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Good. People in Australia don't take driving seriously. I spend a lot of time on the road, and have lived all over Australia, and the one defining thing I've fo

Good. People in Australia don't take driving seriously. I spend a lot of time on the road, and have lived all over Australia, and the one defining thing I've found in common all over the country is that people are WAY too casual about driving. Sydney and Melbourne being the worst by far, with it being so bad it has become entertainment[0] On any given commute you'll see dozens of people playing with their phone while doing 110km/h down the freeway, doing make-up, eating cereal out of bowl, reading, blowing red lights (not "late orange" but "it already went red and now the other direction who got a green have to hit the brakes to not get t-boned", ignoring lane lines, ignoring indicators, and/or ignoring the existence of any/every rule or nearby vehicle. It's like a national sport. How much of a dickhead can you be in your car then get violently angry if anyone dares even tap their horn at you to remind you the light has been green for 30 seconds now and you're still flicking through Facebook. [0]https://www.youtube.com/user/DashCamOwnersAustral https://www.youtube.com/user/DashCamOwnersAustral

GordonS 7y ago
True story, in the UK: I once saw a guy using an electric razor while driving - and overtaking at ~80mph. I regularly see women doing makeup while driving, stretching up to see their face in the mirror, their car often drifting from left to right. The things some people do while driving are... amazingly fucking stupid.
- brokenmachine 7y ago
  I'm in Australia and I once saw a lady in a 4WD holding coffee and a cigarette in the one hand, and a phone in the other. She had kids in the back and looked to be driving only using her elbows.
wiredone 7y ago
>People in Australia don't take driving seriously. Honestly, as an Australian living in the US, i'm not sure you have enough context. After living in both Asia and the US, we're a nanny state on this stuff. In the US, people barely ever get breathe tested and often drive drunk, speed everywhere (70-80mph is a lot faster than 110-120kmh). I've also seen Facetime in use multiple times while on the freeway.
- megaremote 7y ago
  The USA, with 40,000 deaths every single year. More than gun deaths.
  - alex_young 7y ago
    No longer true. Cars are getting safer: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/injury.htm https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/injury.htm
- batiudrami 7y ago
  Yeah in general Australian driving is pretty good I've found. Japan is the only country I've been to where the driving is clearly better. Driving in other countries - the Americas, Asia, Europe, even the supposed peak of Western organisation and efficiency Germany had significantly poorer driving than I see in Australia. But use of phones is an issue and I'm glad to see this being put in place.
  - paranoidrobot 7y ago
    > in general Australian driving is pretty good I've found I think driving habits and behaviours are regional. Comparing the drivers of Newcastle, NSW and Sydney, NSW - just 160KM apart and there's a lot of weird differences. - When merging/changing lanes - Newcastle drivers tend to speed up/close any gap if you put your indicator on, to prevent you from merging ahead of them. Sydney tends to be more permissive. - When passing a parked car on a suburban street (single lane each direction), drivers in Sydney will continue on without deviating speed or course significantly. Newcastle drivers will slow down and cross almost entirely into the opposing lane/side of the road. Even on hills and around corners where there's a huge amount of space in their lane.
    - 2muchcoffeeman 7y ago
      > - When merging/changing lanes - Newcastle drivers tend to speed up/close any gap if you put your indicator on, to prevent you from merging ahead of them. Sydney tends to be more permissive. You get a variation on this in Sydney. No one wants to be behind another car so they will change lanes and speed to over take you just to improve their position by 1 car. Some will continuously do this, switch lanes with no regard of where they need to be, then create a mess for everyone when they try to merge into the lane they need to be in.
