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> the people who talk about USENET and IRC are people who don't want to be "updated" to what modern users demand. IRC is objectively terrible. If you ask a que

> the people who talk about USENET and IRC are people who don't want to be "updated" to what modern users demand. IRC is objectively terrible. If you ask a question, the only way to get the answer is if you stay logged in until someone answers you. That's like buying a phone that doesn't ring unless you're already holding it up to your ear, or an email client that deletes all your email unless you happen to be looking at your inbox at the moment a new message arrives.

sha666sum 7y ago
I agree. What makes IRC good is that it's a text-only chat with a wide range of highly configurable, blazing fast clients. Not supporting images, quoting or reactions could be considered a feature, since these distract from the actual conversation at hand (consider newbies clogging the conversation with screenshots, or 100 people adding reaction emojis to a message).
mehhh 7y ago
I disagree with your false equivalency. IRC is akin to a cellphone without voicemail, as when your disconnected from the network (cellular or IRC) you just don't get communications. Scrollback and voicemail can be useful, but a good chunk of the population does not want either, hence unread backscroll and unconfigured/full voicemail boxes being very common.
- hombre_fatal 7y ago
  >but a good chunk of the population does not want either The largest Freenode channels I'm on like #node.js and #javascript have about 10 regulars max, myself included. It's pretty much dead for any purpose other than hanging out with a handful of curmudgeons feeding off a corpse out of habit. Doesn't seem like "a good chunk" to me. IRC lacks the only feature I really care about in a chat network: new people to talk to, users. I wonder how many HNers who praise IRC only like the idea of it but don't even use it these days, either. And I haven't even heard HNers bring up usenet outside of downloading free shit so I know that's especially dead wrt this thread as a decentralized Reddit. So it always makes me chuckle to see "yeah, well, some people like it like that!" which is apparently virtually nobody. Or it's like how my two friends and I loved the failed, abandoned supermall in my hometown because the three of us could longboard down its parking garage.
  - tyri_kai_psomi 7y ago
    "I have never experienced this thing, therefore this thing must not exist"
    - untog 7y ago
      "I like this thing, therefore a sizeable chunk of the population must too"
ekianjo 7y ago
No. you just connect to an always on session like TheLounge and you have an IRC with the features you want. Pretty simple.
- manigandham 7y ago
  This is like the famous comment in the "Show HN: Dropbox" thread that said you could just use rsync/ftp/git instead. Meanwhile Dropbox is now worth over $8B.
  - ekianjo 7y ago
    Not sure why the value of anything makes my point invalid? I answered there was a simple way for anyone using IRC to keep sessions alive and therefore not miss any message. This is an off the shelf solution, not something you have to build by yourself.
    - manigandham 7y ago
      Because it's a workaround, and shows just how far apart the legacy tech is from a modern experience.
throwaway8879 7y ago
> objectively terrible These two words next to each other really bother me. That something is "terrible" is not objective, whatever that means. All we have are our subjective valuations.
- Alex3917 7y ago
  What I meant was more like, when viewed impartially rather than through the lens of nostalgia. Two people can do that and still have different opinions.
gdulli 7y ago
Synchronous and asynchronous communication both have their fundamental strengths and weaknesses. In a chat room you have the possibility of a real-time back and forth. That's invaluable at times. You might have a preference for one over another, or each might be appropriate for different situations. But to claim one is objectively terrible is ridiculous and only makes you look like you haven't taken the time to understand it at its most basic level, or you're too solipsistic to be able to recognize the existence of value in something outside of your own preference.
- chii 7y ago
  Slack is a superset of IRC, except for the protocol not being open. The UX in slack is not easily replicated in IRC (for example, how does/can global search work in IRC?) Therefore, it is actually correct to say IRC is objectively worse in those measures. The only measure that IRC beats slack is the open protocol (which, if I'm being honest, not many users care,ala most existing chat services moved to private protocols and haven't lost all their users to IRC or xmpp).
reificator 7y ago
> IRC is objectively terrible. If you ask a question, the only way to get the answer is if you stay logged in until someone answers you. That's like buying a phone that doesn't ring unless you're already holding it up to your ear, or an email client that deletes all your email unless you happen to be looking at your inbox at the moment a new message arrives. Well it's a good thing Slack and Discord don't work exactly the same way but with a nicer UI and no need for a bouncer to emulate a persistent session.
flukus 7y ago
Your use case is what mailing lists or usenet are for, of course IRC is an objectively terrible mailing list, it's also an objectively terrible toaster.
joewee 7y ago
Young people now think it’s ok to send out a message and respond whenever they feel like it. Communication is no longer a conversation in the tradition sense, it’s a series of monologues or statements where the sender usually only cares about whether you are impressed by the statement. IRC was all about conversation. You went there to have a conversation, like a party line voice bridge. You even waited around for someone to have a conversation with... oh I miss it...
- iikoolpp 7y ago
  > Young people now think it’s ok to send out a message and respond whenever they feel like it. Boomers demand attention constantly.

