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Source for them being arms of the Chinese state? Some of them are state-owned, but the two largest electric vehicle manufacturers in China are not. In descendi

Source for them being arms of the Chinese state? Some of them are state-owned, but the two largest electric vehicle manufacturers in China are not. In descending order of revenue from electric vehicles (source: [1]): * BYD (a publicly traded company, listed on the Hong Kong Stock Exchange) * Geely (also traded on the HK Stock Exchange) * BAIC (state-owned, sells a lot of plug-in hybrids) * SAIC (state-owned) * JAC motors (state-owned) BYD and Geely's combined electric-vehicle revenue is significantly larger than that of BAIC, SAIC and JAC (combined). The electric vehicle market in China does not appear to be dominated by state-owned companies. 1. https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2019-09-20/electric-vehicle-market-so-far-belongs-to-china https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2019-09-20/electr...

SimbaOnSteroids 7y ago
This is a de facto requirement for operating out of China.
- DiogenesKynikos 7y ago
  What is a requirement? Instead of vague statements about everything in China being state controlled, how about some actual facts? What, concretely, does this control entail? How does it function?
  - JumpCrisscross 7y ago
    > What, concretely, does this control entail? How does it function? Party members "inspecting" facilities, demanding access to records, issuing whimsical and unappealable orders, et cetera.
    - DiogenesKynikos 7y ago
      You're asserting that the Chinese government uses these mechanisms to set the business plans of BYD and Geely? In other words, that BYD and Geely do not make decisions based on business considerations and the profit motive, but rather because the Chinese government orders them to make those decisions? I'm trying to understand just how you imagine things work in China.
  - adventured 7y ago
    State control of the massive private sector companies - de facto or de jure, either way works for the CPC - is increasingly a requirement. Sept 23: "China Boosts Government Presence at Alibaba, Private Giants" "The government of one of China’s top technology hubs is dispatching officials to 100 local corporations including e-commerce giant Alibaba Group Holding Ltd., the latest effort to exert greater influence over the country’s massive private sector." “They might be checking whether the Communist party units are working effectively within the companies,” said Paul Gillis, a professor at Peking University’s Guanghua School of Management. “While China legitimized capitalism, the level of government influence was never intended to disappear. Occasionally private entrepreneurs forget about this and are reminded of it.” https://outline.com/cgRmV5 https://outline.com/cgRmV5 https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-09-23/china-steps-up-government-presence-at-alibaba-private-giants https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-09-23/china-ste...

SimbaOnSteroids 7y ago

This is a de facto requirement for operating out of China.

DiogenesKynikos 7y ago
What is a requirement? Instead of vague statements about everything in China being state controlled, how about some actual facts? What, concretely, does this control entail? How does it function?
- JumpCrisscross 7y ago
  > What, concretely, does this control entail? How does it function? Party members "inspecting" facilities, demanding access to records, issuing whimsical and unappealable orders, et cetera.
  - DiogenesKynikos 7y ago
    You're asserting that the Chinese government uses these mechanisms to set the business plans of BYD and Geely? In other words, that BYD and Geely do not make decisions based on business considerations and the profit motive, but rather because the Chinese government orders them to make those decisions? I'm trying to understand just how you imagine things work in China.
- adventured 7y ago
  State control of the massive private sector companies - de facto or de jure, either way works for the CPC - is increasingly a requirement. Sept 23: "China Boosts Government Presence at Alibaba, Private Giants" "The government of one of China’s top technology hubs is dispatching officials to 100 local corporations including e-commerce giant Alibaba Group Holding Ltd., the latest effort to exert greater influence over the country’s massive private sector." “They might be checking whether the Communist party units are working effectively within the companies,” said Paul Gillis, a professor at Peking University’s Guanghua School of Management. “While China legitimized capitalism, the level of government influence was never intended to disappear. Occasionally private entrepreneurs forget about this and are reminded of it.” https://outline.com/cgRmV5 https://outline.com/cgRmV5 https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-09-23/china-steps-up-government-presence-at-alibaba-private-giants https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-09-23/china-ste...