WatchDog 7y ago
As an Australian that has driven in multiple countries, I would choose driving among Australians over many if not most other countries. US drivers are much more aggressive, particularly in cities like LA. UK drivers seem roughly equivalent. Drivers in Germany and the Netherlands seem to drive safer. Driving in South Korea, China, and India is terrifying.
- rosege 7y ago
  Im an Australian who has lived in the Netherlands and I found them pretty aggressive drivers. Generally really nice people outside the car but not so in it.
- Skunkleton 7y ago
  I've never driven in Australia, but I have driven pretty extensively in NZ. Are the drivers similar there? If so, I would agree with you.
tiew9Vii 7y ago
Completely agree. I can’t figure it out though, they have some strict standards getting a license, red p’s for 12-24 months + 120 logbook hours, then green p’s where they are restricted to dangerous below highway speeds so have drivers aggressively overtaking them. Despite this, standards seem far lower than Europe. The horn thing is really annoying, often the person being beeped can’t move forward anyway due to traffic across a junction and people are just being impatient but sometimes it’s the other way and people are just day dreaming at junctions when the light changeover is quick so you ha e to go. It seems car first. Cross a road in Europe a car a few hundred meters down the road will back off the accelerator slightly when they see you and let you cross. Australia they see a pedestrian and will speed up as it’s their road and the light is green, they’ll speed up to the point they are deliberately trying to hit you. Speed limits are annoying here. For such a big country it’s really difficult to travel big distance like you can in Europe or the US. Most people on the highway drive 100km/h as lots of police and the limit is 110. Also everyone will do 100km/h in the outside lane, inside lane doesn’t exist for most people as that’s where the p players are doing 90 and they are afraid of overtaking. It’s also odd as when you pass someone going well below the limit, a minute later they’ll aggressively speed up, fly past, then 5 minutes later they are slowed down and you are overtaking them again when you have kept a constant speed. I’ve found driving in Northern Africa and Asia far less frustrating than Australia and those countries are bit of a free for all, especially Ho Chi Minh. It’s easier in those countries as no one follows any rules and you know that, AU being 50/50 you just have no idea what drivers are going to do and makes it harder to judge.
- therealx 7y ago
  I found the same thing - in the chezh republic, it was a far more free for all than any other urbanized country I had been to, however things ran way smoother because you counted on everyone else following no rules.
- drivingeve 7y ago
  The difference between European and Australian drivers is not that Australians have to do 120 hours of supervised driving, but that the supervisor for the hours of driving in Australia is usually the parents of the learner. So any bad habbits from parents are taught between generations. Compare that to the European system where you are requiredto hire a professional driving instructor to teach you (at great expense I might add) for the entire time you are learning. And because of that, the culture in Australia seems to be that driving is a right where as Europeans seem to treat it as more of a privilege.
pratyushc 7y ago
Driving around in other countries and then coming back to Australia really opened my eyes to how aggressive (especially towards cyclists) the drivers are here.
- rosege 7y ago
  yes I really don't understand the hatred of cyclists - yes they might slow you down for 30 secs - is it really that big a deal?
  - King-Aaron 7y ago
    The hilarious irony of drivers getting angry at cyclists is that by just driving their car they are adding more to congestion and commute times than the cyclists they're so irate at.
sjwright 7y ago