sha666sum 7y ago

I agree. What makes IRC good is that it's a text-only chat with a wide range of highly configurable, blazing fast clients. Not supporting images, quoting or reactions could be considered a feature, since these distract from the actual conversation at hand (consider newbies clogging the conversation with screenshots, or 100 people adding reaction emojis to a message).

mehhh 7y ago

I disagree with your false equivalency. IRC is akin to a cellphone without voicemail, as when your disconnected from the network (cellular or IRC) you just don't get communications. Scrollback and voicemail can be useful, but a good chunk of the population does not want either, hence unread backscroll and unconfigured/full voicemail boxes being very common.

hombre_fatal 7y ago
>but a good chunk of the population does not want either The largest Freenode channels I'm on like #node.js and #javascript have about 10 regulars max, myself included. It's pretty much dead for any purpose other than hanging out with a handful of curmudgeons feeding off a corpse out of habit. Doesn't seem like "a good chunk" to me. IRC lacks the only feature I really care about in a chat network: new people to talk to, users. I wonder how many HNers who praise IRC only like the idea of it but don't even use it these days, either. And I haven't even heard HNers bring up usenet outside of downloading free shit so I know that's especially dead wrt this thread as a decentralized Reddit. So it always makes me chuckle to see "yeah, well, some people like it like that!" which is apparently virtually nobody. Or it's like how my two friends and I loved the failed, abandoned supermall in my hometown because the three of us could longboard down its parking garage.
- tyri_kai_psomi 7y ago
  "I have never experienced this thing, therefore this thing must not exist"
  - untog 7y ago
    "I like this thing, therefore a sizeable chunk of the population must too"

ekianjo 7y ago

No. you just connect to an always on session like TheLounge and you have an IRC with the features you want. Pretty simple.

manigandham 7y ago
This is like the famous comment in the "Show HN: Dropbox" thread that said you could just use rsync/ftp/git instead. Meanwhile Dropbox is now worth over $8B.
- ekianjo 7y ago
  Not sure why the value of anything makes my point invalid? I answered there was a simple way for anyone using IRC to keep sessions alive and therefore not miss any message. This is an off the shelf solution, not something you have to build by yourself.
  - manigandham 7y ago
    Because it's a workaround, and shows just how far apart the legacy tech is from a modern experience.

throwaway8879 7y ago

> objectively terrible These two words next to each other really bother me. That something is "terrible" is not objective, whatever that means. All we have are our subjective valuations.

Alex3917 7y ago
What I meant was more like, when viewed impartially rather than through the lens of nostalgia. Two people can do that and still have different opinions.

gdulli 7y ago

Synchronous and asynchronous communication both have their fundamental strengths and weaknesses. In a chat room you have the possibility of a real-time back and forth. That's invaluable at times. You might have a preference for one over another, or each might be appropriate for different situations. But to claim one is objectively terrible is ridiculous and only makes you look like you haven't taken the time to understand it at its most basic level, or you're too solipsistic to be able to recognize the existence of value in something outside of your own preference.

chii 7y ago
Slack is a superset of IRC, except for the protocol not being open. The UX in slack is not easily replicated in IRC (for example, how does/can global search work in IRC?) Therefore, it is actually correct to say IRC is objectively worse in those measures. The only measure that IRC beats slack is the open protocol (which, if I'm being honest, not many users care,ala most existing chat services moved to private protocols and haven't lost all their users to IRC or xmpp).

reificator 7y ago

> IRC is objectively terrible. If you ask a question, the only way to get the answer is if you stay logged in until someone answers you. That's like buying a phone that doesn't ring unless you're already holding it up to your ear, or an email client that deletes all your email unless you happen to be looking at your inbox at the moment a new message arrives. Well it's a good thing Slack and Discord don't work exactly the same way but with a nicer UI and no need for a bouncer to emulate a persistent session.

flukus 7y ago

Your use case is what mailing lists or usenet are for, of course IRC is an objectively terrible mailing list, it's also an objectively terrible toaster.

joewee 7y ago

Young people now think it’s ok to send out a message and respond whenever they feel like it. Communication is no longer a conversation in the tradition sense, it’s a series of monologues or statements where the sender usually only cares about whether you are impressed by the statement. IRC was all about conversation. You went there to have a conversation, like a party line voice bridge. You even waited around for someone to have a conversation with... oh I miss it...

iikoolpp 7y ago
> Young people now think it’s ok to send out a message and respond whenever they feel like it. Boomers demand attention constantly.