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Weird. I think it’s rubbish as a public library. I mean, it’s an interesting building, and a nice place for a cup of coffee, but it’s absolutely useless if you

by tow21 7y ago

Weird. I think it’s rubbish as a public library. I mean, it’s an interesting building, and a nice place for a cup of coffee, but it’s absolutely useless if you want to go and browse some shelves and borrow some books; it’s like it’s been actively designed to make that hard to do.

tenaciousDaniel 7y ago
This is how I felt about the New York Public Library. It's famous; everyone goes there. There's even a Gutenberg Bible there. But I've been 2-3 times and I never found a book. It's like the books are all deliberately hidden, it's infuriating.
- SolaceQuantum 7y ago
  The NYPL In Bryant Park? Basement floor hallway past the bathrooms. There’s a separate entrance for it also on 42nd st? I go there all the time for books and free public restrooms. The big NYPL space is for all the other things libraries do, like workspaces, meeting spaces, etc. I think there’s also a very rare book section but that requires special permission.
  - ghaff 7y ago
    The renovated Rose Reading Room is really beautiful. Great place to work for a couple hours. (So is Bryant Park on a nice day of course.)
- BeepBoop2k 7y ago
  The main building at Bryant Park is a research library. It's beautiful - but it doesn't have much circulation, just items of interest for researchers. The Mid-Manhattan branch is a HUGE circulation library. It's across the street from the main library but confusingly enough - it's in the middle of being renovated so, for now, its colocated in the basement of the main library and a subset of its collection is available. It is _very_ browsable.
trm42 7y ago
Actually, it’s awesome that they have realized that the definition of library is changing from a store of media into place where people can meet and hang around and do stuff together. There isn’t that much of public space for people unless you’re attending some school. And in case somebody asks, hanging outside in Finnish winter is not that fun all the time ;D I’ve visited Oodi a lot more than traditional libraries as I already have the need for books satiated with Kindle and such.
- clarkmoody 7y ago
  What you've described is a community center, not a library...
  - ceejayoz 7y ago
    Sure, and that's what a lot of smart libraries are evolving towards. One of ours locally has a tool library and 3D printing, which I think is awesome. Performance spaces for poetry, music, etc.
    - ghaff 7y ago
      I like physical books as much as the next person. And providing access to and/or lending out physical books, journals, references, etc. is certainly an important library function. But, at the same time, it's important not to fetishize the value of a library as being defined by how much dead tree storage it has.
      - WilTimSon 7y ago
        Absolutely true but it's important to make sure that if the library does have a rich collection of works they're all properly catalogued, sorted, easy to access, and easy to check out. If you already have the books available, make sure you're giving people a chance to check them out. Sure, most might go to the library for events and hangouts but some might be happy to borrow a novel or a scientific text. It's about resource usage.
      - 7y ago
knolax 7y ago
To be fair I don't think I've found the exact book I was looking for in any library before. As book dispenseries libraries are inherently inferior to just downloading off of Libgen. However they do function very well as a place for you to physically sit in while you're on Libgen.
- fhbdukfrh 7y ago
  The Calgary public library has a pretty decent online holds system that will transfer physical goods to your local branch within a day or so. I've never been to out fancy new downtown branch that cost a fortune but hear the focus is definitely not on books or even media, but social activities. I find this disappointing because IMO we still need physical repositories of knowledge; they are the unifying hub around a broad audience but specific purpose
  - skizziepop 7y ago
    I'd recommend taking a jaunt over — multiple floors of stacks, and plenty of nooks for reading.
decebalus1 7y ago
Heh... that's my take on the Seattle public library. First time I visited it, It gave me anxiety. I fucking hate it and refuse to visit it. Part of it feels like some Eastern European communist polytechnic institute, other parts feel like it's a scene from blade runner. Grabbing a book and reading it by the shelf is the last thing I want to do. It's a weird building with a weird vibe designed to be anything but a library. I honestly don't like this trend of architecting 'interesting' buildings which serve little use to its intended purpose. Turns out I wasn't the only one thinking this: https://www.seattlepi.com/ae/article/On-Architecture-How-the-new-Central-Library-1232303.php https://www.seattlepi.com/ae/article/On-Architecture-How-the...
- davepeck 7y ago
  I have a lot of friends who are in your camp. Me? I love the Seattle Central library and have found some happy nooks where I can comfortably read for hours. By far my most favorite part of the library is level 8: endless sheet music and a couple of piano practice rooms nearby.
deanclatworthy 7y ago
Agree. I’ve spent a fair amount of time there the last couple of weeks. It’s full of tourists (both from outside Helsinki and outside of Finland) gawking around and taking photos and selfies. It’s noisy as there is no protocol for that as it’s a “public space”. So what is it? A nice looking building with hardly any books, a few gimmicks and two cafes. On the surface it fits the bill for all the modern awards it’s bound to get and it fits the narrative that libraries are for public space rather than renting books, but spend some time there. It’s not practical to get books from as there are hardly any books, it’s not practical to study as there is only one tiny reading room. I urge anyone reading this article to spend more than 15m wandering around in there.
- polemic 7y ago
  I've spent some time working and using the space there and my impression was very different. Kids (and adults) using the games rooms, lots of interesting projects going on at the 3D printers, sewing machines and graphics computers, heaps of people working in various nooks, there were a few small concerts, family's enjoying the kids area. It is undeniably a beautiful building, but it also felt like a community space that was servicing it's visitors exceptionally well.
jdietrich 7y ago
>it’s absolutely useless if you want to go and browse some shelves and borrow some books Libraries cannot survive by catering to a smaller and smaller subset of people who are habituated to using a mostly obsolete technology. On a cost-per-loan basis, most libraries would save money by closing their doors forever and simply buying books from Amazon whenever someone asks for one. Local governments look at the lending data and quite rightly wonder whether the money could be better spent on a thousand other things. To secure their future, libraries are becoming a sort of egalitarian third space. They provide internet access for people who don't have it and training for people who have been left behind by technology. They provide a place to relax and socialise for people who can't afford a $4 coffee. They provide a venue for community events. They provide young people with opportunities to engage in the kind of self-guided learning that actually matters today.