As an Australian who has driven extensively in many countries, my observation is that the quality and attitude of drivers around the world maps fairly closely to the style of the built environment and regulatory environment. Australian roads are unceasingly sensible. Every road is an appropriate width, every road has a logical speed limit, overtaking zones are clearly marked, heck, every bend on a fast road has a sign indicating the recommended cornering speed. All this sensibleness breeds complacent drivers that rarely need to engage their brains. The UK is full of incomprehensibly narrow roads, arbitrary speed limits and a national fetish for complex muliti-lane roundabouts. And to top it off, most cars have manual transmissions. All this complexity breeds more competent, switched-on drivers.
- fyfy18 7y ago
  I think that's just a coincidence, my Northern European country sounds a lot like the parents description, but our roads definately aren't easy to drive on and drivers are very agresive which doesn't help. Speed limits are seen more as a recommendation; if you leave reasonable space between you and the car in front someone will cut in; we have a lot of three lane roundabouts, and large interchanges which are fun in the middle of winter when you can't see the lane markings (or when they decide to resurface it and paint lines a few weeks later); oh and I see plenty of people using their phone while driving every day. The roundabouts thing is interesting actually. We have a lot of large roundabouts, which I assume stems from Soviet times. In more Western countries they would have traffic lights, but here they are basically a free for all - I think adding traffic lights wouldn't actually help traffic flow as it blocks the traffic further down, in one case there are two large roundabouts ~800m apart, and the road between is always crawling in rush hour. Last year they repainted all the lines so each lane corresponds to a specific exit or two. When you enter there are signs showing which lane you should be in, then you just follow that lane and don't need to worry about crossing into another lane (plus the lines are solid so you can't, legally). In a lot of cases they have reduced roundabouts from three to two lanes, but the traffic flow has actually increased. That has caused another issue in that because it's easier to drive on roundabouts, people now drive faster, so getting on is harder if there is a steady stream of traffic. This year they have experimented with adding speed bumps before each entrace (reducing your speed to 30kmh or less) which seems to have alleviated that. Since they introduced these changes I can't actually remember seeing any accident on roundabouts, where as it was a common event before.
hnick 7y ago
Agree with everything as a Sydney dweller, and especially this... > tap their horn at you to remind you the light has been green for 30 seconds now and you're still flicking through Facebook. The number of times I've seen this happen then the idiot wakes up, goes, and the light is now red - and we're all still there. Better not even tell them next time.
rstuart4133 7y ago
> People in Australia don't take driving seriously. I guess that means they don't take it seriously enough for your tastes, but if you've driven elsewhere in the word you would find Australian's take adhering to the road rules _very_ seriously compared to just about anywhere else. Other's here have called in nanny state'ism. Maybe that's true, but it's also true the expansive nature of the country means we drive long distances at high speeds on wide roads. Someone deliberately driving down the wrong side of the road, which I have seen numerous times in countries like France and Italy would get someone killed in Australia. A drunk drivers mistake at 50km/hr it likely to end up at the panel beaters, at 100km/hr at the morgue. Even in major Australian city like Brisbane I'd say I do most of my driving at 100km/hr. So there is a point to nanny state'ism. On the other hand if you had driven in highly congested environments like France and Italy tend to have, you would notice a little extra chaos on the roads actually helps. Other drivers are seem to be far more accommodating of you breaking the rules because you've been sitting there for 5 minutes and it is your turn.

