4 ms·

Here's cable lacing visible on a Mars rover: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/39/MER-2_On_Lander_Prelaunch_PIA04849.jpg https://upload.wikimedi

Here's cable lacing visible on a Mars rover: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/39/MER-2_On_Lander_Prelaunch_PIA04849.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/39/MER-2_On...

walrus01 7y ago
And a whole lot of kapton tape.
- UI_at_80x24 7y ago
  Hence the origin of: Crap-Tonne
gotts 7y ago
I'm wondering if zip ties are used at all in a project like this one.
- mikestew 7y ago
  Leave plastic out in the sun, exposed to UV radiation: plastic degrades. Sub-zero temps? Plastic snaps. Snip the end, they leaves sharp edges. Zip ties are great for most conditions under which humans can survive. Now, NASA could have special "space zip ties" that are formulated to resist such conditions, but I would imagine they would bear little resemblance to the ones at Harbor Freight that comes in bags of 100 for $3.
  - _Microft 7y ago
    On top of that softeners in plastics can/will outgas in the low pressure environment and maybe contaminate nearby sensors or cause other unexpected things.
  - aidenn0 7y ago
    For those wondering, they do make zip ties out of PEEK[1] for high temperature ranges. They are rated up to mid 200s C for temperature and cost about $1-3 per tie. I noticed that all zip ties seem to be made out of thermoplastic polymers (most are nylon). I assume something about the manufacturing of them rules out thermoset polymers? Anyone on HN care to enlighten us? 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyether_ether_ketone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyether_ether_ketone
  - squarefoot 7y ago
    Probably not good for high temperatures or moisture, but I found cloth adhesive tape really handy, and it's gentle to the cables. Here's an example from a random Chinese seller I have absolutely no affilation with. Can be found by searching for "cloth adhesive tape". https://www.ebay.com/itm/143150416486 https://www.ebay.com/itm/143150416486
esaym 7y ago
Most everything in aviation still uses lacing (former aircraft mech). I think zip ties only started to be used (lightly) around the early 2000's.
- cardiffspaceman 7y ago
  My memory of being worried about whether a "tie-wrap gun" [1] would be flagged during x-ray of carry-ons at the airport goes back to the 80's. A tie-wrap gun is used to tighten zip ties. But that company also used followed some practice akin to combing the wires. [1] https://www.alliedelec.com/tools/tie-wrap-guns/ https://www.alliedelec.com/tools/tie-wrap-guns/
amelius 7y ago
Can't most of these wires be replaced by WiFi?
- Aloha 7y ago
  No, even if lacing was only used for network, wireless will likely never replace some sort of wired technology.
- nine_k 7y ago
  No; a lot of wires carry the actual power to the effector (e.g. a lam, or a motor, or a relay). WiFi, on top of being vastly more complex, has issues with electromagnetic noise, wave propagation problems, and thus delivery delays. And it needs a processor powerful enough to run all the logic with encryption on top, because you don't want strangers to talk to your devices. A length of copper is so much more reliable.

Here's cable lacing visible on a Mars rover: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/39/MER-2_On_Lander_Prelaunch_PIA04849.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/39/MER-2_On...

walrus01 7y ago

And a whole lot of kapton tape.

UI_at_80x24 7y ago
Hence the origin of: Crap-Tonne

gotts 7y ago

I'm wondering if zip ties are used at all in a project like this one.

mikestew 7y ago
Leave plastic out in the sun, exposed to UV radiation: plastic degrades. Sub-zero temps? Plastic snaps. Snip the end, they leaves sharp edges. Zip ties are great for most conditions under which humans can survive. Now, NASA could have special "space zip ties" that are formulated to resist such conditions, but I would imagine they would bear little resemblance to the ones at Harbor Freight that comes in bags of 100 for $3.
- _Microft 7y ago
  On top of that softeners in plastics can/will outgas in the low pressure environment and maybe contaminate nearby sensors or cause other unexpected things.
- aidenn0 7y ago
  For those wondering, they do make zip ties out of PEEK[1] for high temperature ranges. They are rated up to mid 200s C for temperature and cost about $1-3 per tie. I noticed that all zip ties seem to be made out of thermoplastic polymers (most are nylon). I assume something about the manufacturing of them rules out thermoset polymers? Anyone on HN care to enlighten us? 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyether_ether_ketone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyether_ether_ketone
- squarefoot 7y ago
  Probably not good for high temperatures or moisture, but I found cloth adhesive tape really handy, and it's gentle to the cables. Here's an example from a random Chinese seller I have absolutely no affilation with. Can be found by searching for "cloth adhesive tape". https://www.ebay.com/itm/143150416486 https://www.ebay.com/itm/143150416486

esaym 7y ago

Most everything in aviation still uses lacing (former aircraft mech). I think zip ties only started to be used (lightly) around the early 2000's.

cardiffspaceman 7y ago
My memory of being worried about whether a "tie-wrap gun" [1] would be flagged during x-ray of carry-ons at the airport goes back to the 80's. A tie-wrap gun is used to tighten zip ties. But that company also used followed some practice akin to combing the wires. [1] https://www.alliedelec.com/tools/tie-wrap-guns/ https://www.alliedelec.com/tools/tie-wrap-guns/

amelius 7y ago

Can't most of these wires be replaced by WiFi?

Aloha 7y ago
No, even if lacing was only used for network, wireless will likely never replace some sort of wired technology.
nine_k 7y ago
No; a lot of wires carry the actual power to the effector (e.g. a lam, or a motor, or a relay). WiFi, on top of being vastly more complex, has issues with electromagnetic noise, wave propagation problems, and thus delivery delays. And it needs a processor powerful enough to run all the logic with encryption on top, because you don't want strangers to talk to your devices. A length of copper is so much more reliable.