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This is, at best, "sponsored content" from Audi, and at worst, an Audi advertisement directly written by a PR firm. Why is this on the front page of HN?

kensai 7y ago
Because people are interested to know why this is happening. Technical people voted for this article to be on the front page. Please respect that. The insinuation that Jalopnik is Audi’s sock puppet is simply unfounded.
- mft_ 7y ago
  > The insinuation that Jalopnik is Audi’s sock puppet is simply unfounded. The guy actually says that he's been directly influenced by the (PR-driven, because that's how this works) information that he was provided by Audi, and as a result, has written an article about it. "...Audi took the time to explain to me what non-Tesla EVs are bringing to the table. Essentially, the diagrams they sent over of the Audi E-Tron..." He also swallows some of the (Audi PR) arguments whole: "...why the E-Tron goes 204 miles compared to 370 miles for the Model S Long Range. The other big part is the battery itself. First, the Model S packs a bigger 100kWh battery pack compared to the 95kWh pack in the Audi." What about a comparison to other Teslas with smaller batteries --like the model 3 with its 75kWh battery-- which still manage to wallop the e-tron's range?
  - kensai 7y ago
    The e-tron is a heavy SUV with different aerodynamics in respect to a sedan. I personally find these comparisons useless, anyway. Still, sustained performance is something rarely compared. Let’s see how the Tesla S will fair in the Nürburgring soon.
  - braythwayt 7y ago
    “The guy actually says that he's been directly influenced by the (PR-driven, because that's how this works) information that he was provided by Audi.” Another way to say that is to point out that the author/regurgitator has responsibly disclosed the source of the information so that we may judge for ourselves whether it is interesting. As I pointed out in another thread, I think we all agree that this is planted, the question is whether it is still interesting to read and/or use as an excuse for a discussion.
  - tw04 7y ago
    So what you're saying is he was provided information and knowledge he previously didn't have and (slightly) changed his opinion based on that information. And this is a bad thing? >What about a comparison to other Teslas with smaller batteries --like the model 3 with its 75kWh battery-- which still manage to wallop the e-tron's range? Would you ask BMW why they aren't comparing a 750il to an Audi A3? The model 3 is half the size and weighs 1000lbs less, the battery is irrelevant.
braythwayt 7y ago
The first sentence is absolutely true. And frankly, unsurprising to anyone who has been around the magazine industry for longer than a week or two. As they used to say of computer magazines in their heyday, “Everything in the magazine is an advertisement, some of which are labeled as such.” Paul Graham wrote an essay about PR in this site’s early days called “The Submarine,” where he credited PR for the success of his own startup that he sold to Yahoo. PR is part of the game, and recognizing it as such is part of the game. BUt with respect to your second sentence, just because it’s PR doesn’t necessarily mean it is false or misleading. That assumption would be an ad hominem fallacy. A PR piece planted in Jalopnik isn’t that much different than an interview with the CEO. You know the CEO is stating their company’s official position, but you may still want to hear their point of view. I 100% agree it is useful to make sure that everyone reading this be aware that it is mostly ghost-written by VW Group. But once you are aware of that, it is still useful to read it and debate amongst ourselves whether their claims are reasonable and informative. Personally, I thought the article did a good job of explaining that they were repeating VW’s claims. It did not feel like they were pretending to print the views of a so-called “independent think tank.️“ JM2C.
- Benjammer 7y ago
  I just honestly don't think it's even worth it for us to discuss this article on a somewhat technical, popular discussion forum like HN. It doesn't make any attempt to give background/contextual information about any of the specific issues discussed, it simply jumps right into pushing the Audi features and openly bashing Tesla with vague generalizations; for example: "Motor cooling is the weak link in the Tesla Model S, with motor heat soaking usually responsible for power reductions under hard driving." It doesn't explain the motivations of either company's designers and engineers, it doesn't give background science on cooling technologies, and it doesn't even really explain why Audi's system is better. It just says Audi has "more aggressive and redundant cooling systems," and that Tesla's cooling, "is the weak link in the Tesla Model S," with little-to-no further explanation. If you are talking about an interview with a CEO where they focus on how they are better than one specific competitor, and come off petty, shallow, and unreasonably biased, then I would have similar feelings about that content. A bunch of us here talking about this article is what a marketing analyst's or PR agent's dreams are made of.

