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Have you heard about how much worse paper straws are to the environment than plastic? What about that Africa is the leader in pollution into the oceans . It's

Have you heard about how much worse paper straws are to the environment than plastic? What about that Africa is the leader in pollution into the oceans . It's amazing how much disinformation is out there regarding plastic and the source.

DanBC 7y ago
> What about that Africa is the leader in pollution into the oceans . Please can you support this with a cite, because I think you've misunderstood what you've read. Plastic in the ocean comes from roughly 3 sources. 1) Microfibres in clothing. It's likely that the West dumps significantly more of these into the environment because of greater numbers of plastic clothing and increased amounts of washing of those clothes. 2) industrial equipment, mostly lost fishing nets. I haven't seen anything that says these nets are disproportionately from African boats. 3) plastics from sewage systems, and plastics washed from land into rivers and thus into the ocean. It's this last one that I think you're talking about. But it's important to realise that 1) many of these rivers aren't in Africa, but in Asia and 2) most of that plastic was exported from the West to Asia.
- Retric 7y ago
  1] Microfibres in clothing was tested upstream of sewage treatment. Sewage treatment plants and septic fields both remove solids from wastewater. It’s only in areas without either that all of these micro plastics can reach the ocean. 2) Fishing nets are a common issue, but make a low percentage of micro plastic waste to reach the ocean. (Though they are a significant percentage of all plastic in the ocean.) 3) This is the main issue, but anti littering laws and sewage treatment make a huge difference in output. This means South America, Indonesia, and yes Africa are disproportionately causing micro plastic pollution.
  - DanBC 7y ago
    Sewage farms do not remove all microplastics. https://wwtonline.co.uk/features/microplastics-plastics-plastics-everywhere https://wwtonline.co.uk/features/microplastics-plastics-plas... > Domestic and commercial wastewater is certainly a major route for microplastics entering the environment – but by no means the exclusive one. When comparing the samples upstream of the wastewater treatment plants with those downstream, the Leeds study found that all of the plants were linked to an increase in microplastics in the rivers – on average up to three times higher, but in one instance by a factor of 69. The large volume means that even reducing 95% of all microplastic will still be releasing large numbers of microplastic. And because it's a waste water treatment plant these microplastics are going to be heavily contaminated with bioavailable pollutants -- these are higher risk microplastics. We currently don't know how well wastewater treatment plants remove microplastics. We do know that some of them will be releasing hundreds of microplastics per cubic metre.
    - Retric 7y ago
      I did not say they removed all of the micro plastics. I said, without them all would be released. > even reducing 95% of all microplastic Yea, no scale matters. Micro plastics where only detected on the world’s oceans in 2004, they are an issue but far from the most critical one facing the world’s oceans. > We currently don’t know how well wastewater treatment Sure, but this is still a massive issue with the study. If they are say 50% vs 99.9% effective that’s a big deal.
- sieabahlpark 7y ago
  It's primarily from rivers that run through Asia and Africa. https://www.acsh.org/news/2018/07/26/asia-africa-cause-90-plastic-pollution-worlds-oceans-13233 https://www.acsh.org/news/2018/07/26/asia-africa-cause-90-pl...
thelittleone 7y ago
Come see the once pristine beaches of Bali during wet season. Plastic is a huge environmental problem (one of many).
minitech 7y ago
Who mentioned straws?
lordnacho 7y ago
> Have you heard about how much worse paper straws are to the environment than plastic? I'd like to read more about that, have you got a link? Full disclosure: I hate paper straws, they turn into mush too fast and kids can't deal with them at all.
- stevekemp 7y ago
  Apparently the material they're made of makes them too hard to recycle. https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49234054 https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49234054
baxtr 7y ago
Great example of Whataboutism
- sieabahlpark 7y ago
  I can see what you're on about but the issue is we're banning plastics in favor for something that's even worse. We'd be better off using plastic than paper. I'm not disagreeing there is a problem but our solutions are pretty bad.

DanBC 7y ago

> What about that Africa is the leader in pollution into the oceans . Please can you support this with a cite, because I think you've misunderstood what you've read. Plastic in the ocean comes from roughly 3 sources. 1) Microfibres in clothing. It's likely that the West dumps significantly more of these into the environment because of greater numbers of plastic clothing and increased amounts of washing of those clothes. 2) industrial equipment, mostly lost fishing nets. I haven't seen anything that says these nets are disproportionately from African boats. 3) plastics from sewage systems, and plastics washed from land into rivers and thus into the ocean. It's this last one that I think you're talking about. But it's important to realise that 1) many of these rivers aren't in Africa, but in Asia and 2) most of that plastic was exported from the West to Asia.

Retric 7y ago
1] Microfibres in clothing was tested upstream of sewage treatment. Sewage treatment plants and septic fields both remove solids from wastewater. It’s only in areas without either that all of these micro plastics can reach the ocean. 2) Fishing nets are a common issue, but make a low percentage of micro plastic waste to reach the ocean. (Though they are a significant percentage of all plastic in the ocean.) 3) This is the main issue, but anti littering laws and sewage treatment make a huge difference in output. This means South America, Indonesia, and yes Africa are disproportionately causing micro plastic pollution.
- DanBC 7y ago
  Sewage farms do not remove all microplastics. https://wwtonline.co.uk/features/microplastics-plastics-plastics-everywhere https://wwtonline.co.uk/features/microplastics-plastics-plas... > Domestic and commercial wastewater is certainly a major route for microplastics entering the environment – but by no means the exclusive one. When comparing the samples upstream of the wastewater treatment plants with those downstream, the Leeds study found that all of the plants were linked to an increase in microplastics in the rivers – on average up to three times higher, but in one instance by a factor of 69. The large volume means that even reducing 95% of all microplastic will still be releasing large numbers of microplastic. And because it's a waste water treatment plant these microplastics are going to be heavily contaminated with bioavailable pollutants -- these are higher risk microplastics. We currently don't know how well wastewater treatment plants remove microplastics. We do know that some of them will be releasing hundreds of microplastics per cubic metre.
  - Retric 7y ago
    I did not say they removed all of the micro plastics. I said, without them all would be released. > even reducing 95% of all microplastic Yea, no scale matters. Micro plastics where only detected on the world’s oceans in 2004, they are an issue but far from the most critical one facing the world’s oceans. > We currently don’t know how well wastewater treatment Sure, but this is still a massive issue with the study. If they are say 50% vs 99.9% effective that’s a big deal.
sieabahlpark 7y ago
It's primarily from rivers that run through Asia and Africa. https://www.acsh.org/news/2018/07/26/asia-africa-cause-90-plastic-pollution-worlds-oceans-13233 https://www.acsh.org/news/2018/07/26/asia-africa-cause-90-pl...

thelittleone 7y ago

Come see the once pristine beaches of Bali during wet season. Plastic is a huge environmental problem (one of many).

minitech 7y ago

Who mentioned straws?

lordnacho 7y ago

> Have you heard about how much worse paper straws are to the environment than plastic? I'd like to read more about that, have you got a link? Full disclosure: I hate paper straws, they turn into mush too fast and kids can't deal with them at all.

stevekemp 7y ago
Apparently the material they're made of makes them too hard to recycle. https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49234054 https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49234054

baxtr 7y ago

Great example of Whataboutism

sieabahlpark 7y ago
I can see what you're on about but the issue is we're banning plastics in favor for something that's even worse. We'd be better off using plastic than paper. I'm not disagreeing there is a problem but our solutions are pretty bad.