4 ms·

Yeah so I don't care about the blutooth because my car DRIVES ITSELF a big percent of the time. it's fundamentally changed how I view driving. Stop and Go traff

by leesec 7y ago

Yeah so I don't care about the blutooth because my car DRIVES ITSELF a big percent of the time. it's fundamentally changed how I view driving. Stop and Go traffic no longer makes me mad. Road trips no longer exhaust me. There's probably some issues but none that I care about. It feels like driving the future. It's an absolute joy to drive. No gas stations is pretty nice too.

rainyMammoth 7y ago
I'm driving a Toyota Corolla with lane assist which does 95% of what Tesla "Self Driving" does. It accelerates and brakes for me in traffic, and correct courses to stay in my lane. This is a 18k$ car and I would not accept trading Bluetooth issues with fancy parking summon features.
- SECProto 7y ago
  Having driven a car with Toyota's smart driving features... I view them as a negative. Cruise control keeps me too far back from whatever vehicle is in front of me. Dealbreaker with no clear way to disable. I'll stick with my 7 year old Yaris (which also has shitty Bluetooth)
  - DevoidSimo 7y ago
    I rented one once, you can adjust the follow distance for the adaptive cruise control. Annoyingly it resets each time you turn on the car though.
    - SECProto 7y ago
      In my experience, none of them are a reasonable distance back. If it gave an audible chime first or something, it would be fine.
  - bashinator 7y ago
    How far back is that? I generally try to leave at least 10 car-lengths in fast traffic, 3-5 in heavy traffic.
    - SECProto 7y ago
      I leave quite a reasonable distance. The issue to me is it slows down before that with no cue, so I occasionally look down to find i'm somehow going 20km under the speed limit, a hundred meters behind whatever is in front of me.
  - saalweachter 7y ago
    That's called a SAFE FOLLOWING DISTANCE.
    - SECProto 7y ago
      > That's called a SAFE FOLLOWING DISTANCE. Hi. Safe following distance is the distance required to safely stop at whatever speed you are going. At a typical speed of 90km/hr (that's usually when this "feature" gets engaged - slowing me to 10km/hr under the limit because that's what someone in front of me is doing), the safe stopping distance is around 80-90 meters (perception+braking in good conditions). The shortest follow distance setting I seemed able to find was around double this distance. tl;dr: I do not find that the adaptive cruise control is engaged at a safe following distance. Indeed, I think it makes me less safe as a driver, because it slows me down arbitrarily without any visual or auditory notification.
      - saalweachter 7y ago
        The LONGEST following distance maintained by Toyota's adaptive cruise control is 50m (at 80 km/h). The short and medium settings are 30m and 40m. So either (a) the car you drove was defective or (b) you are radically misjudging your following distance. I know you are inclined to assume the former, but keep in mind that humans are terrible at judging distances when moving at high speeds, and most people leave way too little space between them and the car in front of them.
        SECProto 7y ago
        I make a habit of counting seconds between cars (particularly in light traffic, which is also the only time I'm using cruise control), aiming for the standard 5s follow. At 90km/hr (25m/s), you're telling me Toyota's cruise control has a maximum follow distance of 2 seconds? That is incorrect from my experience (and unsafe from standard driving practice). Where did you get that number?
        saalweachter 7y ago
- leesec 7y ago
  That's cool man. I hope you enjoy your Toyota Corolla and I hope one day you can be happy for people who also enjoy their cars.
- bobsil1 7y ago
  Does it steer and lane center in general, besides when you drift out of lane?
  - FireBeyond 7y ago
    Current cars that have lane centering and steering at all speeds: * All Acura models * All Audi models * BMW 5/6/7/X3/X4 * Cadillac CT6 * Ford Edge * All Honda models (mostly at higher speed) * ... and so on. Source: https://www.cars.com/articles/which-cars-have-self-driving-features-for-2019-402645/ https://www.cars.com/articles/which-cars-have-self-driving-f... This notion, particularly among Tesla owners, that active lane centering and steering is a Tesla exclusive, is at times wilfully blindered, to the obnoxious. The last time I went through this was with a Tesla owner who swore that every other car's Blind Spot monitoring sucked, because "only Tesla paid attention to the speed of the car in the blind spot", which is... false. Even my 2015 A4 had adaptive blind spot monitoring. Most to all mid to high end vehicles have all this stuff. Tesla isn't miraculous in automotive technology. Which isn't to say they haven't done great things. But even reading this list... ugh. Was the ability to watch Netflix or sing "Car-aoke" the most demanded of new features for Tesla owners?
