7 ms·

The latest CNN veritas videos are eye opening. Chomsky is still dead on as far as I can tell.

by edoo 7y ago

cbnotfromthere 7y ago
Using CNN to confirm Chomsky is like using RT to confirm Putin.
- leto_ii 7y ago
  I had to make an account just to point out that your analogy doesn't make any sense :D RT (like CNN) is a network (mostly) aligned with the interests of the power structure of its respective country. Chomsky is a dissident and critic of the power structure of his country, therefore broadly in disagreement with the CNN world view.
- 300bps 7y ago
  CNN Veritas videos aren’t from CNN. They are undercover videos that purport to show CNN’s biases. https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2019/10/15/project_veritas_hidden_camera_footage_from_inside_cnn.html https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2019/10/15/project_v...
  - DiabloD3 7y ago
    What I don't understand is why people are claiming CNN doesn't have a bias: if a news media outlet exists, it is biased, and that is an immutable rule.
    - Paradigma11 7y ago
      Which makes the use of the term "bias" worthless. I do see quite obvious differences in the bias of say fox (not the news section) vs cnn. Fox just lazily omits facts and arguments that don't fit while cnn presents both sides most of the time. I do not care if the information is framed in a specific way since i have to make up my mind anyway. Then there are real propaganda outlets like the state owned RT or http://www.globaltimes.cn/opinion/ http://www.globaltimes.cn/opinion/ . I do think that making these distinctions is useful.
ianleeclark 7y ago
It's deeply disturbing anyone would still give credence to Veritas or O'keefe after nearly decades of selective editing and outright false allegations. How quickly we've forgotten their WaPo scandal.
- swebs 7y ago
  It was hidden camera footage from a whistle blower who worked at CNN. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7XZmugtLv4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7XZmugtLv4
  - ianleeclark 7y ago
    Oh, it was camera footage, so we can automatically trust it despite the fact that the project doing it is inherently untrustworthy: https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/a-woman-approached-the-post-with-dramatic--and-false--tale-about-roy-moore-sje-appears-to-be-part-of-undercover-sting-operation/2017/11/27/0c2e335a-cfb6-11e7-9d3a-bcbe2af58c3a_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/a-woman-approa... and https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/what-you-dont-see-in-okeefe-video-may-be-as-important-as-what-you-do/2017/06/28/dcb67446-5b7c-11e7-a9f6-7c3296387341_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/what-you-dont... Deep fakes are going to rock your world.
    - swebs 7y ago
      Are you claiming that the recordings of the CEO of CNN presented here are deep fakes?
      - ianleeclark 7y ago
        No.
    - segfaultbuserr 7y ago
      (deleted my original comment, because I think this thread is a more suitable place to reply) > Oh, it was camera footage, so we can automatically trust it despite the fact that the project doing it is inherently untrustworthy. Agree. I was interested in fringe politics as a social phenomenon and I've been following it for a year or two. I now see CNN as a media outlet largely serving their interest groups. But see RT, Project Veritas, etc., as "second-order propaganda" serving their respective interest groups by selectively "exposing" targets for their political utility, not because they care about truth, it's half-truth, half-falsehoold. Meanwhile, the accusations of the mainstream media are made against them, not because they care about truth, but because their existence damaged the mainstream's own interest. It's all biases vs. biases all the way down. If someone spends enough time and effort while maintaining rationality, it's possible to extract a great deal of useful information from the sum of all these propaganda. I think it's what open-source intelligence is largely about. But I don't want to waste time doing this. Nowadays, I view many things in politics as mere talking points without make judgements, and get most of my news from Hacker News (which is, of course, heavily biased towards the Silicon Valley). > Deep fakes are going to rock your world. Definitely. I think most (internet-savvy) people will eventually learn it and ignore things like that. In Ghost in the Shell: S.A.C. 2nd GIG (second season of the TV animation), one group of politicians for their personal interests within the government, has launched a conspiracy to intensify a military conflict (against the refugee uprising) that involves nuclear weapon. The protagonists from Section 9, a national security agency that operates independent from the executive, saw the truth from the satellite footage, had the following dialogue. > "How do we stop it? Can we post the video footage online?" > "No. Video footage nowadays is seen as completely unreliable to this day." Since most video footage "exposure" themselves are propaganda or hoaxes. Released in 2000s, it portrayed and predicted our world remarkably well, and it'll give you a lot of inspirations of what would the future society look like.
tjpnz 7y ago
I watched it this morning without knowing anything about the creators beforehand, so came to it with a reasonably open mind. As it progressed I kept on expecting something explosive, perhaps akin to what I saw in Outfoxed. But the whole thing completely fizzled out and ended with the creators basically begging for whistleblowers. I hadn't had my morning coffee by that point - was there something there I missed?
- edoo 7y ago
  I found the media director opining about not being allowed to do objective journalism and the CEO driving the narrative irregardless of evidence to be quite shocking.
- sremani 7y ago
  What you missed was the simple fact that you are PRIMED. Even if you did not know about the "intruders", you have an opinion about CNN brand, which determined your approach towards the video.
KirinDave 7y ago
Why is CNN even remotely relevant? Their average US show gets less views in a night than a PewDiePie video. Fox News is literally 3-5x their viewership, and unlike CNN is concentrated in a very specific set of demos that is much more open to television news as a format and medium. That CNN is part of the propaganda machine is doubtless. But they're just not that important compared to the bigger players.
- blotter_paper 7y ago
  > Why is CNN even remotely relevant? > That CNN is part of the propaganda machine is doubtless. So being "part of the propaganda machine" isn't enough to qualify as "even remotely relevant"? :/ If you value consistency and intellectual honesty you might want to backtrack on one of these claims or at least admit that your statements are obviously incompatible without further qualification. "Even remotely" isn't a very high bar to meet.
sundarurfriend 7y ago
For anyone else not familiar with these "veritas videos": > Project Veritas is an American right-wing activist group. The group uses "disguises and hidden cameras to uncover supposed liberal bias and corruption." The group is known for producing deceptively edited videos about media organizations and left-leaning groups. In a 2018 book on propaganda and disinformation in U.S. politics, three Harvard University scholars refer to Project Veritas as a "right-wing disinformation outfit." (Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Veritas https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Veritas) I guess that explains the downvotes.

