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I don't understand why this has become such a common theme in the tech world. A small clique of non-binary/LGBTQ+ people who wield undue amounts of soft power a

by ng12 7y ago

I don't understand why this has become such a common theme in the tech world. A small clique of non-binary/LGBTQ+ people who wield undue amounts of soft power and use that soft power to fight pseudo-political internet battles. I've yet to experience this with any other subculture I'm involved in.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
harryf 7y ago
> There was a TL discussion about gender-neutral pronouns and then "preferred pronouns". Reading the post right here at the beginning I'm like "Oh here we go..." And reading the rest went just as predictably as I expected. A tiny minority wielding their power. Sane people attempting to stay sane and reasonable, but failing. A terrified company acting in panic. Future alien archeologists will wonder "So they were facing imminent extinction, how did they respond to this threat?" ... "Well they seemed to spend a lot of time arguing over what they should call each other" PS: before anyone likes to shame me, I _might_ actually be a woman...
oefrha 7y ago
A few years ago when I was a member of a relatively high profile open source project, I myself was once (informally) accused of non-inclusive behavior towards a trans person. It was a very confusing experience because I didn’t even know that person’s gender up until that point, much less whether they were trans or not; I only found out after the accusation. Nor did I ever care about their gender before or after the incident — the only thing I gave a damn about was the code they produced. Turns out my complaint against a poorly thought-out feature of theirs (which was greenlighted by the project lead, landed despite much opposition, and subsequently caused quite severe breakage) was distorted as an attack against their gender. That experience and experience from other clashes against the broader CoC-wielding crowd, either firsthand or secondhand, tells me that people who are determined to inject identity politics into software are either (a) honestly over-sensitive, can’t imagine other people not giving a shit; or (b) using CoC as a convenient tool to end technical debates (when they’re out of arguments or don’t want to argue further) with folks who prefer a more blunt communication style.
- avaxzat 7y ago
  >folks who prefer a more blunt communication style. You mean folks who like to casually throw around homophobic slurs and who will then go on HN to whine about how they were called out on their bullshit?
  - odkamkfn 7y ago
    Please don't do this, try to be more charitable.
  - oefrha 7y ago
    No, I mean folks who criticize other people’s work directly instead of qualifying every criticism with three insincere compliments. Where did you get the idea that I ever throw a single homophobic slur? Your comment tells me that you’re actually the kind of person that CoCs or guidelines or whatever should actually regulate. Flagged.
- IanSanders 7y ago
  >Turns out my complaint against a poorly thought-out feature of theirs (which was greenlighted by the project lead, landed despite much opposition, and subsequently caused quite severe breakage) was distorted as an attack against their gender. You can subvert any community/organisation/process this way. Social "grenade" in a sense. Scary.
einpoklum 7y ago
The SE Inc. authoritarian moves are not, AFAICT, by non-binary/LGBTQ+ people but virtue-signaler staff/management who feel that behaving like the Spanish Inquisition will get them some sort of morality or PR points.
- nabdab 7y ago
  An LGBTQ+ individual resigned over the fact that people where discussing the coc change. That’s not virtue-signaling staff, that’s someone throwing a hissy-fit that they can’t get things their way by with no questions asked.
  - einpoklum 7y ago
    That does not contradict what I said. Also, many moderators resigned over recent events (mostly non-LGBTQ+), for a plethora of specific justifications.
tgsovlerkhgsel 7y ago
> A small clique of non-binary/LGBTQ+ people who wield undue amounts of soft power It's often not members of these groups, but "allies" acting "on their behalf" (and likely hurting the cause because the extremist and witch-hunting behavior gets associated with these groups).

by ng12 7y ago

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

harryf 7y ago

> There was a TL discussion about gender-neutral pronouns and then "preferred pronouns". Reading the post right here at the beginning I'm like "Oh here we go..." And reading the rest went just as predictably as I expected. A tiny minority wielding their power. Sane people attempting to stay sane and reasonable, but failing. A terrified company acting in panic. Future alien archeologists will wonder "So they were facing imminent extinction, how did they respond to this threat?" ... "Well they seemed to spend a lot of time arguing over what they should call each other" PS: before anyone likes to shame me, I _might_ actually be a woman...

oefrha 7y ago

A few years ago when I was a member of a relatively high profile open source project, I myself was once (informally) accused of non-inclusive behavior towards a trans person. It was a very confusing experience because I didn’t even know that person’s gender up until that point, much less whether they were trans or not; I only found out after the accusation. Nor did I ever care about their gender before or after the incident — the only thing I gave a damn about was the code they produced. Turns out my complaint against a poorly thought-out feature of theirs (which was greenlighted by the project lead, landed despite much opposition, and subsequently caused quite severe breakage) was distorted as an attack against their gender. That experience and experience from other clashes against the broader CoC-wielding crowd, either firsthand or secondhand, tells me that people who are determined to inject identity politics into software are either (a) honestly over-sensitive, can’t imagine other people not giving a shit; or (b) using CoC as a convenient tool to end technical debates (when they’re out of arguments or don’t want to argue further) with folks who prefer a more blunt communication style.

avaxzat 7y ago
>folks who prefer a more blunt communication style. You mean folks who like to casually throw around homophobic slurs and who will then go on HN to whine about how they were called out on their bullshit?
- odkamkfn 7y ago
  Please don't do this, try to be more charitable.
- oefrha 7y ago
  No, I mean folks who criticize other people’s work directly instead of qualifying every criticism with three insincere compliments. Where did you get the idea that I ever throw a single homophobic slur? Your comment tells me that you’re actually the kind of person that CoCs or guidelines or whatever should actually regulate. Flagged.
IanSanders 7y ago
>Turns out my complaint against a poorly thought-out feature of theirs (which was greenlighted by the project lead, landed despite much opposition, and subsequently caused quite severe breakage) was distorted as an attack against their gender. You can subvert any community/organisation/process this way. Social "grenade" in a sense. Scary.

einpoklum 7y ago

The SE Inc. authoritarian moves are not, AFAICT, by non-binary/LGBTQ+ people but virtue-signaler staff/management who feel that behaving like the Spanish Inquisition will get them some sort of morality or PR points.

nabdab 7y ago
An LGBTQ+ individual resigned over the fact that people where discussing the coc change. That’s not virtue-signaling staff, that’s someone throwing a hissy-fit that they can’t get things their way by with no questions asked.
- einpoklum 7y ago
  That does not contradict what I said. Also, many moderators resigned over recent events (mostly non-LGBTQ+), for a plethora of specific justifications.

tgsovlerkhgsel 7y ago

> A small clique of non-binary/LGBTQ+ people who wield undue amounts of soft power It's often not members of these groups, but "allies" acting "on their behalf" (and likely hurting the cause because the extremist and witch-hunting behavior gets associated with these groups).