    - xedeon 7y ago
      > This notion, particularly among Tesla owners, that active lane centering and steering is a Tesla exclusive, is at times wilfully blindered, to the obnoxious. Autopilot is more than just "active lane centering and steering" (known as LKAS) Autopilot is a combination of a lot of things (TACC + Autosteer + Auto Lane Change + Auto Lane Keep + NOA etc...) Autosteer is also way ahead of everything else out there right now. The competition is mainly just TACC and basic LKAS. For example, I am yet to see so other cars perform in conditions like this: https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/d32eo3/autopilot_completes_left_turn_in_a_complicated https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/d32eo3/autopil... > Most to all mid to high end vehicles have all this stuff Yeah mostly an extra option and costs $$$. Basic autopilot and a ton of safety features are FREE on Tesla. It's actually pathetic how other car manufacturers charge for advanced safety features.
- zaroth 7y ago
  Is this the system you’re talking about? [1] If so, it’s constantly disengaging to the point it seems unusable. This is not anywhere remotely 95% of what AutoPilot does. Look at Autonomous Day presentations on things like cut-in detection and lane changes. Look at what the active accident avoidance technology accomplishes in the real world. The Toyota system is not even trying to do any of that. [1] - https://youtu.be/5QNw1n5JLLw https://youtu.be/5QNw1n5JLLw
BinaryIdiot 7y ago
> Yeah so I don't care about the blutooth because my car DRIVES ITSELF a big percent of the time. See, this worries me. Almost all of the Model 3 owners I know tell me that not supporting bluetooth features isn't a big deal because they can safely use their phone while driving. This is completely false. When I last drove in a friend's Model 3 he had to make several manual corrections while using auto pilot on California highways; it's still not good enough for people to be messing with their phone while driving. Please, don't use your phone while driving.
- kemiller 7y ago
  I don’t think that was the implication. It’s that Tesla is focused on hitting the high order bits and so has earned a little forgiveness about smaller things.
  - tw04 7y ago
    But they aren't. The car doesn't drive itself yet and you shouldn't pretend it does unless you want to die. Other than performance and range they haven't hit on ANY of the high order bits.
    - leesec 7y ago
      Haha well, maybe your car doesn't drive itself. Mine does everyday, it's great. Also Teslas are the safest cars. Not sure what you're talking about
      - BinaryIdiot 7y ago
        > Also Teslas are the safest cars. Not sure what you're talking about In other words being on your phone isn't a big deal because you'll be safe. But those other people you might hit? What about them? Do you have any care in that direction?
      - RealWorldPolice 7y ago
        I don't believe you. I own an AP1 Tesla as well as a nominally "FSD computer equipped" AP2 Tesla. You would be injured or killed if you tried taking an unmonitored trip of any reasonable length - ON THE HIGHWAY - in either, with autopilot on and with the nag disabled using a weight. If you think you don't have to routinely make manual corrections to save yourself from dying I think you are either lying or delusional.
mrich 7y ago
A lot of cars offer that nowadays, although it may be an optional upgrade. My VW van has ACC, lane assist, emergency breaking, warns you if it's not safe to change lanes by flashlight and steering wheel, even if the other car is 40+ meters away but approaching fast, automatic parking, automatic breaking when there is an obstacle or side traffic when parking. It's also a joy on long road trips and I can easily go double the distance than in my previous Audi before getting tired. That said, I would probably trade it in for a Model S 7-seater if it did cost the same here :)

