9 ms·

Much of this description applies pretty well to western countries, especially the US.

Quarrel 7y ago
Not in the same way. The US has had credit collapses before, and has relatively robust institutions to deal with it. Robustness that has developed through major crashes. This is largely true of most developed economies as well. China's credit bust will be epic - epicly bad, both for China and the rest of the world, but mostly for the Chinese people.
AFascistWorld 7y ago
No no no, in which American city does the condo prices wthin it's urban area are no less than 1 million dollars? In Beijing you have it, it's a city full of (multi) million-dollar-property owners, and the majority of them love the CCP dearly for a reason.
- tmh79 7y ago
  Most American cities have condos available for less than 1m dollars. In fact, pretty much all of them do. In fact, pretty much only in certain areas of NYC, SF, Boston and LA are the median condo prices above 1m. In Chicago, the 3rd largest city in the US, condo prices are like 400k-600k for a 30th floor lakeview 2br in a nice neighborhood.
entropea 7y ago
The indoctrination and politics being taught. Every day children in school stand up and pledge allegiance to the flag and there are constant stories of children being abused for not abiding by it. We're told we're "not being American" if we challenge the official narrative. The fact that you're being downvoted is just more evidence, people hate being told they're just as indoctrinated into propaganda as China is, but they're just as indoctrinated into their own version.
woodgrainz 7y ago
China has no freedom of speech, the press, religion, or assembly. There is no real comparison of the indoctrination of the people of China to the US to be made. The systems are completely different as to be unrecognizable from one another. In addition, the Chinese court system is simply a tool of the government to keep themselves in power. Reference the 99.9% conviction rate: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/12193202/Chinese-courts-convict-more-than-99.9-per-cent-of-defendants.html https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/121932...
- mistermann 7y ago
  > There is no real comparison of the indoctrination of the people of China to the US to be made. The systems are completely different as to be unrecognizable from one another. I'm not sure I entirely agree with that. It's true, the two systems are significantly different, but I don't think that rules out that Americans are subject to a form of indoctrination. Look at the stranglehold the two parties have on the electoral system in the US. Just as one example, what happened to Bernie Sanders in the last election barely raised an eyebrow. If you listen to Dan Carlin's Common Sense podcast for several weeks on either side of the last election (particularly after), I'd say it's pretty hard to make a case that the system isn't rigged to a fairly large degree, but how many people are actually aware of this? I don't know if indoctrination is the perfect word for it, but constantly singing the praises of the system of democracy, while realistically the only alternatives people get have to go through a very thorough pre-screening for "suitability", and almost no one ever asks what the hell is really going on here, seems like a relative of some sort to indoctrination.
  - SpicyLemonZest 7y ago
    Even if everything you're saying is true, the important point is that you and I and Dan Carlin are free to go around saying it. It's my strong impression that this is not true in China; that it's a de facto if not de jure crime for media personalities to say things like "the Communist Party has rigged the system to a fairly large degree" or "Xi Jinping Thought seems kinda dumb and I'd like to read the alternatives".

Not in the same way. The US has had credit collapses before, and has relatively robust institutions to deal with it. Robustness that has developed through major crashes. This is largely true of most developed economies as well. China's credit bust will be epic - epicly bad, both for China and the rest of the world, but mostly for the Chinese people.

AFascistWorld 7y ago

No no no, in which American city does the condo prices wthin it's urban area are no less than 1 million dollars? In Beijing you have it, it's a city full of (multi) million-dollar-property owners, and the majority of them love the CCP dearly for a reason.

tmh79 7y ago
Most American cities have condos available for less than 1m dollars. In fact, pretty much all of them do. In fact, pretty much only in certain areas of NYC, SF, Boston and LA are the median condo prices above 1m. In Chicago, the 3rd largest city in the US, condo prices are like 400k-600k for a 30th floor lakeview 2br in a nice neighborhood.

entropea 7y ago

The indoctrination and politics being taught. Every day children in school stand up and pledge allegiance to the flag and there are constant stories of children being abused for not abiding by it. We're told we're "not being American" if we challenge the official narrative. The fact that you're being downvoted is just more evidence, people hate being told they're just as indoctrinated into propaganda as China is, but they're just as indoctrinated into their own version.

woodgrainz 7y ago

China has no freedom of speech, the press, religion, or assembly. There is no real comparison of the indoctrination of the people of China to the US to be made. The systems are completely different as to be unrecognizable from one another. In addition, the Chinese court system is simply a tool of the government to keep themselves in power. Reference the 99.9% conviction rate: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/12193202/Chinese-courts-convict-more-than-99.9-per-cent-of-defendants.html https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/121932...

mistermann 7y ago
> There is no real comparison of the indoctrination of the people of China to the US to be made. The systems are completely different as to be unrecognizable from one another. I'm not sure I entirely agree with that. It's true, the two systems are significantly different, but I don't think that rules out that Americans are subject to a form of indoctrination. Look at the stranglehold the two parties have on the electoral system in the US. Just as one example, what happened to Bernie Sanders in the last election barely raised an eyebrow. If you listen to Dan Carlin's Common Sense podcast for several weeks on either side of the last election (particularly after), I'd say it's pretty hard to make a case that the system isn't rigged to a fairly large degree, but how many people are actually aware of this? I don't know if indoctrination is the perfect word for it, but constantly singing the praises of the system of democracy, while realistically the only alternatives people get have to go through a very thorough pre-screening for "suitability", and almost no one ever asks what the hell is really going on here, seems like a relative of some sort to indoctrination.
- SpicyLemonZest 7y ago
  Even if everything you're saying is true, the important point is that you and I and Dan Carlin are free to go around saying it. It's my strong impression that this is not true in China; that it's a de facto if not de jure crime for media personalities to say things like "the Communist Party has rigged the system to a fairly large degree" or "Xi Jinping Thought seems kinda dumb and I'd like to read the alternatives".