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Governments are slowly starting to take single use plastic seriously. A good list of government actions varying from Countries to cities is here: https://www.na

Governments are slowly starting to take single use plastic seriously. A good list of government actions varying from Countries to cities is here: https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/2018/07/ocean-plastic-pollution-solutions/ https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/2018/07/ocean... Private industry as well like Coke is going to put water into cans under the Dasani brand. It's not everything but it's a major step in reducing the waste caused my plastic. But plastic is in other products as well like toys, electronics, etc... Individuals must be aware of this and need to make better choices or else this problem will just continue. I am hopeful we can take collective action to clean up the environment and live sustainably.

DataWorker 7y ago
I never realized The coca-cola company was so motivated by environmental concerns they’d stick their neck out like that. I guess it’s like the old chevron commercials, “people do”!
- givinguflac 7y ago
  Don’t be misled, Coca Cola doesn’t give a shit about the environment. They’re just trying to stay in mindshare and ensure they aren’t disrupted if plastic backlash really takes off.
melling 7y ago
Yesterday someone on HN said there’s still plastic inside the cans. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20691864 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20691864
- hanniabu 7y ago
  Correct, but it's an extremely thin coating, and when they can gets recycled it's taken care of along with that (likely burnt up in the melting process).
  - guelo 7y ago
    Except for the micro plastics that you end up drinking. EDIT for the down voters: aluminum cans have been identified as the main source of BPA in the human population.
    - hanniabu 7y ago
      Well, according to this article we're likely interesting and inhaling plenty regardless
    - your-nanny 7y ago
      would you mind sourcing that info for me?
      - guelo 7y ago
        https://universityhealthnews.com/daily/nutrition/5-alarming-sources-of-bpa-exposure/ https://universityhealthnews.com/daily/nutrition/5-alarming-...
JulianMorrison 7y ago
I don't feel it's ever effective to put a problem like this on individuals. When it gets down to the level of buying at the gas station, your choices are plastic, plastic or plastic, or stay thirsty. Which is not an option. The answer has to be national, ideally global, and that means political.
- snowwindwaves 7y ago
  I have been carrying the same metal water bottle around with me since 2008. I fill it with water. I don’t buy water or other drinks in plastic bottles. I agree it’s not effective to expect people to do this, but it’s really easy for an individual to do.
  - hnick 7y ago
    I agree, it's common for school children here in Australia to bring their own water bottle, and I've kept up the habit as an adult. When I see people buying water in supermarkets it's mostly immigrants or tourists, based on overhead conversations and personal experience. I think a cultural change and education (like we did for littering, with a pretty great but not perfect outcome) is the better option. I've tried telling my foreign in-laws that the water here is some of the cleanest in the world, but they still buy their 24-pack from supermarket when they visit. Maybe one day we will convince them.
- esotericn 7y ago
  I ask the cashier or whoever to fill my water bottle and 99% of the time it's fine. This might not scale but eventually perhaps they'd just stick a tap outside or whatever. Or do it in the bathroom since potable water is fairly universal in the Western world. I don't expect others to do this because it seems there are huge numbers of irrationally squeamish individuals.
dcolkitt 7y ago
> Individuals must be aware of this and need to make better choices or else this problem will just continue. No they don't. At least not if they live in the developed world. Virtually all disposed of plastic in the US and Europe is sequestered in solid-waste landfills. Modern landfills leak virtually nothing to the outside environment. Virtually all environmental plastic contamination comes from third world countries in Asia or Africa. In particular China, Vietnam, the Philippines and Indonesia. Due to rampant corruption and lack of oversight these countries have gross mismanagement of their solid waste disposal. Plastic is completely fine to use. As long as it's properly disposed of, there's essentially zero environmental impact. If you live in a first world country, I can assure you that your plastic straw will absolutely not end up in a turtle's nose. The issue is that the international community needs to hold Asia and Africa accountable for not upholding global standards on ocean pollution. [1] https://www.dumpsters.com/blog/how-do-modern-landfills-work https://www.dumpsters.com/blog/how-do-modern-landfills-work [2] https://ourworldindata.org/plastic-pollution#mismanaged-plastic-waste https://ourworldindata.org/plastic-pollution#mismanaged-plas...
- sachdevap 7y ago
  Let's not get so high and mighty about developing countries having to take all the blame. Western countries do ship a lot of plastic waste to developing nations. [0] [0] https://www.businessinsider.com/southeast-asia-threaten-to-return-plastic-trash-to-west-2019-5 https://www.businessinsider.com/southeast-asia-threaten-to-r...
  - whamlastxmas 7y ago
    Under the guise of recycling, which is funny, because we're actually seeing environmental damage as a direct result of recycling when just throwing it away would place it safely in a US landfill
- martyvis 7y ago
  It seems at least one first world country is sending recycling waste to developing countries for supposed processing http://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-22/malaysia-flooded-with-plastic-waste-to-send-scrap-back/11136322 http://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-22/malaysia-flooded-with-...
CalRobert 7y ago
I believe the primary source was named as coatings from vehicles, boats, etc. This might be a "sure, reuse bags, but the garbage patch is mostly fishing gear" situation.
djsumdog 7y ago
> put water into cans People need to stop buying packaged water. Municipal water in developed countries is always cleaner than bottled water. There are very low standards for bottled water where as city water in the US, EU, Japan et. al. are tested constantly (in some cities; up to 400 times per month at various sites and sections). Bottled water is at 1000% markup compared city/water fountains. It is also almost always tap water. It's a plight on the world in plastic/oil waste and people need to stop buying it. Putting it in cans will not make it better, and countries without clean water need heavily to invest in better domestic clean water infrastructure. It should be the highest priority of ever low income country to provide this most basic need to its people. The documentaries Blue Gold and Tapped go into the issues with the private and bottled water industries.
- esotericn 7y ago
  It's so weird that this just sort of happened. I don't think it was even 15 years ago that bottled water was like, a non-thing. It might sort of be in shops but people would laugh at it. It's one of those collective action problems whereby I'd happily pay ten quid a year or whatever stupidly low cost would be required to have some free fountains. Gah.
  - slavik81 7y ago
    Even 15 years ago, vending machines sold many different flavours of bottled water. As people became more health-concious, the sugar-free variety grew more popular. It's less mysterious when you consider the sales trends for bottled soft drinks vs bottled water. People are buying bottled water in situations where they used to buy bottled soda.
    - esotericn 7y ago
      It's still pretty mysterious to me. I can't really grok statistical trends - I need stories of individuals and why they felt, for example, at some moment in time, paying a dollar for a bottle of water felt like a reasonable thing to do over just like, asking someone to fill a bottle they probably had in their car. It's not even the pollution stuff, it's more like, you've just paid for a free resource. Wat? Bottled soda is completely different because it's a resource that isn't anywhere close to free.
SomeOldThrow 7y ago
> Individuals must be aware of this and need to make better choices or else this problem will just continue. Expecting individuals to do the right thing vs laziness is not a good bet. A better option would be to remove plastic supply, including slightly more durable goods, by any number of mechanisms.
osullip 7y ago
It is not just single use plastic. Micro plastics from washing clothes: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0269749117309387 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S026974911... "The number of microfibres released from a typical 5 kg wash load of polyester fabrics was estimated to be over 6,000,000 depending on the type of detergent used" A lot of study still needs to be done to determine the sources of micro plastics. We can all stop using single use carrier bags, but can we stop washing our $3 Target t-shirts made from poly-cotton?
- killerpopiller 7y ago
  to my knowledge, the lab managed to find the source of those plastic particles (around 15.0000/l). It is not what ones would expect, eg. from packages but plastic from tires, building material and paints and varnishes.
  - rypskar 7y ago
    Isn't that one of the reasons some brands are working on creating tires from dandelions?