The latest CNN veritas videos are eye opening. Chomsky is still dead on as far as I can tell.

by edoo 7y ago

The latest CNN veritas videos are eye opening. Chomsky is still dead on as far as I can tell.

cbnotfromthere 7y ago

Using CNN to confirm Chomsky is like using RT to confirm Putin.

leto_ii 7y ago
I had to make an account just to point out that your analogy doesn't make any sense :D RT (like CNN) is a network (mostly) aligned with the interests of the power structure of its respective country. Chomsky is a dissident and critic of the power structure of his country, therefore broadly in disagreement with the CNN world view.
300bps 7y ago
CNN Veritas videos aren’t from CNN. They are undercover videos that purport to show CNN’s biases. https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2019/10/15/project_veritas_hidden_camera_footage_from_inside_cnn.html https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2019/10/15/project_v...
- DiabloD3 7y ago
  What I don't understand is why people are claiming CNN doesn't have a bias: if a news media outlet exists, it is biased, and that is an immutable rule.
  - Paradigma11 7y ago
    Which makes the use of the term "bias" worthless. I do see quite obvious differences in the bias of say fox (not the news section) vs cnn. Fox just lazily omits facts and arguments that don't fit while cnn presents both sides most of the time. I do not care if the information is framed in a specific way since i have to make up my mind anyway. Then there are real propaganda outlets like the state owned RT or http://www.globaltimes.cn/opinion/ http://www.globaltimes.cn/opinion/ . I do think that making these distinctions is useful.

ianleeclark 7y ago

It's deeply disturbing anyone would still give credence to Veritas or O'keefe after nearly decades of selective editing and outright false allegations. How quickly we've forgotten their WaPo scandal.

