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Goldstein is dead. The war is over. Stop killing Afghans. Let me sort their own issues and politics out. If you are worried about them coming to your country an

Goldstein is dead. The war is over. Stop killing Afghans. Let me sort their own issues and politics out. If you are worried about them coming to your country and messing with you then stop all Saudis from coming to your country... you can also ban Afghans if it makes you feel better. It's like really what are the hoping to gain from all of this. The people resent you as much as anyone can resent anyone else. The government is a puppet government. The country is fractured beyond repair. It's highly lawless. It's like yes if we can just prevent people from gathering in the Middle of nowhere they can't conspire against us. While most of their enemies came from their greatest ally in which country they can do as they please. This war is a massive Orwellian joke.

tomohawk 7y ago
The US did overreact and attempted to do nation building in Afghanistan. But your prescription for letting them sort things out on their own has already been tried, and it was a colossal failure. The government hosted terrorist organizations who killed thousands of people in the US and mounted attacks on civilians of many nationalities around the world.
- devoply 7y ago
  You mean the US has been sitting there since the 70s. Trained a bunch of militants there who eventually turned on their colonial masters using them for brute force to fight the Soviets, don't you? The government who hosted the terrorist organization in Afghanistan then could be said to be the US.
  - harimau777 7y ago
    I'm not sure that's a fair characterization. Regardless of whether the US should have gotten involved or should have seen future problems coming, my understanding is that at the time that the US was supporting the Mujahideen they were attacking military targets and where therefore guerrilla fighters, not terrorists.
    - devoply 7y ago
      It's funny how brainwashed most Americans are about this conflict, we might as well as be living in 1984's world. Have you heard the ancient saying one man's freedom fighter, another man's terrorist? What would happen if no terrorists had been trained by the US (and their Islamic puppet that wags the dog, Saudi Arabia)? The Soviet Union would have fallen and Afghanistan would be a normal country like its neighbors. > After Taraki was murdered the new Afghan Prime Minister Hafizullah Amin repeated requests for Soviet military support, at least to protect his residence. Finally, in December the Politburo decided to deal with the situation in Afghanistan,[8] and in early December sent special forces which attacked Amin's palace and killed him, putting the exiled Babrak Kamal in his place. These forces were subsequently reinforced by the 40th Army which entered Afghanistan on 24 December 1979. As the Kremlin foresaw, this intervention would cause problems around the world for the USSR, with the policy of detente and, not least, at the forthcoming Olympic Games due to take place in summer 1980 in Moscow.[9] The result was a far-reaching boycott of the 1980 Summer Olympics in Moscow, supported not only by the United States but by many of the 65 other invited countries that did not take part. > At its greatest extent the Soviet military contingent in Afghanistan numbered 100,000 personnel. This presence remained for a decade and kickstarted U.S. and Saudi funding for Islamic Mujahideen groups opposed to both the Afghan government and the Soviet military presence. The local Mujahideen, along with fighters from several different Arab nations (Pathan tribes from across the border also participated in the war; they were supported by the Pakistani ISI), fought the Soviet forces to a standstill. On 24 January 1989 Gorbachev's Politburo took the decision to withdraw most of the Soviet forces,[10] while continuing to provide military assistance to the Afghan government.[11] Eventually, in-fighting within the Mujahideen led to the rise of warlords in Afghanistan, and from them emerged the Taliban.[12] The Soviets left behind the only highway in the country as well as many concrete structures built in the major cities, and airfields that are still in use (e.g. at Bagram).
      - harimau777 7y ago
        Nothing in your post contradicts what I said. I'm arguing that the difference between a freedom fighter and a terrorist is whether they target civilians. So when fighting the Soviets or later the US, the Taliban where not terrorists; although that doesn't necessarily mean that they were good people.
- rhizome 7y ago
  Afghanistan has been a known quantity for decades: heroin or Taliban, pick one. Beyond that, what's the international opinion on Erik Prince?
  - e12e 7y ago
    Decades? How about the British presence in the region? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Anglo-Afghan_War https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Anglo-Afghan_War (and so on and so forth..)
    - rhizome 7y ago
      I don't see Taliban or heroin (or "opium") in that article, but sure, if you want to expand the relationship to being between theocratic rulers and vice production I'm fine with that. I didn't read the article to see if that's actually what was going on 200 years ago, but I'm assuming you aren't posting an offtopic reply.
  - mieseratte 7y ago
    Taliban hosted AQ, gave us 9/11. We may be stuck in a quagmire, but there’s more to the Taliban than banning heroin and to pretend otherwise is disingenuous.
    - glogla 7y ago
      Saudi Arabia gave you 9/11 yet your president is super friendly with them. It's almost as if you're looking for excuse to kill people.
      - devoply 7y ago
        US gave itself 9/11, it's like the scene from Game of Thrones where Cersei uses religion to increase her power and then that power structure she created fucks her up after gaining power. The same thing is now happening in India and China. Where in India a nut job racist, inspired by Nazi ideology of Hindu racial purity, is running the country and the West is down with it because you know fuck Muslims and their rights... you know after encouraging their religious power structures by protecting Kohmeni in France until he could go in and take over Iran, and disposing of the democratic Iranian government in favor of a dictator. Encouraging Islamic nut jobery in Pakistan to fight the Soviets. Creating Saudi Arabia to control Muslims out of a bunch of backwards nomads that have never led any civilizations in their history. In the case of China, they used China to enrich them and distributed a bunch of technology and know-how to them to increase their own power and now China is basically turning the tables on them. It's like West loves to abuse its power to increase it and then always shies away from taking any responsibility for its action and instead blames the ideology they were exploiting to increase their power.