DataWorker 7y ago

I never realized The coca-cola company was so motivated by environmental concerns they’d stick their neck out like that. I guess it’s like the old chevron commercials, “people do”!

givinguflac 7y ago
Don’t be misled, Coca Cola doesn’t give a shit about the environment. They’re just trying to stay in mindshare and ensure they aren’t disrupted if plastic backlash really takes off.

melling 7y ago

Yesterday someone on HN said there’s still plastic inside the cans. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20691864 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20691864

hanniabu 7y ago
Correct, but it's an extremely thin coating, and when they can gets recycled it's taken care of along with that (likely burnt up in the melting process).
- guelo 7y ago
  Except for the micro plastics that you end up drinking. EDIT for the down voters: aluminum cans have been identified as the main source of BPA in the human population.
  - hanniabu 7y ago
    Well, according to this article we're likely interesting and inhaling plenty regardless
  - your-nanny 7y ago
    would you mind sourcing that info for me?
    - guelo 7y ago
      https://universityhealthnews.com/daily/nutrition/5-alarming-sources-of-bpa-exposure/ https://universityhealthnews.com/daily/nutrition/5-alarming-...

JulianMorrison 7y ago

I don't feel it's ever effective to put a problem like this on individuals. When it gets down to the level of buying at the gas station, your choices are plastic, plastic or plastic, or stay thirsty. Which is not an option. The answer has to be national, ideally global, and that means political.

snowwindwaves 7y ago
I have been carrying the same metal water bottle around with me since 2008. I fill it with water. I don’t buy water or other drinks in plastic bottles. I agree it’s not effective to expect people to do this, but it’s really easy for an individual to do.
- hnick 7y ago
  I agree, it's common for school children here in Australia to bring their own water bottle, and I've kept up the habit as an adult. When I see people buying water in supermarkets it's mostly immigrants or tourists, based on overhead conversations and personal experience. I think a cultural change and education (like we did for littering, with a pretty great but not perfect outcome) is the better option. I've tried telling my foreign in-laws that the water here is some of the cleanest in the world, but they still buy their 24-pack from supermarket when they visit. Maybe one day we will convince them.
esotericn 7y ago
I ask the cashier or whoever to fill my water bottle and 99% of the time it's fine. This might not scale but eventually perhaps they'd just stick a tap outside or whatever. Or do it in the bathroom since potable water is fairly universal in the Western world. I don't expect others to do this because it seems there are huge numbers of irrationally squeamish individuals.

