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The police via Red Flag laws which are incredibly easy to abuse.

by cc439 7y ago

DiseasedBadger 7y ago
It's worrying that Hacker News isn't mature enough to admit to the Dayton Ohio shooter's politics and affiliations. I don't think HN, as a population, are on the side of democracy, liberalism, or freedom.
inscionent 7y ago
The police are using red flag laws to seize weapons because the 'private free-market Stasi' told them to? Red flag laws are mostly used to prevent suicides and domestic violence. They are formal proceedings and due process of law. If the problem is with the law, organize and change it.
- rbritton 7y ago
  There is no due process. Due process would be (1) a hearing prior to your property being confiscated; and (2) the ability to face your accuser. None of these happen with any existing red flag laws and violate multiple items in the Bill of Rights. Additionally, in most states' implementations of these laws, there are no codified repercussions for false reportings. It's effectively legalized SWATting. They have led to the death of one man in Maryland [0] and an erroneous confiscation of one man in Florida [1] so far. [0]: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/maryland-officers-serving-red-flag-gun-removal-order-fatally-shoot-armed-man/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/maryland-officers-serving-red-f... [1]: https://townhall.com/tipsheet/bethbaumann/2019/08/19/red-flag-law-failure-guy-is-stripped-of-his-gunsbecause-of-another-mans-criminal-activity-n2551921 https://townhall.com/tipsheet/bethbaumann/2019/08/19/red-fla...
  - LorenPechtel 7y ago
    That first one sounds like someone that should have been red flagged--I wouldn't call that a failure of the system. The police were there, he had put the gun down and then picked it up again. Yeah, family members said he wouldn't hurt anyone. It's very common for family members to side with abusers over victims. The second, however, is the sort of problem that plague red flag laws.
- mieseratte 7y ago
  > They are formal proceedings and due process of law. A number of states involve no due-process prior to confiscation and require you to hire an attorney and file suit if your initial request for return of property are denied. Having been "red flagged" by a vindictive ex, and in a "Red State" too boot, this is no joke.
- LorenPechtel 7y ago
  You have fallen for the hype. Red flag laws are a very bad implementation of a good idea.

The police via Red Flag laws which are incredibly easy to abuse.

by cc439 7y ago

The police via Red Flag laws which are incredibly easy to abuse.

It's worrying that Hacker News isn't mature enough to admit to the Dayton Ohio shooter's politics and affiliations. I don't think HN, as a population, are on the side of democracy, liberalism, or freedom.

inscionent 7y ago

The police are using red flag laws to seize weapons because the 'private free-market Stasi' told them to? Red flag laws are mostly used to prevent suicides and domestic violence. They are formal proceedings and due process of law. If the problem is with the law, organize and change it.

rbritton 7y ago
There is no due process. Due process would be (1) a hearing prior to your property being confiscated; and (2) the ability to face your accuser. None of these happen with any existing red flag laws and violate multiple items in the Bill of Rights. Additionally, in most states' implementations of these laws, there are no codified repercussions for false reportings. It's effectively legalized SWATting. They have led to the death of one man in Maryland [0] and an erroneous confiscation of one man in Florida [1] so far. [0]: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/maryland-officers-serving-red-flag-gun-removal-order-fatally-shoot-armed-man/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/maryland-officers-serving-red-f... [1]: https://townhall.com/tipsheet/bethbaumann/2019/08/19/red-flag-law-failure-guy-is-stripped-of-his-gunsbecause-of-another-mans-criminal-activity-n2551921 https://townhall.com/tipsheet/bethbaumann/2019/08/19/red-fla...
- LorenPechtel 7y ago
  That first one sounds like someone that should have been red flagged--I wouldn't call that a failure of the system. The police were there, he had put the gun down and then picked it up again. Yeah, family members said he wouldn't hurt anyone. It's very common for family members to side with abusers over victims. The second, however, is the sort of problem that plague red flag laws.
mieseratte 7y ago
> They are formal proceedings and due process of law. A number of states involve no due-process prior to confiscation and require you to hire an attorney and file suit if your initial request for return of property are denied. Having been "red flagged" by a vindictive ex, and in a "Red State" too boot, this is no joke.
LorenPechtel 7y ago
You have fallen for the hype. Red flag laws are a very bad implementation of a good idea.