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> Last year, a Chinese national who was a research professor at Kansas State University was arrested and sentenced to 10 years in federal prison for stealing va

> Last year, a Chinese national who was a research professor at Kansas State University was arrested and sentenced to 10 years in federal prison for stealing valuable American rice seeds — a trade secret — that can be used to treat gastrointestinal disease, antibiotic-associated diarrhea, hepatic disease, osteoporosis and inflammatory bowel disease. Wait, who are the bad guys here?

sjroot 7y ago
Well, it was theft by someone who was in a trusted position. That part is rather cut and dry.
shagie 7y ago
That is a different individual... and the story described https://www.kansascity.com/news/state/kansas/article208009774.html https://www.kansascity.com/news/state/kansas/article20800977... > Zhang, a lawful permanent resident in the U.S., was a rice researcher at Kansas State University and received a doctorate in rice genetics from Louisiana State University. He began working for Ventria in 2008 and was in charge of plant breeding and nursery operations. > In 2012, Zhang and a co-defendant traveled to visit a crop research institute in China where Zhang once worked. The following year, the two made arrangements for a delegation from the Chinese institute to visit Kansas. > ... > Ventria invested about $75 million to develop this proprietary technology and is the only company in the U.S. that has it. The lab maintains seed banks in a climate-controlled environment. Only six employees had access to the storage area. Zhang was one of them. ---- The story here is: > “Tao is alleged to have defrauded the US government by unlawfully receiving federal grant money at the same time that he was employed and paid by a Chinese research university — a fact that he hid from his university and federal agencies,” Assistant Attorney General John Demers said in a statement. “Any potential conflicts of commitment by a researcher must be disclosed as required by law and university policies.” > The Kansas Board of Regents requires faculty and staff of its universities to file a conflict of interest report when they are hired and every year afterward for as long as they are employed. > According to court documents, Tao “knowingly and intentionally submitted to the University false statements concerning his lack of a conflict of interest.” > The indictment alleges that Tao “fraudulently received” more than $37,000 in salary paid for by the Department of Energy and the National Science Foundation.
- close04 7y ago
  I imagine OPs point was that someone was arrested for stealing trade secrets that could save/improve lives of (hundreds of) millions of people. Just the other day in another part of HN there was a discussion about the collecting and continued use the HeLa cell line for research and (a lot of) profit. If you look this up the conclusion of every discussion tends to be "end justify the means in this case", "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few", etc. One has to wonder about the double standard here.
  - i_am_proteus 7y ago
    Ironically, if society adopts a viewpoint that blesses industrial espionage/IP theft of any technology which "improves lives," companies lose motivation to develop those same technologies. The ability to profit off of innovation is necessary to pay for facilities, equipment, and researchers.
    - mcny 7y ago
      > Ironically, if society adopts a viewpoint that blesses industrial espionage/IP theft of any technology which "improves lives," companies lose motivation to develop those same technologies. > The ability to profit off of innovation is necessary to pay for facilities, equipment, and researchers. I'm sorry but lets not talk about incentives until the CEO and the entire board at Boeing, Equifax, and Wells Fargo are in prison. Our "justice" system openly pursues "viable" cases which means we only send people to prison who we think we can convict because we have "limited resources". Lets not try to defend the prosecutors here by rationalizing what they do. I won't vilify them either because they are just doing what WE incentivized them to do but I won't throw any accolades their way either.
      - tracker1 7y ago
        I'd be satisfied if the CEO, senior management and board members had to turn over all profits including stock options granted for the period of abuse. That would be more impressive to me than jail time and seriously discourage similar behavior.
Causality1 7y ago
The guy who stole an invention that cost tens of millions of dollars to develop, to say nothing of its actual market value.
gingabriska 7y ago
I think you mean that stealing a cure to some disses isn't bad?
NicoJuicy 7y ago
The guy that destroyed millions of research dollars and made it useless to sell obviously. Innovation should always reap rewards, it's all dependant on how the owner wants it rewarded. Some could share it as "open-source" if it was code, but at the end of the day. It's their choice, not from the thief.
- baybal2 7y ago
  > The guy that destroyed millions of research dollars :) How? Want explain how that works? Elaborate your viewpoint
  - malandrew 7y ago
    Numbers made up to illustrate a point: Company invests $75 million. Gross revenues of $150 million. Net profit $75 million. Companies exist in perpetuity, so that net profit gets reinvested in new research to develop more advances. Alternate scenario: Company invests $75 million. IP stolen and company recoups $0. Company goes out of business and a successful research organization that took years to build is destroyed.
    - baybal2 7y ago
      But wait, how is the company getting "destroyed" if nothing really happens to it?
      - malandrew 7y ago
        Where does the money come from for continued operations?
        baybal2 7y ago
        Well, it doesn't in that scenario, but also in god knows how many others. You can equally well blame competitors for "criminally" driving you out of business. Is driving a company out of business be now a crime for anybody else?

