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They look beautiful. You know, like art. Is that also of no value? That said, is art (or having a beautiful environment) worth, in this particular case, fillin

They look beautiful. You know, like art. Is that also of no value? That said, is art (or having a beautiful environment) worth, in this particular case, filling the oceans with junk and killing people, probably not. But let's not pretend that fashion is a worthless status-seeking endeavor but playing video games is a window to a new world here.

yifanl 7y ago
> They look beautiful. You know, like art. Is that also of no value? Ecologically speaking, yes, there is zero value whatsoever in aesthetics. And yes, I do understand I look like an insane homeless man with my unkempt hair and decade old college outfit :)
pbhjpbhj 7y ago
Not all aesthetic creations are valuable art. If you want to buy ever more clothing because the designer created art, then pay the designer the same, produce one piece and put it in a museum; then we can get on with economising to reduce or negative impact on the planet sufficiently so it race might just survive the next few centuries. What's the relative pollution of production of an article of fashion wear vs a game download? It's going to be something like a 100k times more pollution from the clothing, surely?
bartread 7y ago
I'm basically on board with you but I think we're conflating two things here. Fashion, by which I include clothes, jewellery, accessories, etc., is not a single uniform thing. Fast-fashion, in particular, is categorically not art, and is particularly egregious in terms of the environment. But, on the other hand, I just got a sweet deal on an absolutely beautiful motorcycle jacket (that I will wear whilst motorcycling, not just for show!) that, even on sale, was as expensive as my my winter jacket and trousers combined, but will probably last me a decade or more if I stay roughly the same shape. Is that art? I don't know, it might be: it definitely looks really awesome, and it's probably still going to look awesome in 10 years' time. Then you've got handmade stuff, in terms of both clothing and jewellery. I don't tend to go there because it's generally way beyond my budget, but it becomes hard to deny that it's not art. And whatever you may think about the value of it, there is something to be said for wearing nice stuff: the trick is to reach the point where you can do it for yourself without caring what anyone else thinks, and to make sure you buy things that are going to last, and ideally have a certain amount of timelessness to them.

yifanl 7y ago

> They look beautiful. You know, like art. Is that also of no value? Ecologically speaking, yes, there is zero value whatsoever in aesthetics. And yes, I do understand I look like an insane homeless man with my unkempt hair and decade old college outfit :)

pbhjpbhj 7y ago

Not all aesthetic creations are valuable art. If you want to buy ever more clothing because the designer created art, then pay the designer the same, produce one piece and put it in a museum; then we can get on with economising to reduce or negative impact on the planet sufficiently so it race might just survive the next few centuries. What's the relative pollution of production of an article of fashion wear vs a game download? It's going to be something like a 100k times more pollution from the clothing, surely?

bartread 7y ago

I'm basically on board with you but I think we're conflating two things here. Fashion, by which I include clothes, jewellery, accessories, etc., is not a single uniform thing. Fast-fashion, in particular, is categorically not art, and is particularly egregious in terms of the environment. But, on the other hand, I just got a sweet deal on an absolutely beautiful motorcycle jacket (that I will wear whilst motorcycling, not just for show!) that, even on sale, was as expensive as my my winter jacket and trousers combined, but will probably last me a decade or more if I stay roughly the same shape. Is that art? I don't know, it might be: it definitely looks really awesome, and it's probably still going to look awesome in 10 years' time. Then you've got handmade stuff, in terms of both clothing and jewellery. I don't tend to go there because it's generally way beyond my budget, but it becomes hard to deny that it's not art. And whatever you may think about the value of it, there is something to be said for wearing nice stuff: the trick is to reach the point where you can do it for yourself without caring what anyone else thinks, and to make sure you buy things that are going to last, and ideally have a certain amount of timelessness to them.