by tow21 7y ago

tenaciousDaniel 7y ago

This is how I felt about the New York Public Library. It's famous; everyone goes there. There's even a Gutenberg Bible there. But I've been 2-3 times and I never found a book. It's like the books are all deliberately hidden, it's infuriating.

SolaceQuantum 7y ago
The NYPL In Bryant Park? Basement floor hallway past the bathrooms. There’s a separate entrance for it also on 42nd st? I go there all the time for books and free public restrooms. The big NYPL space is for all the other things libraries do, like workspaces, meeting spaces, etc. I think there’s also a very rare book section but that requires special permission.
- ghaff 7y ago
  The renovated Rose Reading Room is really beautiful. Great place to work for a couple hours. (So is Bryant Park on a nice day of course.)
BeepBoop2k 7y ago
The main building at Bryant Park is a research library. It's beautiful - but it doesn't have much circulation, just items of interest for researchers. The Mid-Manhattan branch is a HUGE circulation library. It's across the street from the main library but confusingly enough - it's in the middle of being renovated so, for now, its colocated in the basement of the main library and a subset of its collection is available. It is _very_ browsable.

trm42 7y ago

Actually, it’s awesome that they have realized that the definition of library is changing from a store of media into place where people can meet and hang around and do stuff together. There isn’t that much of public space for people unless you’re attending some school. And in case somebody asks, hanging outside in Finnish winter is not that fun all the time ;D I’ve visited Oodi a lot more than traditional libraries as I already have the need for books satiated with Kindle and such.