GordonS 7y ago

True story, in the UK: I once saw a guy using an electric razor while driving - and overtaking at ~80mph. I regularly see women doing makeup while driving, stretching up to see their face in the mirror, their car often drifting from left to right. The things some people do while driving are... amazingly fucking stupid.

brokenmachine 7y ago
I'm in Australia and I once saw a lady in a 4WD holding coffee and a cigarette in the one hand, and a phone in the other. She had kids in the back and looked to be driving only using her elbows.

wiredone 7y ago

>People in Australia don't take driving seriously. Honestly, as an Australian living in the US, i'm not sure you have enough context. After living in both Asia and the US, we're a nanny state on this stuff. In the US, people barely ever get breathe tested and often drive drunk, speed everywhere (70-80mph is a lot faster than 110-120kmh). I've also seen Facetime in use multiple times while on the freeway.

megaremote 7y ago
The USA, with 40,000 deaths every single year. More than gun deaths.
- alex_young 7y ago
  No longer true. Cars are getting safer: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/injury.htm https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/injury.htm
batiudrami 7y ago
Yeah in general Australian driving is pretty good I've found. Japan is the only country I've been to where the driving is clearly better. Driving in other countries - the Americas, Asia, Europe, even the supposed peak of Western organisation and efficiency Germany had significantly poorer driving than I see in Australia. But use of phones is an issue and I'm glad to see this being put in place.
- paranoidrobot 7y ago
  > in general Australian driving is pretty good I've found I think driving habits and behaviours are regional. Comparing the drivers of Newcastle, NSW and Sydney, NSW - just 160KM apart and there's a lot of weird differences. - When merging/changing lanes - Newcastle drivers tend to speed up/close any gap if you put your indicator on, to prevent you from merging ahead of them. Sydney tends to be more permissive. - When passing a parked car on a suburban street (single lane each direction), drivers in Sydney will continue on without deviating speed or course significantly. Newcastle drivers will slow down and cross almost entirely into the opposing lane/side of the road. Even on hills and around corners where there's a huge amount of space in their lane.
  - 2muchcoffeeman 7y ago
    > - When merging/changing lanes - Newcastle drivers tend to speed up/close any gap if you put your indicator on, to prevent you from merging ahead of them. Sydney tends to be more permissive. You get a variation on this in Sydney. No one wants to be behind another car so they will change lanes and speed to over take you just to improve their position by 1 car. Some will continuously do this, switch lanes with no regard of where they need to be, then create a mess for everyone when they try to merge into the lane they need to be in.

WatchDog 7y ago

As an Australian that has driven in multiple countries, I would choose driving among Australians over many if not most other countries. US drivers are much more aggressive, particularly in cities like LA. UK drivers seem roughly equivalent. Drivers in Germany and the Netherlands seem to drive safer. Driving in South Korea, China, and India is terrifying.

rosege 7y ago
Im an Australian who has lived in the Netherlands and I found them pretty aggressive drivers. Generally really nice people outside the car but not so in it.
Skunkleton 7y ago
I've never driven in Australia, but I have driven pretty extensively in NZ. Are the drivers similar there? If so, I would agree with you.

tiew9Vii 7y ago

Completely agree. I can’t figure it out though, they have some strict standards getting a license, red p’s for 12-24 months + 120 logbook hours, then green p’s where they are restricted to dangerous below highway speeds so have drivers aggressively overtaking them. Despite this, standards seem far lower than Europe. The horn thing is really annoying, often the person being beeped can’t move forward anyway due to traffic across a junction and people are just being impatient but sometimes it’s the other way and people are just day dreaming at junctions when the light changeover is quick so you ha e to go. It seems car first. Cross a road in Europe a car a few hundred meters down the road will back off the accelerator slightly when they see you and let you cross. Australia they see a pedestrian and will speed up as it’s their road and the light is green, they’ll speed up to the point they are deliberately trying to hit you. Speed limits are annoying here. For such a big country it’s really difficult to travel big distance like you can in Europe or the US. Most people on the highway drive 100km/h as lots of police and the limit is 110. Also everyone will do 100km/h in the outside lane, inside lane doesn’t exist for most people as that’s where the p players are doing 90 and they are afraid of overtaking. It’s also odd as when you pass someone going well below the limit, a minute later they’ll aggressively speed up, fly past, then 5 minutes later they are slowed down and you are overtaking them again when you have kept a constant speed. I’ve found driving in Northern Africa and Asia far less frustrating than Australia and those countries are bit of a free for all, especially Ho Chi Minh. It’s easier in those countries as no one follows any rules and you know that, AU being 50/50 you just have no idea what drivers are going to do and makes it harder to judge.

therealx 7y ago
I found the same thing - in the chezh republic, it was a far more free for all than any other urbanized country I had been to, however things ran way smoother because you counted on everyone else following no rules.
drivingeve 7y ago
The difference between European and Australian drivers is not that Australians have to do 120 hours of supervised driving, but that the supervisor for the hours of driving in Australia is usually the parents of the learner. So any bad habbits from parents are taught between generations. Compare that to the European system where you are requiredto hire a professional driving instructor to teach you (at great expense I might add) for the entire time you are learning. And because of that, the culture in Australia seems to be that driving is a right where as Europeans seem to treat it as more of a privilege.

