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Which calls into question the whole idea that democracy even works and that people can actually think for themselves and aren't just controlled by whatever prop
by narrator 7y ago
Which calls into question the whole idea that democracy even works and that people can actually think for themselves and aren't just controlled by whatever propaganda happens to show up in front of their faces. I don't even argue politics with people any more because it's almost 100% what news sources they trust and find credible.
It's all just rumor and innuendo these days. Those news sources trust and find credible "anonymous sources" that say for example that Trump colluded with Russia or the Clintons are doing various unspeakable things and then you're arguing with these supposedly credible anonymous sources that each person reads and trusts. Since the sources are anonymous and nobody actually goes on the record, it's just a bunch of back and forth with no basis in facts except which news sources people trust and find authoritative.
- mattlutze 7y agoIt seems to illustrate our attenuation to story and the effect of dominant stories on our worldviews. I'd suggest it's less a challenge to democracy and more an affirmation of the criticality of a fact-based, unbiased 4th estate, and the scary effects of anyone with a comb-over and green screen being able to make their own "news" show.
- narrator 7y agoSo do the politicians in power only give out media licenses to news sources that feed from those "Anonymous Sources" that support their agenda? The problem is not who is allowed to report, it's that the mainstream news has started citing anonymous sources with ridiculous frequency and the credibility of those sources is never called into question because nobody knows who they are. When those anonymous sources turn out to be wrong, nobody cares and nobody's reputation is damaged for reporting totally made up stuff that's likely someone with an axe to grind's propaganda.
- merpnderp 7y agoThis is the actual problem. The news has no consequences for being wrong, no matter how outrageously or often.
- mattlutze 7y agoThe actual problem is people with no intention of journalistic integrity being given the same access and platform as people with that intention.
- mattlutze 7y ago10,000 Alex Jones, Ben Shapiro, Andy Ngo peddling conspiracy or ideology under the guise of journalism is not better. You’re right as well of course about anonymous sources being an issue, but your “politicians in power” comment is an unnecessary straw man to the conversation.
- DanielBMarkham 7y agoDemocracy (in the general sense) works just fine. It relies on groups of people of a certain geographic area physically getting out and interacting. Democracy isn't some guy living in his closet plugged into the web and making life choices based on AI-selected video streams. That's some kind of transhumanist nightmare. AI is an extinction-level threat to humanity, but when you say that, people think you're talking about Terminator robots laying waste to the landscape. The scenario this article talks about is much more realistic: hundreds of little stupid AIs tearing apart the inner workings of our humanity by giving us exactly what we want (but not what we need).
- drunkpotato 7y agoYour comment made me double-take by how succinct you put an ancient and profound sentiment. The ancient Greeks did not know about computers, but a horde of powerful yet incompetent demigods accidentally destroying humanity by helpfully giving us everything we ask for? I think they’d have no problem at all with that concept!
- BaronSamedi 7y agoVery interesting point about Democracy. It suggests that Democracy has a natural scale, for example a city or town of a certain size. The city-states of classical antiquity, the middle ages, and the renaissance seem to support this. Of course not all the city-states were democracies, still, I think your point about physicality and democracy is grossly under-appreciated today.
- Nasrudith 7y agoI must disagree about democracy - abstracted out it only relies upon distribution of power and dependencies. I keep on hearing AI claimed as an extinction level threat yet never has an actual mechanism been given - just a pile of tropes taken as dogma. Let alone the fact that if humanity does something stupid enough with basically anything it could be an extinction level threat. A comet and a sufficently large number reenacting Heavens Gate would be an extinction level threat with no inherent technology even communications. Mass adoption of plutonium codpieces/IUDs and deliberate refusal to recognize the effects of radiation poisoning for fear of effect on commerce or pride could be an extinction level event. AI won't save us from being a pile of complete idiots unless it is vastly superhuman but it cannot be blamed for death by stupidity.
- nradov 7y agoDemocracy was never intended to work. It's just better than the alternatives over the long run.
- PakG1 7y agoDepending on what happens in the next 6 years in all major democratic powers, I may or may not still agree with that sentiment. edit: 6 years isn't long enough to figure it out. Let's say a decade.
- pvaldes 7y agoDon't blame democracy for the sins of pseudodemocracy.
- ben_w 7y agoHow to you tell one from the other, especially when you’re inside one?
- pvaldes 7y agoLets see some examples Everybody is allowed to vote, as long as they are white: Felt like a real democracy but is a fake Everybody is allowed to vote, except women. Felt like "the best democracy" once upon a time, but is also fake. Not even a half democracy. Many of the things that today are normal could (and will) be deeply embarrasing in the future and so similar to a real democracy as a plastic imitation of a turd coated in glitter. A real democracy is difficult to find, but really easy to spot. Must fulfill this three rules: 1) One adult citizen, one vote 2) All citizens are equal and therefore all of their (legally issued) votes score the same. No votes can count double or x100. The only vote scoring less than other is the x0 blank vote. AND 3) everybody can apply for candidate if they desire so, and participate on an equal footing. If one of this three rules can't apply you have spotted a fake: Everybody can vote freely and is encouraged to vote, but there is only a party allowed to show... rule 3, you have found a dictatorship. If there is a group of people legally allowed to vote, that put a valid vote, but their votes are then zeroed and removed in postproduction then is the rule 2.
- ivanhoe 7y agoWorks for whom? You or the majority?