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America has free markets and a decentralized, bottom-up system that results in entrepreneurs and private entities deciding how to allocate capital. There may be

America has free markets and a decentralized, bottom-up system that results in entrepreneurs and private entities deciding how to allocate capital. There may be temporary pain but wherever there is opportunity an entrepreneur will step in. China has zombie enterprises, their financial statements are lies, and cities built by bureaucratic maneuvering over market need. I will always bet on the American private sector over the government-run towers of lies.

Aperocky 7y ago
And of course all the product you bought that were made in China are lies, they don't exist at all. And obviously America will be able to make these products despite having about 0 unemployment, but hey, magic happens here amiright?
- Fjolsvith 7y ago
  > And obviously America will be able to make these products despite having about 0 unemployment That's what's called entrepreneurship. People will get rich making these products that are in sudden demand.
- viscanti 7y ago
  > obviously America will be able to make these products American entrepreneurship doesn't mean all the manufacturing would take place in America. Entrepreneurial people are already moving to build more manufacturing in other countries where labor is less expensive and more plentiful than America. I don't think anyone was arguing that America would manufacture everything they currently import from China.
  - assblaster 7y ago
    Even if the companies laterally move overseas manufacturing to other Asian countries, the end result is still China losing economic control over the United States. Can't those other countries start behaving like China? Sure, but doubtful it would go anywhere.
    - AstralStorm 7y ago
      And this happened instantaneously with a wave of magic wand and no costs, right? The cost to the USA would make the recent debt crisis look like a picnic.
- ethbro 7y ago
  There are lots of countries that are neither the US, China, or in Europe. If China decides it doesn't want to trade with the US, there are plenty of places that will. And honestly, China had already reached the limit of an export-based economy. Growing your national economy on labor arbitrage only works up to a certain level of per capita wealth.
- petre 7y ago
  Production is already moving to other places in SE Asia. Vietnam is one of the big winners. So I wouldn't worry too much. It would only make things more flexibile as moving production/capital out of a smaller country has less of an impact.
astrange 7y ago
America’s cities are based on zoning laws designed to do racism in 1900, and the rest is based on the federal highway system. Not very free market either way.
- Supermancho 7y ago
  > America’s cities are based on zoning laws These can and do change, with a single city council meeting. There's nothing impregnable about existing zoning. As usual, the dollar dictates the rules (having been party to 2! eminent domain proceedings in Southern California).
  - astrange 7y ago
    > As usual, the dollar dictates the rules People really seem to believe this, but it always takes them to wrong conclusions here. For instance, everyone thinks California esp. SF is expensive because of "rich developers" but it's not. It's expensive because armies of retired people come to city council meetings and shut down any development because it'll hurt their 60s nostalgia. Now, those people are acting to raise their own property values, but that's not why they're doing it. They genuinely just hate people taking their parking spots and think cell phone towers will give them cancer.
    - Supermancho 7y ago
      I believe it because it's demonstrably true. > It's expensive because armies of retired people come to city council meetings and shut down any development because it'll hurt their 60s nostalgia. Maybe in some areas, but in Southern California this is fantasy. (California) Brea's mall expansion forced eminent domain on founding neighborhoods for commercial development. That never came and was sold back to new developers for gentrification. I had a property that I was paid well for, but I did not want to sell. So I bought into Santa Ana. In 2009 The Irvine Company put out magazine that detailed the commercial expansion to the adjacent 2525 N. Main Street and eventually the Park Santiago neighborhood. That has been in progress for 2 years, after the necessary city council members were termed out of course. The NIMBYs there are of the aforementioned demographic, alongside their descendants. It's as ineffective. I have pre-emptively sold, but you can still attend the futile meetings if you like (https://park-santiago.com/ https://park-santiago.com/)

Aperocky 7y ago

And of course all the product you bought that were made in China are lies, they don't exist at all. And obviously America will be able to make these products despite having about 0 unemployment, but hey, magic happens here amiright?

Fjolsvith 7y ago
> And obviously America will be able to make these products despite having about 0 unemployment That's what's called entrepreneurship. People will get rich making these products that are in sudden demand.
viscanti 7y ago
> obviously America will be able to make these products American entrepreneurship doesn't mean all the manufacturing would take place in America. Entrepreneurial people are already moving to build more manufacturing in other countries where labor is less expensive and more plentiful than America. I don't think anyone was arguing that America would manufacture everything they currently import from China.
- assblaster 7y ago
  Even if the companies laterally move overseas manufacturing to other Asian countries, the end result is still China losing economic control over the United States. Can't those other countries start behaving like China? Sure, but doubtful it would go anywhere.
  - AstralStorm 7y ago
    And this happened instantaneously with a wave of magic wand and no costs, right? The cost to the USA would make the recent debt crisis look like a picnic.
ethbro 7y ago
There are lots of countries that are neither the US, China, or in Europe. If China decides it doesn't want to trade with the US, there are plenty of places that will. And honestly, China had already reached the limit of an export-based economy. Growing your national economy on labor arbitrage only works up to a certain level of per capita wealth.
petre 7y ago
Production is already moving to other places in SE Asia. Vietnam is one of the big winners. So I wouldn't worry too much. It would only make things more flexibile as moving production/capital out of a smaller country has less of an impact.

astrange 7y ago

America’s cities are based on zoning laws designed to do racism in 1900, and the rest is based on the federal highway system. Not very free market either way.

Supermancho 7y ago
> America’s cities are based on zoning laws These can and do change, with a single city council meeting. There's nothing impregnable about existing zoning. As usual, the dollar dictates the rules (having been party to 2! eminent domain proceedings in Southern California).
- astrange 7y ago
  > As usual, the dollar dictates the rules People really seem to believe this, but it always takes them to wrong conclusions here. For instance, everyone thinks California esp. SF is expensive because of "rich developers" but it's not. It's expensive because armies of retired people come to city council meetings and shut down any development because it'll hurt their 60s nostalgia. Now, those people are acting to raise their own property values, but that's not why they're doing it. They genuinely just hate people taking their parking spots and think cell phone towers will give them cancer.
  - Supermancho 7y ago
    I believe it because it's demonstrably true. > It's expensive because armies of retired people come to city council meetings and shut down any development because it'll hurt their 60s nostalgia. Maybe in some areas, but in Southern California this is fantasy. (California) Brea's mall expansion forced eminent domain on founding neighborhoods for commercial development. That never came and was sold back to new developers for gentrification. I had a property that I was paid well for, but I did not want to sell. So I bought into Santa Ana. In 2009 The Irvine Company put out magazine that detailed the commercial expansion to the adjacent 2525 N. Main Street and eventually the Park Santiago neighborhood. That has been in progress for 2 years, after the necessary city council members were termed out of course. The NIMBYs there are of the aforementioned demographic, alongside their descendants. It's as ineffective. I have pre-emptively sold, but you can still attend the futile meetings if you like (https://park-santiago.com/ https://park-santiago.com/)