kensai 7y ago

Because people are interested to know why this is happening. Technical people voted for this article to be on the front page. Please respect that. The insinuation that Jalopnik is Audi’s sock puppet is simply unfounded.

mft_ 7y ago
> The insinuation that Jalopnik is Audi’s sock puppet is simply unfounded. The guy actually says that he's been directly influenced by the (PR-driven, because that's how this works) information that he was provided by Audi, and as a result, has written an article about it. "...Audi took the time to explain to me what non-Tesla EVs are bringing to the table. Essentially, the diagrams they sent over of the Audi E-Tron..." He also swallows some of the (Audi PR) arguments whole: "...why the E-Tron goes 204 miles compared to 370 miles for the Model S Long Range. The other big part is the battery itself. First, the Model S packs a bigger 100kWh battery pack compared to the 95kWh pack in the Audi." What about a comparison to other Teslas with smaller batteries --like the model 3 with its 75kWh battery-- which still manage to wallop the e-tron's range?
- kensai 7y ago
  The e-tron is a heavy SUV with different aerodynamics in respect to a sedan. I personally find these comparisons useless, anyway. Still, sustained performance is something rarely compared. Let’s see how the Tesla S will fair in the Nürburgring soon.
- braythwayt 7y ago
  “The guy actually says that he's been directly influenced by the (PR-driven, because that's how this works) information that he was provided by Audi.” Another way to say that is to point out that the author/regurgitator has responsibly disclosed the source of the information so that we may judge for ourselves whether it is interesting. As I pointed out in another thread, I think we all agree that this is planted, the question is whether it is still interesting to read and/or use as an excuse for a discussion.
- tw04 7y ago
  So what you're saying is he was provided information and knowledge he previously didn't have and (slightly) changed his opinion based on that information. And this is a bad thing? >What about a comparison to other Teslas with smaller batteries --like the model 3 with its 75kWh battery-- which still manage to wallop the e-tron's range? Would you ask BMW why they aren't comparing a 750il to an Audi A3? The model 3 is half the size and weighs 1000lbs less, the battery is irrelevant.

braythwayt 7y ago

The first sentence is absolutely true. And frankly, unsurprising to anyone who has been around the magazine industry for longer than a week or two. As they used to say of computer magazines in their heyday, “Everything in the magazine is an advertisement, some of which are labeled as such.” Paul Graham wrote an essay about PR in this site’s early days called “The Submarine,” where he credited PR for the success of his own startup that he sold to Yahoo. PR is part of the game, and recognizing it as such is part of the game. BUt with respect to your second sentence, just because it’s PR doesn’t necessarily mean it is false or misleading. That assumption would be an ad hominem fallacy. A PR piece planted in Jalopnik isn’t that much different than an interview with the CEO. You know the CEO is stating their company’s official position, but you may still want to hear their point of view. I 100% agree it is useful to make sure that everyone reading this be aware that it is mostly ghost-written by VW Group. But once you are aware of that, it is still useful to read it and debate amongst ourselves whether their claims are reasonable and informative. Personally, I thought the article did a good job of explaining that they were repeating VW’s claims. It did not feel like they were pretending to print the views of a so-called “independent think tank.️“ JM2C.

Benjammer 7y ago
I just honestly don't think it's even worth it for us to discuss this article on a somewhat technical, popular discussion forum like HN. It doesn't make any attempt to give background/contextual information about any of the specific issues discussed, it simply jumps right into pushing the Audi features and openly bashing Tesla with vague generalizations; for example: "Motor cooling is the weak link in the Tesla Model S, with motor heat soaking usually responsible for power reductions under hard driving." It doesn't explain the motivations of either company's designers and engineers, it doesn't give background science on cooling technologies, and it doesn't even really explain why Audi's system is better. It just says Audi has "more aggressive and redundant cooling systems," and that Tesla's cooling, "is the weak link in the Tesla Model S," with little-to-no further explanation. If you are talking about an interview with a CEO where they focus on how they are better than one specific competitor, and come off petty, shallow, and unreasonably biased, then I would have similar feelings about that content. A bunch of us here talking about this article is what a marketing analyst's or PR agent's dreams are made of.