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>Prior to this work, the strongest evidence for a link between testosterone exposure and reduced cognitive empathy came in 2011 in a study that found administer
by daenz 7y ago
>Prior to this work, the strongest evidence for a link between testosterone exposure and reduced cognitive empathy came in 2011 in a study that found administering testosterone to healthy women reduced their performance on a test of reading emotions. The results suggested the testosterone impaired their performance.
That's interesting. Adult males typically have 7-8 times the levels that females do, and females are more sensitive to it. I'd hypothesize that injecting females with extra testosterone was just plain mentally disorienting. I know a trans man who, after a few months of testosterone, claimed it was "night and day" in how they felt about and processed the world. Female biology isn't adapted to high levels of testosterone like a males biology is.
- logicprog 7y agoThat's actually very interesting, do you know if/how they described the differences in perception?
- daenz 7y agoThey have a public blog/vlog, here's the "Testosterone" tag: https://mylifewithtits.wordpress.com/category/testosterone-2/page/1/ https://mylifewithtits.wordpress.com/category/testosterone-2...
- wayoutthere 7y agoI can describe my own (FWIW I went the other direction). Best way I can say it is that my own understanding of emotion was rather black-and-white when on testosterone. I intellectually knew that other people had emotions beyond anger or sadness, but had no frame of reference for what that meant. I tended to see major challenges as obstacles to be overcome through force of will. On estrogen it's like seeing the world in color -- I'm more volatile, but I actually have what I consider emotions! I understand the subtleties in my own emotions far better, which has made me a lot more empathetic to them in others. I also tend to see challenges as a sign I need to change my approach rather than just try harder. I have had to stop hormones a few times for various reasons, and when things revert to being testosterone-dominant, I feel as if things revert to black-and-white over the course of a month or so. I also think that just giving women a little testosterone and measuring the effect isn't likely to show much -- what seems to matter in my experience is whether the body is androgen-dominant or estrogen-dominant (the in-between areas are very not-fun, with lots of headaches, hot flashes, etc.)
- bonerman69 7y agoIncreasing estrogen blood levels will literally cause any male-sex person to become more empathetic via oxytocin...
- wayoutthere 7y agoProbably better to say "assigned male at birth" -- I'm not genetically male, but everyone assumed I was until I got tested after transitioning. The best medically relevant definitions are "person on testosterone", "person on estrogen" etc. There is a lot of suspicion that things like estrogen/androgen receptor binding affinity play a big role in gender identity and brain development, and we haven't even scratched the surface of that level of genetics. There is no medically or legally significant difference between "gender" and "sex". You can get the sex/gender (different states use different terms interchangeably) on your drivers' license and birth certificate changed.
- BonerBoi420 7y agoyou're wrong, boys have penises and girls have vaginas
- bonerman69 7y agoI don't understand how 'person on test/est' makes sense in context of this post. The article implies just the opposite. That xy chromasome males (who all experienced a fetal testosterone surge, assuming they have normal male sex organs) tolerate testosterone better than males who had a smaller test surge, and obviously more than an xx female. I guess chromesomes are biological not 'medical'?
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- BonerBoi420 7y agoSex =/= gender. Sex is determined by your chromosomes.
- newnewpdro 7y agoThere was an episode of This American Life about testosterone [0] that included an interview of an f2m transgender man on HRT. It was quite interesting to hear, the episode in general was exceptionally good and worth giving a listen. [0] https://www.thisamericanlife.org/220/testosterone https://www.thisamericanlife.org/220/testosterone
- azimmerlin 7y agoTrans woman here. Cisgender men and women have different brain structures, and transgender people's brain structures tend to resemble that of the gender that they identify as[1]. So, for example, a trans woman like myself who was born male will have a brain structure that resembles that of a cis woman, not a man. > I know a trans man who, after a few months of testosterone, claimed it was "night and day" in how they felt about and processed the world This has been my experience as well (except, the opposite direction, obviously). The way I look at it, before I realized I am transgender, when testosterone was the dominant sex hormone in my body, it was like putting the wrong fuel in a car. It caused a whole slew of serious mental health problems. Estrogen has allowed me to think more clearly, and process thoughts, feelings, and emotions like I never could before. I'll never go back. 1. https://health.clevelandclinic.org/research-on-the-transgender-brain-what-you-should-know/ https://health.clevelandclinic.org/research-on-the-transgend...
- codesushi42 7y agoHow can you be so sure that your brain structure is actually different? Are there any scientific tests that can be performed to support this?
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- rideontime 7y agoThe article she offered directly links to them...
- codesushi42 7y agoWas she part of the study?
- rideontime 7y agoAh, I didn't realize how specific your use of "your" was, perhaps because she didn't make any claims about the structure of her own brain.
- SolaceQuantum 7y agoI'm actually curious how this changes the narrative of a trans person if testosterone doesn't have an effect on one's empathy.
- Romanulus 7y agoThe narrative of the trans person is what whatever he or she decides, I've noticed.
- edmundsauto 7y agoThis is pretty similar to how all humans work. We all have stories we tell ourselves, narratives that we've chosen (possibly subconsciously). We then find evidence that confirms those narratives. It's a defining characteristic of how we operate.
- belorn 7y agoThe sample size of that study was 16, and the measured effect was a mean change from 81% correct answer on the test down to 77%. I would not read too much into that study, especially given the result of the new larger one.
- Gibbon1 7y ago> injecting females with extra testosterone was just plain mentally disorienting Reminds me of a study done about 35 years ago by the California DOT to measure the effects of both alcohol and marijuana on driving performance. Turns out teetotalers and non pot smokers suck at driving when given booze or pot. Boozers also suck when given alcohol but not as much. And pot smokers are barely effected at all. I'm suspicious that the body compensates eventually, so acute effects don't necessarily tell you anything particularly valid.