sjroot 7y ago

Well, it was theft by someone who was in a trusted position. That part is rather cut and dry.

shagie 7y ago

That is a different individual... and the story described https://www.kansascity.com/news/state/kansas/article208009774.html https://www.kansascity.com/news/state/kansas/article20800977... > Zhang, a lawful permanent resident in the U.S., was a rice researcher at Kansas State University and received a doctorate in rice genetics from Louisiana State University. He began working for Ventria in 2008 and was in charge of plant breeding and nursery operations. > In 2012, Zhang and a co-defendant traveled to visit a crop research institute in China where Zhang once worked. The following year, the two made arrangements for a delegation from the Chinese institute to visit Kansas. > ... > Ventria invested about $75 million to develop this proprietary technology and is the only company in the U.S. that has it. The lab maintains seed banks in a climate-controlled environment. Only six employees had access to the storage area. Zhang was one of them. ---- The story here is: > “Tao is alleged to have defrauded the US government by unlawfully receiving federal grant money at the same time that he was employed and paid by a Chinese research university — a fact that he hid from his university and federal agencies,” Assistant Attorney General John Demers said in a statement. “Any potential conflicts of commitment by a researcher must be disclosed as required by law and university policies.” > The Kansas Board of Regents requires faculty and staff of its universities to file a conflict of interest report when they are hired and every year afterward for as long as they are employed. > According to court documents, Tao “knowingly and intentionally submitted to the University false statements concerning his lack of a conflict of interest.” > The indictment alleges that Tao “fraudulently received” more than $37,000 in salary paid for by the Department of Energy and the National Science Foundation.

close04 7y ago
I imagine OPs point was that someone was arrested for stealing trade secrets that could save/improve lives of (hundreds of) millions of people. Just the other day in another part of HN there was a discussion about the collecting and continued use the HeLa cell line for research and (a lot of) profit. If you look this up the conclusion of every discussion tends to be "end justify the means in this case", "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few", etc. One has to wonder about the double standard here.
- i_am_proteus 7y ago
  Ironically, if society adopts a viewpoint that blesses industrial espionage/IP theft of any technology which "improves lives," companies lose motivation to develop those same technologies. The ability to profit off of innovation is necessary to pay for facilities, equipment, and researchers.
  - mcny 7y ago
    > Ironically, if society adopts a viewpoint that blesses industrial espionage/IP theft of any technology which "improves lives," companies lose motivation to develop those same technologies. > The ability to profit off of innovation is necessary to pay for facilities, equipment, and researchers. I'm sorry but lets not talk about incentives until the CEO and the entire board at Boeing, Equifax, and Wells Fargo are in prison. Our "justice" system openly pursues "viable" cases which means we only send people to prison who we think we can convict because we have "limited resources". Lets not try to defend the prosecutors here by rationalizing what they do. I won't vilify them either because they are just doing what WE incentivized them to do but I won't throw any accolades their way either.
    - tracker1 7y ago
      I'd be satisfied if the CEO, senior management and board members had to turn over all profits including stock options granted for the period of abuse. That would be more impressive to me than jail time and seriously discourage similar behavior.

Causality1 7y ago

The guy who stole an invention that cost tens of millions of dollars to develop, to say nothing of its actual market value.

gingabriska 7y ago

I think you mean that stealing a cure to some disses isn't bad?

NicoJuicy 7y ago

The guy that destroyed millions of research dollars and made it useless to sell obviously. Innovation should always reap rewards, it's all dependant on how the owner wants it rewarded. Some could share it as "open-source" if it was code, but at the end of the day. It's their choice, not from the thief.

baybal2 7y ago
> The guy that destroyed millions of research dollars :) How? Want explain how that works? Elaborate your viewpoint
- malandrew 7y ago
  Numbers made up to illustrate a point: Company invests $75 million. Gross revenues of $150 million. Net profit $75 million. Companies exist in perpetuity, so that net profit gets reinvested in new research to develop more advances. Alternate scenario: Company invests $75 million. IP stolen and company recoups $0. Company goes out of business and a successful research organization that took years to build is destroyed.
  - baybal2 7y ago
    But wait, how is the company getting "destroyed" if nothing really happens to it?
    - malandrew 7y ago
      Where does the money come from for continued operations?
      - baybal2 7y ago
        Well, it doesn't in that scenario, but also in god knows how many others. You can equally well blame competitors for "criminally" driving you out of business. Is driving a company out of business be now a crime for anybody else?