dcolkitt 7y ago

> Individuals must be aware of this and need to make better choices or else this problem will just continue. No they don't. At least not if they live in the developed world. Virtually all disposed of plastic in the US and Europe is sequestered in solid-waste landfills. Modern landfills leak virtually nothing to the outside environment. Virtually all environmental plastic contamination comes from third world countries in Asia or Africa. In particular China, Vietnam, the Philippines and Indonesia. Due to rampant corruption and lack of oversight these countries have gross mismanagement of their solid waste disposal. Plastic is completely fine to use. As long as it's properly disposed of, there's essentially zero environmental impact. If you live in a first world country, I can assure you that your plastic straw will absolutely not end up in a turtle's nose. The issue is that the international community needs to hold Asia and Africa accountable for not upholding global standards on ocean pollution. [1] https://www.dumpsters.com/blog/how-do-modern-landfills-work https://www.dumpsters.com/blog/how-do-modern-landfills-work [2] https://ourworldindata.org/plastic-pollution#mismanaged-plastic-waste https://ourworldindata.org/plastic-pollution#mismanaged-plas...

sachdevap 7y ago
Let's not get so high and mighty about developing countries having to take all the blame. Western countries do ship a lot of plastic waste to developing nations. [0] [0] https://www.businessinsider.com/southeast-asia-threaten-to-return-plastic-trash-to-west-2019-5 https://www.businessinsider.com/southeast-asia-threaten-to-r...
- whamlastxmas 7y ago
  Under the guise of recycling, which is funny, because we're actually seeing environmental damage as a direct result of recycling when just throwing it away would place it safely in a US landfill
martyvis 7y ago
It seems at least one first world country is sending recycling waste to developing countries for supposed processing http://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-22/malaysia-flooded-with-plastic-waste-to-send-scrap-back/11136322 http://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-22/malaysia-flooded-with-...

CalRobert 7y ago

I believe the primary source was named as coatings from vehicles, boats, etc. This might be a "sure, reuse bags, but the garbage patch is mostly fishing gear" situation.

djsumdog 7y ago

> put water into cans People need to stop buying packaged water. Municipal water in developed countries is always cleaner than bottled water. There are very low standards for bottled water where as city water in the US, EU, Japan et. al. are tested constantly (in some cities; up to 400 times per month at various sites and sections). Bottled water is at 1000% markup compared city/water fountains. It is also almost always tap water. It's a plight on the world in plastic/oil waste and people need to stop buying it. Putting it in cans will not make it better, and countries without clean water need heavily to invest in better domestic clean water infrastructure. It should be the highest priority of ever low income country to provide this most basic need to its people. The documentaries Blue Gold and Tapped go into the issues with the private and bottled water industries.

esotericn 7y ago
It's so weird that this just sort of happened. I don't think it was even 15 years ago that bottled water was like, a non-thing. It might sort of be in shops but people would laugh at it. It's one of those collective action problems whereby I'd happily pay ten quid a year or whatever stupidly low cost would be required to have some free fountains. Gah.
- slavik81 7y ago
  Even 15 years ago, vending machines sold many different flavours of bottled water. As people became more health-concious, the sugar-free variety grew more popular. It's less mysterious when you consider the sales trends for bottled soft drinks vs bottled water. People are buying bottled water in situations where they used to buy bottled soda.
  - esotericn 7y ago
    It's still pretty mysterious to me. I can't really grok statistical trends - I need stories of individuals and why they felt, for example, at some moment in time, paying a dollar for a bottle of water felt like a reasonable thing to do over just like, asking someone to fill a bottle they probably had in their car. It's not even the pollution stuff, it's more like, you've just paid for a free resource. Wat? Bottled soda is completely different because it's a resource that isn't anywhere close to free.

SomeOldThrow 7y ago

> Individuals must be aware of this and need to make better choices or else this problem will just continue. Expecting individuals to do the right thing vs laziness is not a good bet. A better option would be to remove plastic supply, including slightly more durable goods, by any number of mechanisms.

osullip 7y ago

It is not just single use plastic. Micro plastics from washing clothes: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0269749117309387 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S026974911... "The number of microfibres released from a typical 5 kg wash load of polyester fabrics was estimated to be over 6,000,000 depending on the type of detergent used" A lot of study still needs to be done to determine the sources of micro plastics. We can all stop using single use carrier bags, but can we stop washing our $3 Target t-shirts made from poly-cotton?

killerpopiller 7y ago
to my knowledge, the lab managed to find the source of those plastic particles (around 15.0000/l). It is not what ones would expect, eg. from packages but plastic from tires, building material and paints and varnishes.
- rypskar 7y ago
  Isn't that one of the reasons some brands are working on creating tires from dandelions?