clarkmoody 7y ago
What you've described is a community center, not a library...
- ceejayoz 7y ago
  Sure, and that's what a lot of smart libraries are evolving towards. One of ours locally has a tool library and 3D printing, which I think is awesome. Performance spaces for poetry, music, etc.
  - ghaff 7y ago
    I like physical books as much as the next person. And providing access to and/or lending out physical books, journals, references, etc. is certainly an important library function. But, at the same time, it's important not to fetishize the value of a library as being defined by how much dead tree storage it has.
    - WilTimSon 7y ago
      Absolutely true but it's important to make sure that if the library does have a rich collection of works they're all properly catalogued, sorted, easy to access, and easy to check out. If you already have the books available, make sure you're giving people a chance to check them out. Sure, most might go to the library for events and hangouts but some might be happy to borrow a novel or a scientific text. It's about resource usage.
    - 7y ago

knolax 7y ago

To be fair I don't think I've found the exact book I was looking for in any library before. As book dispenseries libraries are inherently inferior to just downloading off of Libgen. However they do function very well as a place for you to physically sit in while you're on Libgen.

fhbdukfrh 7y ago
The Calgary public library has a pretty decent online holds system that will transfer physical goods to your local branch within a day or so. I've never been to out fancy new downtown branch that cost a fortune but hear the focus is definitely not on books or even media, but social activities. I find this disappointing because IMO we still need physical repositories of knowledge; they are the unifying hub around a broad audience but specific purpose
- skizziepop 7y ago
  I'd recommend taking a jaunt over — multiple floors of stacks, and plenty of nooks for reading.

decebalus1 7y ago

Heh... that's my take on the Seattle public library. First time I visited it, It gave me anxiety. I fucking hate it and refuse to visit it. Part of it feels like some Eastern European communist polytechnic institute, other parts feel like it's a scene from blade runner. Grabbing a book and reading it by the shelf is the last thing I want to do. It's a weird building with a weird vibe designed to be anything but a library. I honestly don't like this trend of architecting 'interesting' buildings which serve little use to its intended purpose. Turns out I wasn't the only one thinking this: https://www.seattlepi.com/ae/article/On-Architecture-How-the-new-Central-Library-1232303.php https://www.seattlepi.com/ae/article/On-Architecture-How-the...

davepeck 7y ago
I have a lot of friends who are in your camp. Me? I love the Seattle Central library and have found some happy nooks where I can comfortably read for hours. By far my most favorite part of the library is level 8: endless sheet music and a couple of piano practice rooms nearby.

deanclatworthy 7y ago

Agree. I’ve spent a fair amount of time there the last couple of weeks. It’s full of tourists (both from outside Helsinki and outside of Finland) gawking around and taking photos and selfies. It’s noisy as there is no protocol for that as it’s a “public space”. So what is it? A nice looking building with hardly any books, a few gimmicks and two cafes. On the surface it fits the bill for all the modern awards it’s bound to get and it fits the narrative that libraries are for public space rather than renting books, but spend some time there. It’s not practical to get books from as there are hardly any books, it’s not practical to study as there is only one tiny reading room. I urge anyone reading this article to spend more than 15m wandering around in there.

polemic 7y ago
I've spent some time working and using the space there and my impression was very different. Kids (and adults) using the games rooms, lots of interesting projects going on at the 3D printers, sewing machines and graphics computers, heaps of people working in various nooks, there were a few small concerts, family's enjoying the kids area. It is undeniably a beautiful building, but it also felt like a community space that was servicing it's visitors exceptionally well.

jdietrich 7y ago

>it’s absolutely useless if you want to go and browse some shelves and borrow some books Libraries cannot survive by catering to a smaller and smaller subset of people who are habituated to using a mostly obsolete technology. On a cost-per-loan basis, most libraries would save money by closing their doors forever and simply buying books from Amazon whenever someone asks for one. Local governments look at the lending data and quite rightly wonder whether the money could be better spent on a thousand other things. To secure their future, libraries are becoming a sort of egalitarian third space. They provide internet access for people who don't have it and training for people who have been left behind by technology. They provide a place to relax and socialise for people who can't afford a $4 coffee. They provide a venue for community events. They provide young people with opportunities to engage in the kind of self-guided learning that actually matters today.