by leesec 7y ago

rainyMammoth 7y ago

I'm driving a Toyota Corolla with lane assist which does 95% of what Tesla "Self Driving" does. It accelerates and brakes for me in traffic, and correct courses to stay in my lane. This is a 18k$ car and I would not accept trading Bluetooth issues with fancy parking summon features.

SECProto 7y ago
Having driven a car with Toyota's smart driving features... I view them as a negative. Cruise control keeps me too far back from whatever vehicle is in front of me. Dealbreaker with no clear way to disable. I'll stick with my 7 year old Yaris (which also has shitty Bluetooth)
- DevoidSimo 7y ago
  I rented one once, you can adjust the follow distance for the adaptive cruise control. Annoyingly it resets each time you turn on the car though.
  - SECProto 7y ago
    In my experience, none of them are a reasonable distance back. If it gave an audible chime first or something, it would be fine.
- bashinator 7y ago
  How far back is that? I generally try to leave at least 10 car-lengths in fast traffic, 3-5 in heavy traffic.
  - SECProto 7y ago
    I leave quite a reasonable distance. The issue to me is it slows down before that with no cue, so I occasionally look down to find i'm somehow going 20km under the speed limit, a hundred meters behind whatever is in front of me.
- saalweachter 7y ago
  That's called a SAFE FOLLOWING DISTANCE.
  - SECProto 7y ago
    > That's called a SAFE FOLLOWING DISTANCE. Hi. Safe following distance is the distance required to safely stop at whatever speed you are going. At a typical speed of 90km/hr (that's usually when this "feature" gets engaged - slowing me to 10km/hr under the limit because that's what someone in front of me is doing), the safe stopping distance is around 80-90 meters (perception+braking in good conditions). The shortest follow distance setting I seemed able to find was around double this distance. tl;dr: I do not find that the adaptive cruise control is engaged at a safe following distance. Indeed, I think it makes me less safe as a driver, because it slows me down arbitrarily without any visual or auditory notification.
    - saalweachter 7y ago
      The LONGEST following distance maintained by Toyota's adaptive cruise control is 50m (at 80 km/h). The short and medium settings are 30m and 40m. So either (a) the car you drove was defective or (b) you are radically misjudging your following distance. I know you are inclined to assume the former, but keep in mind that humans are terrible at judging distances when moving at high speeds, and most people leave way too little space between them and the car in front of them.
      - SECProto 7y ago
        I make a habit of counting seconds between cars (particularly in light traffic, which is also the only time I'm using cruise control), aiming for the standard 5s follow. At 90km/hr (25m/s), you're telling me Toyota's cruise control has a maximum follow distance of 2 seconds? That is incorrect from my experience (and unsafe from standard driving practice). Where did you get that number?
        saalweachter 7y ago
leesec 7y ago
That's cool man. I hope you enjoy your Toyota Corolla and I hope one day you can be happy for people who also enjoy their cars.
bobsil1 7y ago
Does it steer and lane center in general, besides when you drift out of lane?
- FireBeyond 7y ago
  Current cars that have lane centering and steering at all speeds: * All Acura models * All Audi models * BMW 5/6/7/X3/X4 * Cadillac CT6 * Ford Edge * All Honda models (mostly at higher speed) * ... and so on. Source: https://www.cars.com/articles/which-cars-have-self-driving-features-for-2019-402645/ https://www.cars.com/articles/which-cars-have-self-driving-f... This notion, particularly among Tesla owners, that active lane centering and steering is a Tesla exclusive, is at times wilfully blindered, to the obnoxious. The last time I went through this was with a Tesla owner who swore that every other car's Blind Spot monitoring sucked, because "only Tesla paid attention to the speed of the car in the blind spot", which is... false. Even my 2015 A4 had adaptive blind spot monitoring. Most to all mid to high end vehicles have all this stuff. Tesla isn't miraculous in automotive technology. Which isn't to say they haven't done great things. But even reading this list... ugh. Was the ability to watch Netflix or sing "Car-aoke" the most demanded of new features for Tesla owners?
  - xedeon 7y ago
    > This notion, particularly among Tesla owners, that active lane centering and steering is a Tesla exclusive, is at times wilfully blindered, to the obnoxious. Autopilot is more than just "active lane centering and steering" (known as LKAS) Autopilot is a combination of a lot of things (TACC + Autosteer + Auto Lane Change + Auto Lane Keep + NOA etc...) Autosteer is also way ahead of everything else out there right now. The competition is mainly just TACC and basic LKAS. For example, I am yet to see so other cars perform in conditions like this: https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/d32eo3/autopilot_completes_left_turn_in_a_complicated https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/d32eo3/autopil... > Most to all mid to high end vehicles have all this stuff Yeah mostly an extra option and costs $$$. Basic autopilot and a ton of safety features are FREE on Tesla. It's actually pathetic how other car manufacturers charge for advanced safety features.
zaroth 7y ago
Is this the system you’re talking about? [1] If so, it’s constantly disengaging to the point it seems unusable. This is not anywhere remotely 95% of what AutoPilot does. Look at Autonomous Day presentations on things like cut-in detection and lane changes. Look at what the active accident avoidance technology accomplishes in the real world. The Toyota system is not even trying to do any of that. [1] - https://youtu.be/5QNw1n5JLLw https://youtu.be/5QNw1n5JLLw

BinaryIdiot 7y ago

> Yeah so I don't care about the blutooth because my car DRIVES ITSELF a big percent of the time. See, this worries me. Almost all of the Model 3 owners I know tell me that not supporting bluetooth features isn't a big deal because they can safely use their phone while driving. This is completely false. When I last drove in a friend's Model 3 he had to make several manual corrections while using auto pilot on California highways; it's still not good enough for people to be messing with their phone while driving. Please, don't use your phone while driving.

kemiller 7y ago
I don’t think that was the implication. It’s that Tesla is focused on hitting the high order bits and so has earned a little forgiveness about smaller things.
- tw04 7y ago
  But they aren't. The car doesn't drive itself yet and you shouldn't pretend it does unless you want to die. Other than performance and range they haven't hit on ANY of the high order bits.
  - leesec 7y ago
    Haha well, maybe your car doesn't drive itself. Mine does everyday, it's great. Also Teslas are the safest cars. Not sure what you're talking about
    - BinaryIdiot 7y ago
      > Also Teslas are the safest cars. Not sure what you're talking about In other words being on your phone isn't a big deal because you'll be safe. But those other people you might hit? What about them? Do you have any care in that direction?
    - RealWorldPolice 7y ago
      I don't believe you. I own an AP1 Tesla as well as a nominally "FSD computer equipped" AP2 Tesla. You would be injured or killed if you tried taking an unmonitored trip of any reasonable length - ON THE HIGHWAY - in either, with autopilot on and with the nag disabled using a weight. If you think you don't have to routinely make manual corrections to save yourself from dying I think you are either lying or delusional.

mrich 7y ago

A lot of cars offer that nowadays, although it may be an optional upgrade. My VW van has ACC, lane assist, emergency breaking, warns you if it's not safe to change lanes by flashlight and steering wheel, even if the other car is 40+ meters away but approaching fast, automatic parking, automatic breaking when there is an obstacle or side traffic when parking. It's also a joy on long road trips and I can easily go double the distance than in my previous Audi before getting tired. That said, I would probably trade it in for a Model S 7-seater if it did cost the same here :)