airlines: * https://www.bobswatches.com/rolex-blog/watch-review/everyone-remembers-the-first-the-rolex-gmt-master-reference-6542.html https://www.bobswatches.com/rolex-blog/watch-review/everyone...
Johnny555 7y ago
I have a Garmin Fenix watch and the long battery life is why I chose it - it's much better than most smart watches. I charge it every week and have over 50% battery life by the next week.
Spearchucker 7y ago
Maybe a stretch to equip F18/As with a USB plug, but could make sense in airplanes, floatplane and helicopters.
coldtea 7y ago
>I am no fighter pilot, but I (used to) fly airplanes, floatplanes and helicopters. A watch with a 12 day battery life makes little sense to me as I find it too easy to forget to charge it. Even if you put it on a checklist, it may be too late to charge it when you are about to go. Whereas a watch with a 24hr battery makes more sense? I'd say, if you're to forget it, you are to forget it, whether it holds a 24h or 12 days... And if you're doing an emergency landing and/or you're stranded somewhere, you'll want to have that 12 day watch with you, not the 24h one...

spapas82 7y ago

Hello could you please explain what's the added value of the 24h face? I looked at some pics and feels too crumped; however I understand that it's preferred among pilots. Thank you

billziss 7y ago
Zulu time where I mostly fly is 8 hours off local time. If the watch is a regular 12 hour watch you have to do a mental calculation for time and as a pilot you learn that the less mental calculations the better, when a lot of things are happening in the cockpit. It is true that the 24 hour display is cramped. But I got used to it after 15 years with this watch. I cannot find the exact version that I have online, but this one is the closest: https://www.jomashop.com/media/catalog/product/g/l/glycine-airman-blue-dial-automatic-men_s-gmt-watch-3930.38.lbk8.jpg https://www.jomashop.com/media/catalog/product/g/l/glycine-a... I have mine on a nato strap.
- gorgoiler 7y ago
  What information are you receiving during flight that is in Zulu time? Are all communications done in Zulu time?
  - heelix 7y ago
    Yup. Weather, flight planning, most of the interaction with https://www.aviationweather.gov/ https://www.aviationweather.gov/
- amscanne 7y ago
  I think the watch you linked is the Glycine Airman GMT. I believe the standard hour hand actually has a 12-hour sweep (yes, even though the labels are both 24-hour) and only the GMT hand (pointing to the 10) has a 24-hour sweep. From what you've described, you probably have the Glycine Airman Purist [1]. There is no GMT hand but the regular hour hand has a 24-hour sweep (and you can set the second hour dial). (I also have a Purist.) [1] https://www.jomashop.com/glycine-watch-gl0134.html https://www.jomashop.com/glycine-watch-gl0134.html
  - billziss 7y ago
    I was curious, so I dug out the watch. It is a Glycine Airman 2000. See here for a review from 1999: https://www.timezone.com/2002/09/17/the-glycine-airman-2000-3-time-zone-model-101599/ https://www.timezone.com/2002/09/17/the-glycine-airman-2000-... EDIT: A couple of differences from the watch presented in the article: - My watch has a transparent back. - My watch is 42mm and not 40mm (I may be wrong on this last one).

AdrianB1 7y ago

I fly sport planes and the battery in the iPad I use to augment the cockpit has a 5 hour life. I definitely have the "charged iPad" on the checklist, I don't make assumptions and I make sure to charge it before flight. I use it for GPS altitude only as I have 2 baro altimeters and an old Garmin GPS, but the iPad's GPS is usually more precise to indicate current height above ground. A 12 day battery life for a smartwatch I would only wear when flying is more than enough. I would not wear the smart watch on the ground, my regular watch is running without any maintenance for 21 years (Citizen EcoDrive).

billziss 7y ago
I think this likely has to do more with individual habits rather than anything else. But I find that watches that I do not use all the time are more likely not to be ready to be used when I need them. For example, I have an old Suunto Ambit watch that I used for outdoor activities and/or exercise. I found that because I was not wearing it all the time, it was not charged most of the time that I needed it.
- loeg 7y ago
  I put my GPS watch on the charger and forget about it when I'm not using it.
onion2k 7y ago
Probably a silly question, but why can't you charge the iPad in flight? Surely planes have some sort of socket like cars?
- ryanlol 7y ago
  >Surely planes have some sort of socket like cars? Unfortunately no, and often it’s not trivial to legally install one.
  - andromeduck 7y ago
    If you can install an iPad surely it wouldn't be too difficult to also install a battery pack to boost the battery life if nothing else.