tomohawk 7y ago

The US did overreact and attempted to do nation building in Afghanistan. But your prescription for letting them sort things out on their own has already been tried, and it was a colossal failure. The government hosted terrorist organizations who killed thousands of people in the US and mounted attacks on civilians of many nationalities around the world.

devoply 7y ago
You mean the US has been sitting there since the 70s. Trained a bunch of militants there who eventually turned on their colonial masters using them for brute force to fight the Soviets, don't you? The government who hosted the terrorist organization in Afghanistan then could be said to be the US.
- harimau777 7y ago
  I'm not sure that's a fair characterization. Regardless of whether the US should have gotten involved or should have seen future problems coming, my understanding is that at the time that the US was supporting the Mujahideen they were attacking military targets and where therefore guerrilla fighters, not terrorists.
  - devoply 7y ago
    It's funny how brainwashed most Americans are about this conflict, we might as well as be living in 1984's world. Have you heard the ancient saying one man's freedom fighter, another man's terrorist? What would happen if no terrorists had been trained by the US (and their Islamic puppet that wags the dog, Saudi Arabia)? The Soviet Union would have fallen and Afghanistan would be a normal country like its neighbors. > After Taraki was murdered the new Afghan Prime Minister Hafizullah Amin repeated requests for Soviet military support, at least to protect his residence. Finally, in December the Politburo decided to deal with the situation in Afghanistan,[8] and in early December sent special forces which attacked Amin's palace and killed him, putting the exiled Babrak Kamal in his place. These forces were subsequently reinforced by the 40th Army which entered Afghanistan on 24 December 1979. As the Kremlin foresaw, this intervention would cause problems around the world for the USSR, with the policy of detente and, not least, at the forthcoming Olympic Games due to take place in summer 1980 in Moscow.[9] The result was a far-reaching boycott of the 1980 Summer Olympics in Moscow, supported not only by the United States but by many of the 65 other invited countries that did not take part. > At its greatest extent the Soviet military contingent in Afghanistan numbered 100,000 personnel. This presence remained for a decade and kickstarted U.S. and Saudi funding for Islamic Mujahideen groups opposed to both the Afghan government and the Soviet military presence. The local Mujahideen, along with fighters from several different Arab nations (Pathan tribes from across the border also participated in the war; they were supported by the Pakistani ISI), fought the Soviet forces to a standstill. On 24 January 1989 Gorbachev's Politburo took the decision to withdraw most of the Soviet forces,[10] while continuing to provide military assistance to the Afghan government.[11] Eventually, in-fighting within the Mujahideen led to the rise of warlords in Afghanistan, and from them emerged the Taliban.[12] The Soviets left behind the only highway in the country as well as many concrete structures built in the major cities, and airfields that are still in use (e.g. at Bagram).
    - harimau777 7y ago
      Nothing in your post contradicts what I said. I'm arguing that the difference between a freedom fighter and a terrorist is whether they target civilians. So when fighting the Soviets or later the US, the Taliban where not terrorists; although that doesn't necessarily mean that they were good people.
rhizome 7y ago
Afghanistan has been a known quantity for decades: heroin or Taliban, pick one. Beyond that, what's the international opinion on Erik Prince?
- e12e 7y ago
  Decades? How about the British presence in the region? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Anglo-Afghan_War https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Anglo-Afghan_War (and so on and so forth..)
  - rhizome 7y ago
    I don't see Taliban or heroin (or "opium") in that article, but sure, if you want to expand the relationship to being between theocratic rulers and vice production I'm fine with that. I didn't read the article to see if that's actually what was going on 200 years ago, but I'm assuming you aren't posting an offtopic reply.
- mieseratte 7y ago
  Taliban hosted AQ, gave us 9/11. We may be stuck in a quagmire, but there’s more to the Taliban than banning heroin and to pretend otherwise is disingenuous.
  - glogla 7y ago
    Saudi Arabia gave you 9/11 yet your president is super friendly with them. It's almost as if you're looking for excuse to kill people.
    - devoply 7y ago
      US gave itself 9/11, it's like the scene from Game of Thrones where Cersei uses religion to increase her power and then that power structure she created fucks her up after gaining power. The same thing is now happening in India and China. Where in India a nut job racist, inspired by Nazi ideology of Hindu racial purity, is running the country and the West is down with it because you know fuck Muslims and their rights... you know after encouraging their religious power structures by protecting Kohmeni in France until he could go in and take over Iran, and disposing of the democratic Iranian government in favor of a dictator. Encouraging Islamic nut jobery in Pakistan to fight the Soviets. Creating Saudi Arabia to control Muslims out of a bunch of backwards nomads that have never led any civilizations in their history. In the case of China, they used China to enrich them and distributed a bunch of technology and know-how to them to increase their own power and now China is basically turning the tables on them. It's like West loves to abuse its power to increase it and then always shies away from taking any responsibility for its action and instead blames the ideology they were exploiting to increase their power.