swebs 7y ago
It was hidden camera footage from a whistle blower who worked at CNN. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7XZmugtLv4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7XZmugtLv4
- ianleeclark 7y ago
  Oh, it was camera footage, so we can automatically trust it despite the fact that the project doing it is inherently untrustworthy: https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/a-woman-approached-the-post-with-dramatic--and-false--tale-about-roy-moore-sje-appears-to-be-part-of-undercover-sting-operation/2017/11/27/0c2e335a-cfb6-11e7-9d3a-bcbe2af58c3a_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/a-woman-approa... and https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/what-you-dont-see-in-okeefe-video-may-be-as-important-as-what-you-do/2017/06/28/dcb67446-5b7c-11e7-a9f6-7c3296387341_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/what-you-dont... Deep fakes are going to rock your world.
  - swebs 7y ago
    Are you claiming that the recordings of the CEO of CNN presented here are deep fakes?
    - ianleeclark 7y ago
      No.
  - segfaultbuserr 7y ago
    (deleted my original comment, because I think this thread is a more suitable place to reply) > Oh, it was camera footage, so we can automatically trust it despite the fact that the project doing it is inherently untrustworthy. Agree. I was interested in fringe politics as a social phenomenon and I've been following it for a year or two. I now see CNN as a media outlet largely serving their interest groups. But see RT, Project Veritas, etc., as "second-order propaganda" serving their respective interest groups by selectively "exposing" targets for their political utility, not because they care about truth, it's half-truth, half-falsehoold. Meanwhile, the accusations of the mainstream media are made against them, not because they care about truth, but because their existence damaged the mainstream's own interest. It's all biases vs. biases all the way down. If someone spends enough time and effort while maintaining rationality, it's possible to extract a great deal of useful information from the sum of all these propaganda. I think it's what open-source intelligence is largely about. But I don't want to waste time doing this. Nowadays, I view many things in politics as mere talking points without make judgements, and get most of my news from Hacker News (which is, of course, heavily biased towards the Silicon Valley). > Deep fakes are going to rock your world. Definitely. I think most (internet-savvy) people will eventually learn it and ignore things like that. In Ghost in the Shell: S.A.C. 2nd GIG (second season of the TV animation), one group of politicians for their personal interests within the government, has launched a conspiracy to intensify a military conflict (against the refugee uprising) that involves nuclear weapon. The protagonists from Section 9, a national security agency that operates independent from the executive, saw the truth from the satellite footage, had the following dialogue. > "How do we stop it? Can we post the video footage online?" > "No. Video footage nowadays is seen as completely unreliable to this day." Since most video footage "exposure" themselves are propaganda or hoaxes. Released in 2000s, it portrayed and predicted our world remarkably well, and it'll give you a lot of inspirations of what would the future society look like.

tjpnz 7y ago

I watched it this morning without knowing anything about the creators beforehand, so came to it with a reasonably open mind. As it progressed I kept on expecting something explosive, perhaps akin to what I saw in Outfoxed. But the whole thing completely fizzled out and ended with the creators basically begging for whistleblowers. I hadn't had my morning coffee by that point - was there something there I missed?

edoo 7y ago
I found the media director opining about not being allowed to do objective journalism and the CEO driving the narrative irregardless of evidence to be quite shocking.
sremani 7y ago
What you missed was the simple fact that you are PRIMED. Even if you did not know about the "intruders", you have an opinion about CNN brand, which determined your approach towards the video.

KirinDave 7y ago

Why is CNN even remotely relevant? Their average US show gets less views in a night than a PewDiePie video. Fox News is literally 3-5x their viewership, and unlike CNN is concentrated in a very specific set of demos that is much more open to television news as a format and medium. That CNN is part of the propaganda machine is doubtless. But they're just not that important compared to the bigger players.

blotter_paper 7y ago
> Why is CNN even remotely relevant? > That CNN is part of the propaganda machine is doubtless. So being "part of the propaganda machine" isn't enough to qualify as "even remotely relevant"? :/ If you value consistency and intellectual honesty you might want to backtrack on one of these claims or at least admit that your statements are obviously incompatible without further qualification. "Even remotely" isn't a very high bar to meet.

sundarurfriend 7y ago

For anyone else not familiar with these "veritas videos": > Project Veritas is an American right-wing activist group. The group uses "disguises and hidden cameras to uncover supposed liberal bias and corruption." The group is known for producing deceptively edited videos about media organizations and left-leaning groups. In a 2018 book on propaganda and disinformation in U.S. politics, three Harvard University scholars refer to Project Veritas as a "right-wing disinformation outfit." (Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Veritas https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Veritas) I guess that explains the downvotes.