pratyushc 7y ago

Driving around in other countries and then coming back to Australia really opened my eyes to how aggressive (especially towards cyclists) the drivers are here.

rosege 7y ago
yes I really don't understand the hatred of cyclists - yes they might slow you down for 30 secs - is it really that big a deal?
- King-Aaron 7y ago
  The hilarious irony of drivers getting angry at cyclists is that by just driving their car they are adding more to congestion and commute times than the cyclists they're so irate at.

sjwright 7y ago

As an Australian who has driven extensively in many countries, my observation is that the quality and attitude of drivers around the world maps fairly closely to the style of the built environment and regulatory environment. Australian roads are unceasingly sensible. Every road is an appropriate width, every road has a logical speed limit, overtaking zones are clearly marked, heck, every bend on a fast road has a sign indicating the recommended cornering speed. All this sensibleness breeds complacent drivers that rarely need to engage their brains. The UK is full of incomprehensibly narrow roads, arbitrary speed limits and a national fetish for complex muliti-lane roundabouts. And to top it off, most cars have manual transmissions. All this complexity breeds more competent, switched-on drivers.

fyfy18 7y ago
I think that's just a coincidence, my Northern European country sounds a lot like the parents description, but our roads definately aren't easy to drive on and drivers are very agresive which doesn't help. Speed limits are seen more as a recommendation; if you leave reasonable space between you and the car in front someone will cut in; we have a lot of three lane roundabouts, and large interchanges which are fun in the middle of winter when you can't see the lane markings (or when they decide to resurface it and paint lines a few weeks later); oh and I see plenty of people using their phone while driving every day. The roundabouts thing is interesting actually. We have a lot of large roundabouts, which I assume stems from Soviet times. In more Western countries they would have traffic lights, but here they are basically a free for all - I think adding traffic lights wouldn't actually help traffic flow as it blocks the traffic further down, in one case there are two large roundabouts ~800m apart, and the road between is always crawling in rush hour. Last year they repainted all the lines so each lane corresponds to a specific exit or two. When you enter there are signs showing which lane you should be in, then you just follow that lane and don't need to worry about crossing into another lane (plus the lines are solid so you can't, legally). In a lot of cases they have reduced roundabouts from three to two lanes, but the traffic flow has actually increased. That has caused another issue in that because it's easier to drive on roundabouts, people now drive faster, so getting on is harder if there is a steady stream of traffic. This year they have experimented with adding speed bumps before each entrace (reducing your speed to 30kmh or less) which seems to have alleviated that. Since they introduced these changes I can't actually remember seeing any accident on roundabouts, where as it was a common event before.

hnick 7y ago

Agree with everything as a Sydney dweller, and especially this... > tap their horn at you to remind you the light has been green for 30 seconds now and you're still flicking through Facebook. The number of times I've seen this happen then the idiot wakes up, goes, and the light is now red - and we're all still there. Better not even tell them next time.

rstuart4133 7y ago

> People in Australia don't take driving seriously. I guess that means they don't take it seriously enough for your tastes, but if you've driven elsewhere in the word you would find Australian's take adhering to the road rules _very_ seriously compared to just about anywhere else. Other's here have called in nanny state'ism. Maybe that's true, but it's also true the expansive nature of the country means we drive long distances at high speeds on wide roads. Someone deliberately driving down the wrong side of the road, which I have seen numerous times in countries like France and Italy would get someone killed in Australia. A drunk drivers mistake at 50km/hr it likely to end up at the panel beaters, at 100km/hr at the morgue. Even in major Australian city like Brisbane I'd say I do most of my driving at 100km/hr. So there is a point to nanny state'ism. On the other hand if you had driven in highly congested environments like France and Italy tend to have, you would notice a little extra chaos on the roads actually helps. Other drivers are seem to be far more accommodating of you breaking the rules because you've been sitting there for 5 minutes and it is your turn.