smacktoward 7y ago

This is the U.S. military we're talking about, remember. When the battery on the watch runs down, they probably just throw the watch out and buy a new one.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

persistent 7y ago

These watches don't have anywhere near 12 day life with the GPS enabled. Depending on the watch and the temperature it is anywhere from 2 to 30 hours.

billziss 7y ago
Good catch! From the Garmin MARQ Aviator page: > Smartwatch mode: Up to 12 days > GPS mode: Up to 28 hours > GPS with Music: Up to 9 hours > UltraTrac™ mode: Up to 48 hours
- dfox 7y ago
  Almost any GNSS receiver is by design power hungry. Modern mostly SDR constructions have faster time to (reasonable) fix, but still it involves large amounts of essentially opportunistic computantion to acquire and track the CDMA downlinks. This is one of the arguments why Spy-Fi style inconspicuous and globally accurate and useful trackers are nonsense. The whole process of associating with 2G GSM network and sending one MO-SM message is incredibly energy expensive, but getting reasonable GNSS fix is in completely different barpark.
  - mNovak 7y ago
    Possibly more feasible if you periodically capture and store a few ms raw IQ, then transfer a quick burst when the handler comes near, to do the nav solution offline.
    - angry_octet 7y ago
      Yep, there are a number of offline ways to solve for position. It needs 200-500mS of GNSS signal. I like the Yabby: https://www.digitalmatter.com/Devices/Lorawan-Trackers/Yabby-LoRaWAN https://www.digitalmatter.com/Devices/Lorawan-Trackers/Yabby... Also: http://chipfox.cz/ http://chipfox.cz/

mc32 7y ago

That does look like a 21st century fliegeruhr. Looks nice. One wouldn’t think a ‘watch’ would still prove useful for flight, but obviously the durability and modern features make this watch indispensable in flight emergencies.

billziss 7y ago
Agree. The Garmin MARQ Aviator is beautiful. They just need to make a solar version that does not require charging and then I am a buyer.
- piquadrat 7y ago
  There is a solar version of the Fenix 6 (the slightly less ridiculously priced sportswatch brother of the MARQ series), and according to most reviews, it barely makes a dent on battery life. I wouldn't hold my breath for self-sufficiency.

nradov 7y ago

If you're wearing the watch on a daily basis then the battery gauge on the face makes it obvious when you need to recharge. You can fully charge the battery in the time it takes to shower and dress in the morning. And if you're only wearing it for flights then just leave it connected to the charger at other times.

LeftHandPath 7y ago

They are functional, durable, and extremely common in my office of Learjet and King Air pilots. I agree with you on the battery life. Personally I'd rather have some world-timer, but I'm an asshole.

throw0101a 7y ago

There's a reason why second timezone watches are called "GMT": the original one (Rolex GMT-Master) was designed in partnership with Pan-Am Airlines: * https://www.bobswatches.com/rolex-blog/watch-review/everyone-remembers-the-first-the-rolex-gmt-master-reference-6542.html https://www.bobswatches.com/rolex-blog/watch-review/everyone...

Johnny555 7y ago

I have a Garmin Fenix watch and the long battery life is why I chose it - it's much better than most smart watches. I charge it every week and have over 50% battery life by the next week.

Spearchucker 7y ago

Maybe a stretch to equip F18/As with a USB plug, but could make sense in airplanes, floatplane and helicopters.

coldtea 7y ago

>I am no fighter pilot, but I (used to) fly airplanes, floatplanes and helicopters. A watch with a 12 day battery life makes little sense to me as I find it too easy to forget to charge it. Even if you put it on a checklist, it may be too late to charge it when you are about to go. Whereas a watch with a 24hr battery makes more sense? I'd say, if you're to forget it, you are to forget it, whether it holds a 24h or 12 days... And if you're doing an emergency landing and/or you're stranded somewhere, you'll want to have that 12 day watch with you, not the 24h one...