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It's an interesting question whether a person in his position has a right to commit suicide.
by 13of40 7y ago
It's an interesting question whether a person in his position has a right to commit suicide.
- hyperdunc 7y agoI don't think suicidal people much care about the legal or moral judgements of others. Unless you're talking about removing all means of suicide and forcefully keeping people alive.
- DanBC 7y ago> I don't think suicidal people much care about the legal or moral judgements of others. This is untrue. From what we can tell suicidal people care deeply about what other people think.
- reitzensteinm 7y agoDo you mean more deeply than the average person?
- Supermancho 7y agoMorally and legally? From what we can tell suicidal individuals often care "what other people think" in the vein of social acceptability. He ran with a crowd that flaunted a disregard for legality and moral compunction. In this case, I would not believe his suicidal attempt (not attempts) had any consideration for moral or legal ramification.
- lonelappde 7y agoWhich of his two attempts are you denying?
- liability 7y agoNo, not really, that doesn't seem like an interesting question at all. Can you convince me otherwise? It seems obvious to me that while a right to commit suicide might exist typically, somebody imprisoned is obviously not entitled to it. We restrict many rights when we imprison people, and I see no reason why the 'right to commit suicide' should not be one of them. Allowing such a man to kill himself denies his victims, some of whom may yet be unidentified, to opportunity to resolve the matter in a satisfactory way.
- close04 7y agoAll other concerns aside, this seems pretty unenforceable without going to some ridiculous extremes.
- liability 7y agoPreventing suicide is typically reasonably easy; suicide-proof smocks exist for this reason. Obviously you don't threaten a prisoner with criminal penalties for attempting suicide, that would be really stupid. Rather, you take measures to prevent the possibility.
- close04 7y agoIt's easy on relatively short term. But for anything long term wouldn't it become cruel and unusual punishment? Not to mention very expensive. With no obvious and immediate reason to do this the logistics and image of this would be a nightmare.
- gridlockd 7y ago> No, not really, that doesn't seem like an interesting question at all. You say that, yet you went through the trouble of writing a reply that ponders this exact question: At what point does suicide become morally acceptable? I do think it is an interesting question. I'd go the way of saying: If you still have serious responsibilities (as in this case), it is immoral. It's worth noting that suicide used to be a serious offense - or even a capital offense, ironically.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- liability 7y agoI can think of many situations in which suicide is morally acceptable. I'd be very critical of anybody who asserts otherwise, that would be a much more interesting conversation to have, if only because I think I could really lay into anybody who disagreed with me on that matter. Whether prisoners should be able too is less interesting, so far I've not seen a compelling argument for permitting it. It seems like a perversion of justice to allow it.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- 18pfsmt 7y agoI read through this whole despicable thread to find an interesting comment. I can't imagine having the mentality of taking advantage of other people to satisfy personal desires and the enabling of others to do the same. To your point, I don't think I would live very much longer than ~10 years in prison; it's unconscionable. It's also interesting in the context of this administration's allowing for the death penalty at the federal level, with some complaints about "cruel and unusual punishment" flying around as a result. Some religions argue suicide is a sin that sends one to eternal hell. Lots of interesting ideas surrounding this ugly chapter, the least of which is the conspiracy theories. Epstein was never a credible witness, and would not have talked anyway. There is an underlying theme of revenge (rather than justice) in some of these comments that makes me uncomfortable. We need to get his victims very good therapy so they can heal from their traumatic experiences.